Strip clubs and lap dances

[Charlie9S]

I'll try and be succinct! My husband visited a strip club twice a couple of months apart. I found out after the second time when he came home at 6.30am and location and his phone notifications gave him away. He has spent nearly 1k that I know of at this strip club. Money that could have been for other important things. He is also not working now although we have a back up fund it is a lot to throw away. He is also tight with money (so all those people I see saying my partner wouldn't do it because he's tight with money, mmm you'd be surprised sadly!) Upon finding out I was very calm, yes my voice wobbling and I was clearly upset but I was calm I did not attack, I wanted clarity of what had gone on, I needed to know if there was a chance I had an STD as I had just had a test amongst my own health scare and I would rather he tell me than the doctor. He said there was no chance and I have tested negative. I calmly asked if he was looking for an out of our relationship, to think long and hard about it as he had clearly risked our marriage he said himself he thought it would hurt me, yet did it again and again. I was clear and gentle saying he knows I am open to talks about anything and he could have had a conversation with me about the boundaries for each other and any wants or needs not being met or wanting to try etc. I had only recently asked if he wanted to try anything new. The friend he went with has an open sort of marriage or they swing, I asked if that is something he wanted he said absolutely not. I never said anything with attack just calm and genuine. I said I just want to understand as best as I can and to be clear on our future, we already have some things that have got to me and I said I don't want to push and work on things when the result is the same just in a few years instead of now. My dad cheated on my mum many times and eventually after 20 years left and imploded our lives.
We spoke about his depression and anxiety and clarifying the pressure he puts on himself is not from me, he had a lot of pressure from his family when younger and work etc and has recently burnt out. I was supportive and positive. We moved forward and he has been generally very respectful and gently trying to make things better. I have been calm and moving forward and carrying on with our lives really as something to move on from. He is also no longer drinking.
However, I had my scans and although I have something it is not really scary or cancer so I am relieved. But almost since then my head is back to how did he do that, he risked our marriage, he spent hundreds on naked women on top of him, I feel like perhaps I just needed to keep moving and now I know I don't have cancer the anger is bubbling up. I know some men like going to strip clubs and he could have had a conversation with me. I just want to talk really and get my feelings out and over with really! But I don't feel I can tell anyone who knows us, and talking more to him keeps it dragging on and I know it isn't helpful to our relationship if I keep bringing it up. If I'm going to let it go then I need to do that. But I am going through in my head what was it really like, what did he get out of it, he jokes about me being old well now I feel like oh god I am old and he has been oggling 20 year olds. I thought we had reconnected, we have been intimate and I thought that would sort of help us move on but I still feel a bit stuck. Damage has been done and now whenever he annoys me a little I go back to that in my head. there are other things that needed improving anyway but this sort of took me to a point of maybe I've had enough.
Not sure what I'm after, do people feel lap dances are cheating, just something silly he screwed up he said he is very ashamed and I have made it clear I am not shaming him, just trying to understand. can anyone just be a friend to talk to just to get it off my chest so I can move forward. Whilst my dad was an idiot at times I remember him saying he'd rather mum didn't forgive him if it was always going to be something she had in a bag to pull out when she was angry. So I don't want to do that. Any advice and support to rebalance my brain?! x

Yes, I feel lap dances are a form of cheating.

And private dances even more so.

£1000 is a lot of private dances and one wonders what else depending on the club.

(Reports that clubs never allow Abc which will be quoted on here ad nauseum are contradicted by dancers themselves and sometimes loose lipped men who've been in them).

I think that a certain section of men - and of course strip club owners- are trying to do a Jedi mind trick on us ...that once you enter the walls of a lap dancing club, what would be cheating outside it; is now magically not cheating.

(Somehow the woman being a lap dancer and then paying money ....makes the contact/activity with other women that would in any other cases scenario be cheating; not cheating.
How very convenient).

Also I find men who do this would never be ok with their partner doing the equivalent - as either the stripper or the customer (with a male stripper).

Are you saying he spent money on this while not even working and bringing in a wage.... Even worse.

He also sounds like he pulled the ol' violin, bad childhood, mental health sob story out of the bag when challenged about it.

Boo boo, I had a tough. childhood, I'm stressed and depressed...I therefore need young woman to get the underwear off in front of me and rub their cunts on my genitals through my trousers ... I'm just so depressed and self destructive. Poor me, get me some leeway.

Hmm, depressed ppl usually have no sex drive.

It's cheating. I know different people have different rules within their relationships, but what he has done is unacceptable.
-A one off for a stag do with absolutely no private dances? Horrible but I got over it. (20 years + ago, when we didn't realise how many girls in the industry are trafficked.)
-Spending large amounts regularly and making you worry about STDs? LTB.

