How to support the guy I like after he’s been through domestic violence

[LimpetsMummy]

Hi after a 7 year break from relationships I’ve got back on the dating horse. I’m 45 met a guy the same age, have loads in common, we really like one another & keen on seeing where things go.

we are great friends & I am keen that regardless of what happens we try & keep that friendship. Like any potential blossoming relationship there’s ups & downs (more ups than anything) but he has been through domestic violence & understandably has a lot of blocks/defences in place. he’s never been married but I have we also have 3 kids each. I’m more wear your heart in your sleeve show/say how you feel & he’s very reserved. He does little things to surprise me like sends me gifts when I least expect it, the breakthrough came at the weekend when he was complimenting me & said I love you, you are amazing which I wasn’t expecting. He knows how I feel has for months but is a man of few words so when he shows it it’s so special. I’m not going anywhere and reiterate that I want to show him my support, understanding & help him learn to love himself as well as loving others & accept he is worthy of a relationship.

Such hurdles I’ve faced are he opens up a tiny bit but then I think he feels he’s showed too much of himself and the walls go back up, I’ll try and get him to come out just for drinks, bit of food & a laugh just to relax but haven’t managed to get him to do that yet. Is there any advice anyone can give or has been through a similar set up. How did things work out for them? I’m happy with baby steps, slow & steady approach but conscious I don’t want to hurt anyone.

You sound like a really decent person, but I think you need to decide here what your boundaries are and firmly maintain them.

His past and his emotional issues aren't a free pass for him to hurt you, whatever the reason behind them. And it seems from your posts that this behaviour is hurting you. You shouldn't be treading on eggshells around someone because of their past. If you are, then maybe it's too raw and he's not ready to be in a relationship yet.

@monsteramunch I am waiting for 101 to answer now and shaking.

My DH was a victim of domestic violence. It didn't affect us in the way it sounds like it's affecting your relationship. We were still able to go out places etc.

We've been together 2.5 years now and some of the damage still crops up now and again. You just need to be patient and understand that some of the ways they react is not a reflection on you.

For example, for a while it felt like whenever he made a statement and I agreed he'd continue to drive his point, even after I'd agreed, like he was expecting me to disagree with him. Like he had already lined himself to have to prove a point or give extensive evidence as to why he was saying what he was saying. I'd get annoyed sometimes because he would keep going on and on trying to convince me of something I'd agreed with 10 minutes ago. Sometimes I'd say "ok" and he'd get annoyed because he thought I was saying ok just to dismiss him rather than because I was agreeing with him, I was ok with what he was saying.

I remember he was 5 minutes late for lunch at my house once and he phoned me in a panic, apologising profusely and explaining his reasons in great detail.

If we ever argued he'd say "why are you even with me if I'm so bad". This could be over something really silly. I recognised that this was him testing the water so see if I would leave him. He used to ask why I was with him and made comments about me being too good for him. He's a wonderful man, excellent father, he just didn't see it as his self-esteem had been knocked out of him. It took some time to build that back up, but he did the same for me.

Any time something cropped up, after the dust had settled we talked about it. He knew I was nothing like his ex and I wasn't going to flip my lid at him being 5 minutes late but he was with her for 12 years and lived like this for 12 years so some habits were hard to drop.

He was very open with me from the start. We'd known each other 20 years so I wasn't exactly a stranger.

We said "I love you" quite early on and we even talked about getting married after a few months. Some would see it as a red flag but the way my DH explained it was that he'd spent 12 years reading his ex's behaviour, language etc to try and anticipate incoming explosions of rage and obviously to try and avoid them. He admitted that he was closely analysing me at first and it didn't take long to work out that I was genuine. He felt safe with me and able to open up without judgement. I had some damage too from previous relationships so it probably helped that I was sharing my vulnerability with him as well.

I've met his ex because he co-parents with her. I've had her screaming abuse at me at my door, she's even bragged about hitting him and how she would do it again. I can see how anxious he still gets if he ever needs to contact her for anything regarding the kids. We've both put boundaries in place to minimise contact with her.

Everyone is different. If you're serious about getting into a relationship with this man I'd suggest he gets some therapy first. If he's still closed off to you and won't take you out, he definitely has issues he needs to work through before even contemplating a relationship.

Time, patience, understanding and communication is the key. But don't lose yourself. A relationship is a 2 way street and you need to be getting something positive out of it as well. You're not a therapist or a fixer. Yes, you can help but he really needs to get to a stage where that's not all you're doing and you can both get some enjoyment from the relationship.

You sound lovely OP but be careful building a relationship on you being the 'fixer', ultimately he needs to work through his issues ideally with an independent therapist, with you supporting him by showing understanding that this can take time.

I echo what others say that the start of a relationship should be all ups, this is a red flag I missed with my ex and I could have saved a lot of time and energy if I had the knowledge I do now.

@Naunet
Women centric? What are you on? The OP is a woman and asking a reasonable question about a man she's known for years, and who has herself seen him subjected to DV.

The man is a victim and deserves the respect of being believed. He's also had counselling, so what more can he do?

OP is not being love bombed by an internet stranger, but a friend she's know for years.

I suggest OP just takes it slowly and encourages further counselling.

It took my DP a while to get out of apologising if he went more than an hour without messaging. He was a very light sleeper as the x used to wake him up in horrible ways. I noticed at first he was very, very closed about where he was going and what he was doing. This didn't bother me in the slightest because it didn't even register, but I know now it was a defence thing as she was so controlling.

