Amazing loving partner - he lied to me big time

[LaPL]

I am almost divorced, officially separated for 3 years. I have a 6 years old child. My ex husband was mentally and emotionally abusive, and even if we were living a comfortable life financially, we had our own home, vacations every year etc, my life and my mental health was hell. I got out and I got better.

A little more than a year and a half ago, I met my boyfriend and it was a beautiful love story up until last week.

Context, 4 years older than me, never been married, no kids, live alone in an apartment, well educated and decent job, no big responsibilities. He has a heart of gold, incredibly supportive, loving towards me and my child, trustworthy, loves his family and he is the guy I go to for advice. Everyone do. I love him, he's been nothing but amazing to me - we barely fight and communication is excellent. My child is very attached to him. We started talking about moving in together (I currently rent a small apartment, after the separation I had to sell my house), I always told him I wanted to go back to home ownership, but the city I live in is outrageously expensive and I need a partner to afford a family home. He ALWAYS said that buying a house was his plan too, that we will have the life we want and we deserve, that he wanted to move with me, he wanted to marry, he just needed a bit of time to think it through.

We talked so many times about houses we liked, planned our imaginary wedding (even fell in love with a venue!!) talking about how many guests we would like to invite, talk about vacations and everything in between... you get the picture. I was finally feeling so fortunate.

Well... last week he came to me with this information: I have no money, I have zero savings, I live paycheck to paycheck, I cannot give you what you want, a house, a ring, a wedding and... I possibly need to declare bankruptcy because I have at least six figures credit card debts, my credit score is so bad, I am ready for you to kick me out of your life because I lied to you all this time as I was in denial.

I am shocked and I am still processing. My first reaction was to try to understand better and now I told him I want to help him get out of this hole. Not helping by giving him money, but by moving in with me so we pay one rent and we can share expenses, so he can paying off creditors and start saving a bit. I know this is the right thing to do, but I feel so betrayed and shocked and bitter and honestly so so scared for my financial future and for the wellbeing of my child. What if he does that again? He said he hasn't accumulated any more debts in the last two years and used a "protected" credit card responsibly, but the previous years debts are still there. I can't buy anything with him because his credit score is soooo bad it will take 5/6 years to recover.

What would you do?

Thank you.

@LaPL I’m afraid I don’t think you do understand what a healthy relationship looks like. At all.

You are stuck on the idea of who your boyfriend presented himself to be and what he could offer you. Not who he is and what he can’t.

You hope that loving him, moving him into your house, controlling his finances, fixing him, will make him into this man you fell in love with and all your plans for a big house and wedding will follow.

I don’t know that anyone is going to be able to get it through to you that he doesn’t exist unless you actually experience it.

You have fallen in love with potential. With an idea. With your own plans for what you thought he could offer.

You are romanticising the power of what love could achieve if you give him a chance. That if you take this huge chance on him, you’ll eventually get your happy ever after and be able to tell everyone you stuck by him and now look!

What’s that saying - he who does not listen, must feel?

You are going to have to feel I fear.

He was dishonest for sure. That kind of dishonesty stems from his embarrassment and shame and guilt that he isn't in a good place financially. It isn't the right time to tell you at first and then it just becomes a thing that is easier to keep hidden.

I still think his view that he can't give you what you want is concerning. If you have made it clear you want an equal, he isn't seeing it that way.

This just doesn't seem healthy at all.

@Over40Overdating has 100% nailed it in her last post.

I am trying to understand if he is worth it, because before all of this, I was 100% sure he was the man for me.

@LaPL

But don't you see that the man you 'were 100% sure' of never existed? The man you were 'sure of' was a facade that the 'real man' was putting up for his own benefit. You didn't 'know' him at all, you only 'knew' that facade. But now you do know him. You know him to be a liar, a manipulator, and a spendthrift. So stop willfully seeing the facade and start seeing the real man. Is that what you want in your life, in your child's life?

As far as 'the risk he does something even more stupid', this is NOT your responsibility. If he has made you feel that (ie saying "I don't know what I'll do" etc etc) that is doubly manipulative. We are each responsible for our own actions. No one 'makes' us do risky or negative behaviour, it is OUR CHOICE.

And as far as 'shutting the door' when someone you love is in trouble, if that person wants or is ready to accept 'help' that is detrimental to the 'helper' then that person is being selfish and uncaring.

I'm sorry you've been so disappointed, I really am. I know that you just want to be loved and in a 'safe' and honest relationship. That's perfectly normal. But we all need to live 'in reality' and not cling to some fantasy life that has been created by a liar for his own purposes. And in the end, truth is always better than fantasy, even if it doesn't seem that way now.

This is possibly not relevant @LaPL BUT looking at your timeline, of your separation (and pending divorce) were you living with your husband when you met this man?

all you are saying is true and fair, and I get it 100%. I would say the same to a friend.
However, I want to say that we, together, had all sorts of moments, not just planning to buy a house, a ring and get married.
Forget about those things for a moment. I am struggling with the idea that all our laughs, hugs, feelings, discussion about everything, little and big moments, all the support he gave him while I was dealing with court and my ex, the way he is as a person OUTSIDE of the lie about having it together financially, was that fake too?

not at all, I've been living by myself for the past 3 years. I met him 1.5 years ago.

Just don't do it.

@SpidersAreShitheads

18 months isn't that long really to start disclosing the ins and outs of your own personal finances. I didn't have joint finances with any partner at 18 months, and I can't say I ever had any conversations about their finances at this point either.

And this attitude is (partly at least) why so many relationships end in heartbreak....

People like you only focus on the fun stuff for the 18 months or so, and fall in love with a fantasy person, not the real person.... then the fantasy can't be sustained forever and reality has to creep in as people let their real selves... then the relationship either implodes in heartbroken anguish or is continues in weary resentment.