You're being more calm and understanding than he deserves, in my opinion. I feel I'm pretty laid back but blowing £1000 on at least two lapdances is unacceptable in a relationship. And the justifying it by saying you're old!! My goodness, what a charmer.
I'm not usually someone to say "leave the bastard" but I'd be tempted in your position. I just wouldn't see him in the same way. My DH has suffered with mental health problems but this has never led to him blowing out savings on paying naked women to rub themselves all over him (and God knows what else).

Why are you being so calm? How calm would he be if you gave a younger man 1k to strip for you and grind naked on your lap? He’d think that was absolutely fine would he?

This.

To me its cheating. I cannot see how it couldn't be. Just because he paid money it does not make it any less intimate and sexual with another woman outside his marriage. Plus lets not even get started what he must think of women.

And the icing on the cake would be that he knew you'd be upset by it.
But did it anyway.
He was prepared to risk causing you unimaginable emotional pain.

You do not have to 'get past it'. You do not have to keep trying not to bring it up.
He has fucked up in an epic way and if you want to bring it up everyday, rant at him, cry, ask questions, then you've every right to do that.

Personally, I couldn't get past it. I know I couldn't. I would replay every scenario in my head over and over every time I looked at him. I certainly could never be intimate with him. So I would leave, for the sake of my own sanity. And because I could not stay with a man who willingly risked causing me pain over a sexual thrill and keep any sense of my self esteem and dignity intact.

And being depressed or whatever he has come out with is an excuse, not a reason. Its a convenient excuse because the alternative would be to tell you the actual truth, which was he wanted to, and he considered it worth the risk to you and your entire life together.

I'm so sorry OP. It must be so totally devastating. And that's aside from the extortionate amount of money he spent.

Get as angry or upset at him as you want, and as often. He lost the right to even have an opinion on that. He does not get to dictate how angry, upset or broken he has made you feel.

This is just one step before prostitutes, he will have a taste for it and it sounds like you aren't thinking of leaving him over it so why would he stop. Spending money which could be needed if he doesn't get a job soon is also a very low blow as its dragging your family into a risky situation. When you are struggling to pay the bills, how will you feel about the fact he spent it on strippers then?

He is on meds for depression and they make a big difference to how he is. Drink is a problem and genuinely think he got bladdered as he often does when he goes out and was encouraged by the person he was with who's wife is fine with it, they swing or something. Like just enjoying no cares or responsibilities lets do whatever and he is a high earner so has plenty really (yes despite now neither of us is earning as I have been raising our 3 young children but looking to go back to work asap to have some income. we do have savings that will last us a while but still, not a time to throw money around either!)
Absolutely I feel mad on many levels, since quitting work he has had several nights out with his friends, good, good for his mental wellbeing - I haven't met up with a friend on my own without kids probably since I had them! I think he was paying for both him and his mate, and his mate was probably doing the same so god knows how much was really spent between them.
He said he's absolutely disgusted with himself and yes self destructive. I didn't pander to "I'm a bad husband" I said no I'm not having comments like that when I say no you're not etc that's not happening. He was very tearful, was a bit sick and desperately wanted to cuddle me but I didn't want to be touched. I did eventually as more of a hold while he let his feelings out and then suggested we get some fresh air and walk the dog. He admitted he would never have told me as he didn't want to hurt me, but as it was the second time doing it I do question would he do it again and again for as long as he got away with it? He has not had a single drink since.
He didn't have a bad childhood he generally had a very good one, but enormous pressure on him inadvertently, very competitive family, I can see the harm of his upbringing despite the good intentions of his parents. His own character is to be the best and will work very hard at work and long hours etc. He is a hard worker for sure and I can understand he's coming out from burn out and has some mental health work to do, a family trauma also happened years ago which he never really had space to properly come to terms with, he is getting counselling etc now. I did not see the point of attack and shaming him, I just wanted clarity really. Maybe it's the way my mind works, I'm quite good in a crisis, what is the next step instead of panicking. Other times I am a very emotional person but when I need to be I can step away and be objective.
Anyway just wanted to clarify some points. It is hard to hear others say it is cheating. I think my head was more concerned with my own health and now it's coming out more. Maybe I helped him deal with his feelings instead of my own a bit too much.

I think when it comes to cheating there’s a difference between a mass visit to a lap club on a stag do.. getting pulled along by your peers, just a stag do thing etc… and going several times, spending a grand, with a mate who has an open marriage.

Even if he didn’t pay for sex or a happy ending or whatever, I think it would be hard to view this as not cheating, because for that money I am pretty sure he’s getting private dances.

So yeah, cheating.

But my question is why on earth do you feel you have to be calm and gentle?! He’s spent money you don’t have, on sexual services, and he did it more than once, even though he knew it would upset you.

