Strip clubs and lap dances

[Charlie9S]

I'll try and be succinct! My husband visited a strip club twice a couple of months apart. I found out after the second time when he came home at 6.30am and location and his phone notifications gave him away. He has spent nearly 1k that I know of at this strip club. Money that could have been for other important things. He is also not working now although we have a back up fund it is a lot to throw away. He is also tight with money (so all those people I see saying my partner wouldn't do it because he's tight with money, mmm you'd be surprised sadly!) Upon finding out I was very calm, yes my voice wobbling and I was clearly upset but I was calm I did not attack, I wanted clarity of what had gone on, I needed to know if there was a chance I had an STD as I had just had a test amongst my own health scare and I would rather he tell me than the doctor. He said there was no chance and I have tested negative. I calmly asked if he was looking for an out of our relationship, to think long and hard about it as he had clearly risked our marriage he said himself he thought it would hurt me, yet did it again and again. I was clear and gentle saying he knows I am open to talks about anything and he could have had a conversation with me about the boundaries for each other and any wants or needs not being met or wanting to try etc. I had only recently asked if he wanted to try anything new. The friend he went with has an open sort of marriage or they swing, I asked if that is something he wanted he said absolutely not. I never said anything with attack just calm and genuine. I said I just want to understand as best as I can and to be clear on our future, we already have some things that have got to me and I said I don't want to push and work on things when the result is the same just in a few years instead of now. My dad cheated on my mum many times and eventually after 20 years left and imploded our lives.
We spoke about his depression and anxiety and clarifying the pressure he puts on himself is not from me, he had a lot of pressure from his family when younger and work etc and has recently burnt out. I was supportive and positive. We moved forward and he has been generally very respectful and gently trying to make things better. I have been calm and moving forward and carrying on with our lives really as something to move on from. He is also no longer drinking.
However, I had my scans and although I have something it is not really scary or cancer so I am relieved. But almost since then my head is back to how did he do that, he risked our marriage, he spent hundreds on naked women on top of him, I feel like perhaps I just needed to keep moving and now I know I don't have cancer the anger is bubbling up. I know some men like going to strip clubs and he could have had a conversation with me. I just want to talk really and get my feelings out and over with really! But I don't feel I can tell anyone who knows us, and talking more to him keeps it dragging on and I know it isn't helpful to our relationship if I keep bringing it up. If I'm going to let it go then I need to do that. But I am going through in my head what was it really like, what did he get out of it, he jokes about me being old well now I feel like oh god I am old and he has been oggling 20 year olds. I thought we had reconnected, we have been intimate and I thought that would sort of help us move on but I still feel a bit stuck. Damage has been done and now whenever he annoys me a little I go back to that in my head. there are other things that needed improving anyway but this sort of took me to a point of maybe I've had enough.
Not sure what I'm after, do people feel lap dances are cheating, just something silly he screwed up he said he is very ashamed and I have made it clear I am not shaming him, just trying to understand. can anyone just be a friend to talk to just to get it off my chest so I can move forward. Whilst my dad was an idiot at times I remember him saying he'd rather mum didn't forgive him if it was always going to be something she had in a bag to pull out when she was angry. So I don't want to do that. Any advice and support to rebalance my brain?! x

Sounds terrible but it's hard to write everything here. He took all pressure off me when I was unwell and I left a career. He wanted to support our family and me not work, unless I wanted to. He works so hard and completely got burnt out. We lost a baby and a very close relative within 6 months and he never really had a chance to process it he was pressured to go back to work and supported his family before taking the time he needed. Yes depression is a nasty creature and once he was on meds he was more himself again. He has been very smart and saved a lot of money so he can take this breather from the rat race without us being out of pocket. It's stressful but at the same time not as scary as it could be.
He has always joked about me being older than him but it really isn't meant cruelly, people always assume he's older than me and he knows I look younger than him. But since this has happened I feel far more sensitive to it. He has at times made me feel pretty bad or low yes, with no intention but still it's not great. I was at a point he needed to pull his shit together or I was reaching my end, then this happened. Totally unexpected shock.
He didn't suggest a night out would help, I wanted him to have something outside of work and he basically refused to speak to anyone else for months when he resigned so I was glad he was reconnecting with friends.
He did absolutely hurt me, disrespect me and lie to me.
He is generally a very good man, this is a total WTF! But I fully supported him resigning and actually don't want him to dive into another job that puts his wellbeing at risk. He's not a lay about drunk but yes drink has become a problem and escapism through his phone. He's not how you describe but yes there are areas of real shiteness. I always try and see two sides and try and understand the "why" as much as possible.

Your update suggests that it's not beyond hope.

