What's your definition of fair share?

[user1489844432]

I have constant arguments with my partner about equal share of responsibilities and obviously we both think the other one is wrong. So I would appreciate some external perspective.

We both work full time and have one child in YR1.

My partner pays for food bills and breakfast/after school club and I pay for everything else whether bills, mortgage, activities for little one etc.

We have more or less equal split when it comes to morning and bedtime routines with her doing 60%.

The issue is that I am constantly being called lazy for not pulling my weight around housework. Factually it is correct statement. However I have a very stressful job, which I took only when we decided to have a family so we can afford to have a child. Our earnings were similar before the child and my partner said she doesn't want to have a stressful job regardless whether child is in the picture or not.

In order to get some peace I have started paying recently for a cleaner once a week but apparently this doesn't count as I don't clean myself.

I said to my partner if she wants me to do half of the housework then I would expect her to pay half of the total bills. The point is she would need then to go and find either a stressful job paying more or another part time job (in addition to current job) which is less stressful to afford half of the bills and on top of that still do half of her housework.

She said I make no sense at all and being unfair. I appreciate she is tired but so am I just in a different way. I understand we both work full time but at the end of the day if we agreed fair share that each does 4hrs housework for example and then I would only clean one room in that time and she did whole house then I would be told again I am not pulling my weight, so it is only fair in my opinion to apply the same to bills contribution.

The way I see it she is still getting a decent deal here as ultimately part time job would require more hrs than what she spends covering my half of the housework.

Any thoughts on this?

I think it depends if you are happy in your job or feel you have to do it to support the family. I get paid more than double my ex DP but my job is much more fulfilling and I love it so I would never see it as an excuse to do less around the house. If I hated it I might have felt resentful at the family set up and want to scrape back time for myself elsewhere...

I agree with the OP here. Encouraged into more stressful role (is it also longer hours or do you both work the same hours?), covers more of the bills and now pays for a cleaner. Partner less stressful role and admits they don’t want to have a more stressful one, does a bit more of the school runs and some additional chores.

I used to earn more than DH and whilst working fewer hours than him. I worked 4 days a week with lots of WFH and he worked 5 days per week with a 3 hour commute. (We are now retired and actually, my pension is bigger too!).

In your scenario, DH should have come home (at 7pm) and spent his free time doing chores than I did? Whilst I had been on the sofa since 5, or spent the whole day being a lady of leisure? That's what you think is fair, just because my wage was higher?

I strongly disagree.

Difficult to do more school runs when they both work full time.

I can see your point of view. You're effectively stuck in a highly stressful job because you need the higher pay in order to make up for her lower pay, to afford the standard of living you both enjoy. You're effectively enabling her to coast along in her chosen career, and in return you therefore expect her to cut you some slack at home.

All these people saying they get you are missing the point. She doesnt work less hours. If she worked PT ai would wholeheartedly agree but she doesnt. The part about stress and wages is a different element but if you both work the same hours them you work the same hours and have the same free time regardless of stress or money.

I think that is absolutely the case and would agree if one partner works fewer hours in order to pick up the slack at home.
That isn't the OP's situation though, OP just thinks they deserve more down time due to a bigger financial contribution. They haven't clarified the balance of hours worked - just stated both are FT.

Look, this is really simple and I do not understand why you don't get it.

It isn't about who earns more money. It's about hours worked. If you both work full time then housework gets split 50/50. End. Of. Story. And I don't care what sex you are, that's how it should be.

As a higher earning woman OP I agree with you. But this is Mumsnet, men are hated, so be prepared for flames. You might as well delete and post as a woman.

I don't think it's necessarily about wages per se, but the contribution each person makes, and agrees to make, as a team. A 'stressful' role isn't just about the work, it's about the headspace, etc.

It's also about 'choice'.

The OP's partner has had the freedom to stay in a lower paid career. The OP doesn't. He's not enjoying his 'big job' at her expense, he is stuck in it because she doesn't want to step up. So her doing more of the housework is actually 'payment' for coasting. Which I think is fair enough.

She is also unhappy about him getting a cleaner, just because he 'doesn't clean himself'.

I think what she wants is for him to take on more of the mental load but ultimately if she chose a less stressful job then it should be on her.

Who does pick up, drop offs, meal prep and food shopping? ( ie drudgery?)

Very transactional.

A better way to approach is for each of you to think "how is my partner today, what challenges are they facing today, how can I help?"

Rather than trying to ascribe percentages and "difficult weightings" and define reasonable fair shares as if this is an arms length service contract.