I would allow yourself to get angry and bollock him from a height. Because only by feeling your feelings are you going to know how you feel about this and what you want to do.

You are his partner not his mum. This needs to work for you just as much as him.

Op, you can separate with anyone at any time for any reason. You don't need anyone's encouragement or permission.

But fwiw I'd have the serious ick after that and couldn't go back. Couple of hours in a strip club in a stag do for example fair enough but being unemployed and spending 1k on private dances is beyond pathetic and repulsive behaviour.

I'll add it's not him dictating it but rather me and the way I am trying to cope with it. I also don't want it turned on to me if I say something hurtful, I wanted to try and have a very level head. and understand all sides . He very much wanted to be screamed at and suggested he move into the spare room, has been very cautious of how he is with me etc. Has been trying really hard. There were other things I had reached a point with and I talked about that too. In my head I had checked out to be honest. Planning how we will manage the split and minimal disruption to our children, business head on I suppose. People do make mistakes and I am trying to give him a chance on several levels. I am also totally shocked as this is something I wouldn't expect at all from him. So that has rocked how I see him. He would take the anger, it is me holding it back I guess for fear perhaps it is the final straw or because of my parents history. Also with children around all the time I can't get upset life keeps moving because you're so busy with the kids!

I think you gut is telling you this isn't right, that's why you can't forgive or forget.

I could forgive going to one but not spending £1k, it begs the question of what went on. I worry you're feeling into the same pattern as your mum did. You deserve better.

I never understood why my mum stayed. She still would take him back now! She did want to leave the first time she was young and had a 1 year old and his parents convinced her to forgive him. They meant well they loved my mum they very much were like her parents as she had shite ones. Then the next time I don't know she fought to keep him instead, and the final one he left the house and she knew nothing about it. Left me to pick up the pieces. His parents had passed away by this point.
If my husband had had sex I'd be gone. And you're all probably right I am probably fearful if we talk again what is my plan, am I out? That's a massive massive decision. 3 beautiful children. I do deserve better and to be happy and loved. And I find myself wanting to make sure I am confident and secure to potentially move on myself. I think not feeling able to talk to anyone about it has kept it bottled up, and I kinda thought I had cancer and that was the bigger fish to focus on.

He admitted he would never have told me as he didn't want to hurt me,

So he reasons you knowing about it is the thing which would hurt you then.
So as long as you don't know, you won't be hurt, right? So nice of him to try to spare your feelings.

What else hasn't he told you about because it would hurt you?

His thinking and reasoning is somewhat warped i'd say. Perhaps not do the thing that would hurt you in the first place? At the very least not do it again! I'll bet it was more than twice. He has has to admit what he did because you found out. He'll be admitting to the absolute bare minimum.

He has already told you he won't tell you things that he does, so he doesn't 'hurt' you.
Who the hell does he think he is? He is basically telling you he will take away any choice you have in the matter to be with someone who cheats by simply not allowing you to know about it.

HE has decided not to allow you to make that decision.

HE has decided to make that decision for you because if he doesn't want to risk you choosing to leave him.

He wasn't protecting you, OP. He was protecting himself.

And now you know, and have a choice in the matter, he is throwing in the depression card. Making sure you know it wasn't his fault at all. It was the depression, the drink, the friend making him do those things. Of course he is full of self loathing. He has been caught. Its probably more embarrassment that you've caught him out, than self disgust. If he was so disgusted with himself, why go back and do it again (and again, and again, and again?)

I'm sorry to say, based on that one statement, he has told you who he is. There will be so much more you are blissfully unaware of.

Op, you sound absolutely lovely. And so level headed and trying to make sense of it all.
And I'm so glad your cancer scare was clear. Did he know those tests may have shown cancer? Did he visit those clubs even knowing you were going through this?

You need time to process everything and don't feel bad wanting to bring it up with him as and when you need to.
Handle it however works best for you.

I've always thought, because men are quite often possessive, a better analogy is his wife taking her clothes off and gyrating. As I used to say to DH (his friends are pigs) 'there's a fair few men who'd like to see my breasts. Would everyone be OK with me oiling up and showing them for money?' Going to a club specifically for turning men on? Of course they bloody wouldn't.

And OP, it is cheating. Spaffing 1k up the wall doesn't make it better, as the first poster says, it makes it worse. Money doesn't remove the cheating, it just means the woman wasn't enjoying it, not the man.

OP you are too good for him.
spending £1000 plus on …… ?