It sounds like you have a man who is absolutely piss poor at processing emotions in any positive or constructive manner and goes for the nuclear option to avoid dealing with difficult realities.

If that sounds more like it than my first attempt, then he needs to acknowledge that he has a real inability to deal with life's challenges and needs counselling to really help him find better ways of coping and possibly self sabotage. He sounds like a typical alcoholic, gambler etc - same carnage, self destruct, escape from reality etc

You need to stop with all the "calm" nonsense, have a look around for your pride, then tell this pathetic apology of a man to piss right off.

The calmness is not just to protect him but also me. I'm not showing he's made me a mess, I'm controlled, confident and able to deal with the truth and not throw nastiness his way, in a way I am showing him how to handle shit, and that I am I suppose being the bigger person. I am an emotional person and irrational emotional tearful me would feel like that gives away my pride and power. I am worthy and I will not break down and beg why did you do this to me. But I want to know the facts and go from there. I learned even with the worst people you'll ever meet you will only get the best out of someone with kindness and I try my best to live by that. At least in my heart then I also know I have no guilt my end. Does that make sense? I have plenty of dignity and pride. He is someone I am very proud of in many ways and yes this has totally knocked us sideways and is shite. Not saying its okay in any sense. But screaming and throwing abuse for me would probably make me say sorry and I am not putting myself in a position to feel bad for my actions in a response to his shitty ones. I understand your thoughts and it's hard because this is one moment in an online message so I thank you for your response. Understand this by being calm I am absolutely holding on to my pride.

Hi honey,

Friend here you can vent out to :).

In my opinion going to strip clubs is not a bad thing. You could join him as well. It’s fun. What is bad is that he went behind your back and spent mpney from family budget.
I think he will do it again, unless he realises that you will leave him, file for divorce and he will have to pay support. And will be ruined financially.
i don’t know your financial situation, but think really deep If you would like to divorce. If there are kids it may be better for them living in two separate but healthy households, rather than having two parents at odds.
I completely understand you not wanting to share with friends/family. But just make sure you don’t feel shame. If your friends really shared what is going on in their marriage you might be really shocked. We all like playing happy families but none knows what goes on behind close doors.

In my opinion going to strip clubs is not a bad thing. You could join him as well. It’s fun.

What fucking drivel. Almost always on these threads someone comes and says this. Often someone with FemaleNameNumber as a username. But who knows who is who on the internet? We get a lot of trolling men. Just saying.

The fact is that strip clubs are the 'acceptable' visible part of a business that disempowers, abuses and objectifies women. We don't need to take part, we don't need to think it's OK, and we don't need telling what our boundaries should be.

You know sexual assaults on women increase in areas around strip clubs. Hazard a few guesses why. Maybe not going just for that reason is sensible.

I think you are overreacting. It’s not a bad thing to go once or twice for a laugh. In the same way I would go with my friends to a male strip club. Not attracted AT ALL to these men tbh but would go for a laugh and of course let my husband know. I find this kind pf entertainment ridiculous and wouldn’t take it seriously. What is bad is him going behind your back and spending money on it.
i am not a man. Just open minded.

LOL trafficked women. Har-de-har objectification. Arf increased levels of sexual assault. SOOOOO fun.

I think having sex with someone else is cheating. But a relationship can end for many other reasons than cheating.

I was a lap dancer pole dancer... theres no touching allowed even in the private ones depending what kind he went to... I know alot of the girls used to work as lady's of night she'll I say and would do extras on a private dance if you get me... i would consider that cheating just because I know what goes on...and if there is man chucking money around they will do more to to keep it going... sorry your going through this... I'm pretty ashamed now I'm older but I was young and that's it... I was stupid

No need for you to be ashamed. People sometimes think that because we are anti-the trade we are anti-the women. Nothing could be further from the truth.

The sleazy men are the issue. You are not (and were not).

You could join him as well. It’s fun.

Oh do f off.

Are men expected to join women in male strip clubs/shows and enjoy it?

They would never go.

Why are women the only ones expected to participate in and enjoy objectifying other women ...would men do it to other men; not on your nelly.

Why are women the only ones assumed to be conveniently (for men) bisexual?

For the record I've seen plenty of women relate their experiences of joining their partners in strip clubs - trying to be all chilled and open minded etc.... They hated it. One was intensely uncomfortable, and couldn't get out of her head how enthusiastic and turned on and enjoying it her partner was, she wondered what he'd be like there on his own ... But didn't want to always go with him, like a fkg body guard.