My DH earns 1/2 what I earn

We both work full time

We split the house work 50/50

We both have the same money to spend each month

We both have the same free time

You are telling your partner than she is expected to work more hours, across home and work, than you because you value her based soley on her income.

Honestly the fact that you think it's fair to put your feet up and watch her skivvy around you based on the fact your earn more is a bit pathetic.

That said if you are willing to pay for a cleaner then thats good although i wonder who is expected to tidy up before the cleaner comes and if you have just outsourced part of the task and expect the rest to be done by her?

My partner and I work 'fulltime'. In reality, I may work more than contracted hours one week, he then next. Or I may have a particularly tough week one week, he the next. Either way, the other person picks up the slack because we want to help. That said, OH is the far bigger earner and more money generally equates to more responsibility and stress. So for the most part I pick up the extra and reap the benefits the money brings.

OP, have you asked her what would constitute a fair division? As someone else said, if you have a cleaner, and also childcare, there shouldn't be so much left over that would cause so many problems?

You should both have equal leisure time 🤷🏽‍♀️

How many hours do you each work?

That's exactly what it is. Just to clarify I am not like a banker, lawyer etc in order to earn what I earn in my profession I need to deal with a lot of stress and extra hours.

I go for less stressful job tomorrow then we lose a house by the end of the year as there won't be enough to pay for all outgoings. We talking here very avg house, 10 year old car. UK holiday once a year.

Ultimately there is always option to get something cheaper and cut on things to reduce outgoing but it would be predominantly my little one affected by this as there would be no money for clubs, additional activities etc and that's not something I am prepared to do.

In a way I am really happy with this thread. Now I know if I ever become single, I shouldn't ever live with anyone else but my child as I am very likely to end up with another woman with similar views to my current partner if responses on this thread are anything to go by.

The reality is that no one with a young child who is also working full time can be regarded as coasting.

Does your DP have very high cleaning standards or something? If you're both working ft and have a cleaner, I'm struggling to understand this huge raft of ongoing cleaning activity that is required.

Ultimately it sounds like neither of you appreciate the others efforts. You would probably get a much better response if you approached this from the pov that you're both working hard and tired and how can you approach this together.

PP have said you should both have equal amounts of 'free time'. So if you work more hours there's your answer. She has more time to do housework, while you are working. And at the end you should have the same leisure time.

Does she? Does she do bang on 9-5 while you do 12 hour days?

Can’t get my head around wife not being happy with the cleaner because he’s not doing it. Who cares, as long as it’s getting done?

Lol. What do you think lawyers and bankers get paid all that extra dough for, if not stress and long hours?

What exactly is it you do, that allows you to get paid so much extra for "stress" alone, rather than specific qualifications, skills or experience?

And what is it you think your partner could be doing to bring her own salary up to the same level?

By the way, I am a lawyer, I earn twice as much as my husband, I often have to work late and I think YABVU.

I see your point of view OP. But also, with a family of only three, how much housework and stuff can there possibly be? If you're paying for a cleaner, then what is she complaining about? I think that if you have a stressful job to make up financially for her easier one, you should do slightly less at home. I think that's fair.

If you are working more hours than your partner and had put that in the opening post you probably would have got different answers

People on here are advocating for equal leisure time, you seem to be missing that

But yes a lot of women are not wholly interested in men who view a persons worth and how much lesiure time they should be permitted based solely on their earnings in a world where there is a gender pay gap, it's harder for mothers to not be impacted by having children than fathers, and women take on a greater burden of caring responsibilities and houshold responsibilities in general.

How much you earn or contribute is irrelevant. If you both work equal hours, then the household chores should be equal too. But I do think paying for a cleaner does help absolve you from sone - after all you both be Igor from having the cleaner.
What are the jobs that she thinks you need to do more? And who does the life admin (dentist appointments, domestic repairs, car insurance, social calendars- for example who contacted the cleaner, arranged their hours and payment)? That takes some time and hassle and should be factored in

But you're misrepresenting OP's point. He's not arguing that he deserves some slack because of making more money. He's saying that he took on a highly stressful job he doesn't actually enjoy for the sake of the family as a whole (he's a bit unclear on whether there's also overtime involved, so effectively more hours.) In contrast, his partner currently has the option to equalize the financial burden by going from a pleasant, low-stress FT job to one that's more demanding within the same hours but is refusing to do so. The argument isn't about hours worked - it's about job intensity and job satisfaction.

Don't underestimate the resentment that can build up from living with a person who doesn't pull their weight around the house. Many couples have broken up over it.
Nor should you underestimate the resentment that can build up when a person refuses to pull their weight financially.