Have you not seen where the OP posted that she witnessed some of the DV and that the children have been removed from the woman's care?

Thank you for your advice. I never imagined at 45 I’d be here when I started out on the journey of adulthood and there’s been some great advice/pointers from many. I feel like an old fossil I didn’t know what a fixer was and had to Google it and I’ve been looking at myself and where that has come from and developed into my life. I’ve made it clear that regardless of anything the children on both sides must come first. I’m glad many touched on the counselling part I know he’s had some and gets a care package via his employer that allows him to tap into that service again if he needs it and the suggestion of me going to a counselling session is also great

You called him "my friend". But he's said he loves you, I and I take that in a romantic sense, not a friend sense. I'm not sure if you see him as a romantic partner or just a good friend that needs help.

Yeah my DH used to do the same regarding the messages.

He also just says "I'm just popping out for a bit" and never says where. Not that I bother. I never really thought about it until you post that it could be a result of the DV.

I remember when we first moved in together he said he was going out and I asked when he'd be back and he got defensive and said "I spent a decade having to account for my every move, I'm not doing this with you too". I was only asking to gauge if he'd be home for dinner, when to start dinner etc. I explained this to him later on and he apologised.

It's such a shame to see the damage DV can do. It's a shame to think some DV victims will struggle to find happiness because their learned behaviours could put a lot of people off. I was lucky in my case that the good definitely outweighed the bad and over time we've worked through a lot of the damage together.

Yes it comes out in small little ways I think. My DP can be quite closed off and stoic but it is definitely, definitely looser and easier than it was to start.

I’ve just finished dating someone in a similar boat. All amazing early on, said he loved me etc..like you, I had known him years prior and all seemed well. But it quickly came to light that the smallest thing would be me ‘not understanding him’ or behaving ‘crazy’ like she did. This couldn’t be further than the truth & it was clear he still has trauma from it.
just be careful and keep a close eye on things.

More likely he treated her the same way and will be telling the next woman YOU were the crazy abusive ex.

If his behaviour was unacceptable with you, why do you think it wasn't with her? If he emotionally abused you like this...then why do you think that was 'trauma' - and not just his nature?

Abusers often use claims like 'trauma' to get you to try rationalise their abuse. To stop you from seeing that they aren't 'struggling' they are just shitty human beings.

Yeah but everyone on mumsnet says he's made it up it, so maybe the police reports were fake and the social services were just actors he hired ?

In all seriousness though. He is dealing with/has dealt with a lot so maybe just stick to being a supportive friend.

@Pinkbonbon hmm you’ve got me wondering now!
Ive known him yrs (but hadn’t been In touch for a long time) as have some friends and no ones had a bad word to say..BUT the abusive ex only came to light after I questioned something he (inappropriately) said and I was apparently ‘crazy’ and ‘going mental’ at him. I never ever raised my voice in the duration of being with him so was shocked at this response.

Common abuser tactic to turn things round on you. They've done somrthing awful but you're the one with 'issues' for daring to call them on it. And guess what? You're aggressive too. Yes you are. And it's triggering their past, which it suddenly turns out, was abusive. Funny they never mentioned that.... poor them. You should feel terrible. Maybe you're the one with the problem afterall.

It's called DARVO.
(Deny, attack, reverse victim and offender).
Its a tactic to shut you up and make you wonder if you've misunderstood things/you're the bad guy.

Do you believe men can ever be the victim, or is it always that they’re the abuser reversing it?

That doesn’t matter to some posters. Male dv victims do not exist in their eyes.

Of course men can be victims.

I believe there's probably even more domestic violence against men if anything. Because abusive women don't see hitting men as being 'as bad' because it won't do real harm.

But its also very common for abusive men to claim past abuse. I don't believe in pussy footing about that issue. This site is to help women.

I'd also encourage women to consider how men talk of us in certain parts of the Internet designed primarily for men. Because whilst we give benefit of the doubt as to their nature but always encourage caution (perfectly fair)...many if then are busy òn those sites calling us all whores and gold diggers.

So forgive me if I'm not overly concerned with pointing out that men CAN sometimes be bad and aren't always to be trusted, on a woman's site. Aww diddums, poor blokes xD

I think you’re correct 👍🏻 n both counts. That there’s more violence against men than we know about, and that abusive men claim to be victims.

I wonder how we can tell, and how we avoid assuming all male victims are abusers in disguise (as that perpetuates the problem of them not being believed). I replied to your post as you seem to immediately assume this bloke (and others referred to) are abusers in disguise.

Mumsnet is not a woman’s site. I’m a parent, and should be welcome here.

I do agree with your first paragraph. Some (male heavy) sites are appalling.

Did you manage to speak to them in the end?

I absolutely didn't assume that for op. I clearly state at least twice in my opening post alone that it's only a possibility to be considered.

But yes, for @Bimc44 I am pointing out that it IS likely bs from him because her post has hallmarks of him being abusive (gaslighting and darvo).

Also something to consider regarding how to tell genuine from fake, some prior posters mention their partners who went through abuse feeling not good enough. Where as bimc44 as an example - it was him trying to make her feel not good enough.

So that might be an indication that can help you spot early on the difference between a victim of abuse and someone who just wants to victimise you.

Of course, everyone's self esteem presents differently though so just something to consider.

Thank you for a balanced response

i guess, given I’m a bloke with some understanding of this, my instinct is to believe blokes who admit to having been hit. It’s very hard for them to own up to that and the usual mumsnet response is somewhere between dismissive and outright hostility usually