The other was seriously shocked at how much grinding and gyrating and flailing the stripper did in the face of/on the crotch of the men. cause she was previously one of the typical cohort on here who have no real concept of the level of contact and of the sexual acts that can go on in private "dances" in lap dancing clubs.
I read a review by a guy who paid for a "lesbian" dance and reported himself satisfied because one stripper had visibly got "a few licks in on target" (the target being the other strippers vulva).

They weren't happy or comfortable, lots of women wouldn't be ... Stop with the "it's fun to objectify other women alongside men" schtick.

It sounds like you’ve been operating in survival mode, waiting for the results of your health issues and then trying to navigate this. My chest actually felt tight and strained reading your op.

I’m so sorry that your dh is such a disappointment; you deserve so, so much better.

Is it possible for you to get away for a few days to somewhere you could be emotionally safe? Or could you ask him to leave, to give you space and time to process this? I don’t think holding everything in is healthy and if you’re not in the peak of health you don’t need this drain on your emotional resources.

Oh and further on the fucked up suggestion from "Ms Open minded" - a lap dancer on here specified very clearly how she did "dances" for men on their own and dances for the same men who brought in their partners/girlfriends occasionally. It was made clear to her that the partner attending "dance" was to be a minimal, sanitised, "light" version of the dance they usually got.... So the gf's went away reassured. She said the same guys would constantly be trying to finger her etc during "dances" when their partners were absent.

So another reason not to go along for a farce with your delightful partner to a lap dancing hole.

I don't think it's cheating. But he's treating women like commodities-he's buying their consent. And I couldn't live with that.

@GilberMarkham honestly relax. You have taken it really personally and you are too conservative. Btw I did suggest her to divorce…

What does 'too conservative' mean? I'd argue that it's radical and revolutionary to place the humanity and agency of women above the sexual desires of men.

I'm fairly sure strip clubs are the conservative thing, not recognising them for what they are.

And I note you've twice now avoided the question of sexual assaults around clubs (and in them of course).

I am not aware of sexual assaults around steip clubs. If it happens it’s sad. I am not aware simply because I have never been to a strip club.
Honestly you have taken this too personally and seriously. At the end of the day some people are more open minded. Would I date a man who goes regularly to strip clubs? No. But would go with my husband for fun. Don’t know. Maybe it’s disgusting or maybe it’s a form of art. Don’t know.

Escaping through his phone too? Well, you can call it all an escape from problems if it makes it seem better.
The phone is where the start of a chance should be. Its likely you have the tip of the iceberg. Demand full access to his phone and have a detailed mooch. If he refuses, you know there is more he has hidden and you would be quite fair to make the showing of it a dealbreaker.

I am not aware of sexual assaults around steip clubs. If it happens it’s sad.

It's a measurable thing that assaults increase. pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33038901/

Maybe that open mind could be accompanied with research and learning.

Get rid of the space waster. You will save time, anxiety and money.

You have taken it really personally and
you are too conservative

Honestly you have taken this too personally and seriously

How many people are you going to say this to?

Maybe you're the problem, and not other people taking things too "personally" or "seriously"... Has that ever occurred to you?

you are too conservative

I find a hand maiden who objectifies women alongside men in strip clubs like you; rather more "conservative" actually.

Btw I did suggest her to divorce…

After she takes your suggestion to go and have "fun" watching women strip and grind over her husband and other men, like you suggested ... Presumably?

In my opinion going to strip clubs is not a bad thing. You could join him as well. It’s fun

I am not aware simply because I have never been to a strip club.But would go with my husband for fun. Don’t know. Maybe it’s disgusting or maybe it’s a form of art. Don’t know

Talk me through how you've gone from 'its fun" to ..... "I've never been, maybe it's disgusting or maybe it's an art form. Don't know".

Why were you telling a woman that going to strip clubs is a good thing, and it's fun and that she could join her husband there ...... If you haven't actually been to one and don't know what it's like??!!

So, if you haven't actually frequented lap dancing clubs alongside your husband ... As one would have entirely justifiably presumed from what you initially said; I revise "handmaiden" to "potential handmaiden" ..... and someone who calls other women "conservative" for thinking something that you haven't even experienced and know sweet fuck all about, isn't a positive thing for women (either as employees or customers).

While you, on the other hand, are 'open minded" for knowing FA about conditions in clubs for the dancers, or the experiences of any women who've joined their partners in lap dancing clubs, or the differences between the "dances" performed for couples and men on their own (requested to be different by the men as one dancer reported on here), or the cross over between lap dancing and prostitution, or the assaults in the areas of the clubs, or the tie in with toxic masculinity and the views and values towards women that men develop/reinforce by using them, or the gangs sometimes involved in the clubs etc etc.

You don't know much, for someone who declares herself a "friend" to the op, and suggests she join her h in the lap dancing clubs.