Stop excusing his gross acts of deception

I replied with exactly what you are saying. To be fair he rarely went anywhere or had opportunity before. But maybe there could be the odd skeletons. I opened his accounts from the notification on his phone and searched for back to when he went out last time with this person and saw he had been then too. He is a bright man and could see I knew so did not try and excuse it and never asked how I knew. I am not sure it's something to throw away a marriage over and blow up a family if it really is more of a total fuck up on his part that won't happen again. Mental health has suffered and he knows he needs to work on that too I cannot do it for him no matter how supportive I can be. He has been trying to make positive changes. I think I got triggered yesterday because he said he was deleting a game on his phone because he constantly plays it ( I said he needs to be more present with his family) and yesterday he was back playing it. Quickly putting it away and engaging with me but it was like change doesn't last long what else might he do in time, and yes I seemed pretty gentle on him I guess although very clear about a possible separation I was just very mindful and in control of my emotions I guess. I do wonder if I wasn't worrying about cancer if I would have kept talking to him and got more angry. Yes he knew I was waiting for tests to rule out cancer when he went the second time. What's mad is I was asking if it takes a long time on the nhs can we pay £110 for a private scan so I get some answers quicker. It's a bit painful thinking I didn't want to waste £100 if it was nothing to worry about. I had the scan I certainly didn't worry about paying for it.

There are obviously good things and all relationships have bumps I guess I don't necessarily want to make people angry with him but need to let my own feelings out more. I did speak with him at length and it's important I talk to him, I just feel like when you think it's all okay for someone to bring something back it can feel a bit like you can't relax, is this issue over or not. I don't want to be that person who brings it up again and again and he can't settle either not knowing which way it's going to go. Perhaps it's just it does need talking through again. I didn't want to keep talking before. It was my decision to get out and stop or we go in circles whilst he might deserve it I don't want to cause pain to him either. Not if I lose my control and say something hurtful I just didn't want that.
Thank you it's good to get my feelings out and see how others would also feel and see it. I know some wouldn't mind at all apparently.

Stop making excuses for his mental health. He’s not working and spent £1000 on strippers, he needs to get a grip of himself.

Going into a lap dancing club isn’t a sackable offence to me (although I wouldn’t be happy) but the private dances are a step too far.

I’m sorry he did this OP and I’m glad your results are clear from cancer.

Agree with PP I’d have major ick. Plus I doubt it was just dances at £1000. Plus agree with PP this will lead to using escorts if he didn’t already.

Don’t be tempted to blame his ‘bad influence’ friend. Your DH chose to spend money on strippers like some revolting playboy, more than once, so getting quite the taste for it, including when you are worried about possible cancer.

Good luck with your decision. 💐

"Whilst my dad was an idiot at times I remember him saying he'd rather mum didn't forgive him if it was always going to be something she had in a bag to pull out when she was angry."

This made me so angry. Your dad behaved badly, your mother had to forgive him, and he STILL dictated the terms of her forgiveness and insisted that she was not allowed to refer to his bad behaviour in the future. Appalling.

It sounds like your mum probably thought the same as you. She had kids and a family she wanted to protect. Did it help you that they stayed together?

Unfortunately, her not ending the relationship taught you, as a young girl, that it's better to stay in a dysfunctional relationship, even if that means you're hurt and disrespected, than to leave. Unfortunately for her, she had others around her making her feel it was acceptable for her husband to cheat.

It's your relationship and life, so it's totally up to you how you want to proceed. But I would be careful about suppressing your feelings around this.

she never told his parents the second time and I think they really did think it was a one time screw up. Pretty sure they would have been livid with him the way he behaved in the end. I mean we generally had a good childhood and he did at least seem to love mum, wrote her love letters, was often romantic. He's someone who when their sun shines on you you feel amazing, until it doesn't and you are left broken as Mum was. Yes it was awful and I still barely text my dad let alone see him for the way he handled it all in the end. And my husband knows how much pain that has caused me as I was very close to my dad as a child. I don't feel it's quite the same thing but it certainly has made me question who I thought I knew and the stretch to more doesn't seem much of a stretch now. I do think drink is a monster for him. Which he has totally stopped cold turkey since.

There's no rush to conclude your thoughts or make change. Perhaps you need a bit longer to think it all through and see what he really does around the drink. If he can sustain the abstinence or if he's just doing it to make you stay.

Is it ok for someone to cheat if they do it drunk? Is it ok to spend £1k on what could surely be a few lap dances at best or more physical sexual acts at worst, if you're drunk?

It sounds like you need some more time to think about where your boundaries lie. Is drinking a deal breaker for you now, if so, what happens if he goes out and gets drunk again? What happens if you find he lies again? What's a deal breaker and are you willing to live with...

Park whether lapdancers consistutes checking or not for for just a second.....

He's unemployed
He's tight with money
He's spending money you don't have
He has a potential drink problem
He calls you old
He doesn't make you feel good
He disrespectful you & lies to you
He's suggested cure for depression is night's out (most people with real clinical depression take to bed, not a lapdancing club)

How would you advise a friend in your situation?