I've seen this before. They always end up in debt and lying again. Sorry.

That's an incredibly presumptuous post from you there @Tuilpmouse..... People like me? When you know absolutely nothing about me, or my past relationship history......that's a huge reach by you.

It's not about living a fantasy life but actually about taking things slowly. 18 months is no time at all really, and I'm not going to divulge every aspect of my financial history to someone unless we're making joint commitments. Until that point, my debts, my finances, and my savings are absolutely none of their business. And I think you'll find if you look through this thread that other posters have said similar.

If you're comfortable spewing out every last detail of your personal finances to every boyfriend that comes along, you crack on. But taking things slowly doesn't mean living in "fantasy land" and I find the suggestion that we have to pour out every last financial detail to be in an authentic relationship incredibly offensive.

It's not about living a fantasy life but actually about taking things slowly. 18 months is no time at all really, and I'm not going to divulge every aspect of my financial history to someone unless we're making joint commitments. Until that point, my debts, my finances, and my savings are absolutely none of their business. And I think you'll find if you look through this thread that other posters have said similar.

As ever though, there is a large middle ground between these two points. My partner, who I've been with for several years, doesn't know all the ins and outs of my finances. But within a few dates, he did know the basics. We found out about each other's jobs, home ownership (or not) and broadly our attitude to money and spending. That way we knew we were compatible. I realise this might seem dull and unromantic but for both of us, we knew that romance would struggle if we had very different attitudes to money.

I think a lot depends on previous experience. I've seen the effects of differing attitudes to spending on relationships and it's not pretty. It builds resentment and ill will. So it's better to find out early on if you're very different in this regard, then you can move on before you're at that starry eyed, fancying yourself in love stage.

@SpidersAreShitheads

If you're comfortable spewing out every last detail of your personal finances to every boyfriend that comes along, you crack on. But taking things slowly doesn't mean living in "fantasy land" and I find the suggestion that we have to pour out every last financial detail to be in an authentic relationship incredibly offensive.

But you said you hadn't even discussed any financial matters with them after 18 months... If I had consequential financial issues and I was in a relationship with someone that was more than a FWB for 18 months, of course I'd share it. This OP
is a case in point as to why such disclosure is so important.... and BEFORE you reel someone in and get them to fall in love with you. Why would you waste 18 months on someone before you let them know really key important stuff about who you were? That's tantamount to relationship fraud!

@SpidersAreShitheads

And the point here is that the OP and her DP absolutely weren't treating things dead casual. It wasn't a let's meet up for a coffee and a fumble once a fortnight and only text once or twice in the meantime.

Ok there's not telling a new partner every detail about your financial ins and outs.

But then there's misleading and deceiving them into thinking something's possible that isn't.

It's not about living a fantasy life but actually about taking things slowly. 18 months is no time at all really, and I'm not going to divulge every aspect of my financial history

If 18 months is too soon to be honest about personal financial circumstances, then it's far too soon to be introducing someone to a very young child.

OP and new man aren't 'taking things slowly'; they're all over each others lives. Except on his part it's been pure fabrication, designed to reel OP in and keep her hooked.

Your rationale is not relevant here, and it is harmful to OP if she uses it to justify his lies and keep her fantasy alive.

Maybe we have crossed wires. Or maybe we just have different ideas about what's appropriate to share and when. I don't think either is particularly wrong, if I'm being honest.

If I wasn't about to move in with someone, I wouldn't be talking to them about my savings, or the debts I'm paying off. I might make a loose comment like "I can't afford XX this month as I've got bills to pay/trying to save" etc but I wouldn't go into any level of detail. Because to me, that's not really anyone else's business unless we're about to combine finances.

I wouldn't expect a partner to disclose their credit card balance to me, or the loans they were paying off. As long as they could afford their monthly bills, and maintain a decent lifestyle (and we all have different ideas of what that might look like, obviously) - I wouldn't expect to know the ins and outs of their personal finances.

If we reached the point that we were starting to think about buying a house, then that's when you start opening up about affordability, existing commitments, savings etc.

But in fairness....trying to see the other side of the coin.....maybe I have this view because I have never had extortionate debts, and I've never been with someone who has.

This guy has voluntarily opened up and disclosed full details of his finances only 18m into a relationship. And he has a plan to get it paid off, and he's currently got it all under control. It all looks like a bad period in his life when he let things spiral. For me, that wouldn't be a relationship-ending situation - but I appreciate that for someone else it would.

I don't think the fact that someone is paying off debts is a reason not to fall in love with someone, hence why I don't see why anyone has the right to know about their girlfriend/boyfriend's finances - unless you're thinking about getting ready to buy a house etc. I don't think there's anything fraudulent at all about keeping that information private.

I disagree entirely.

Other than the part re the OP not taking things slowly. And I've already said I think she needs to slow everything right down if she is going to continue.

I don't expect to know all the ins and outs of a partner's finances before I introduce them to my child. I genuinely can't understand the relevance of that at all.

Also, you're welcome to a different view, and I appreciate that we don't all see things the same. But my rationale is just as relevant and reasonable as yours.

I am struggling with the idea that all our laughs, hugs, feelings, discussion about everything, little and big moments, all the support he gave him while I was dealing with court and my ex, the way he is as a person OUTSIDE of the lie about having it together financially, was that fake too?

Yes,@LaPL, it was fake too. Please, re-read what @McSlowburn and @GarlicGrace said earlier on this thread (page 3). You were lovebombed and he was so nice to you because he has seen you as his potential cash cow. He has debt, you have savings: a match made in heaven. It's that simple.
When you have a six-figure debt, you can't forget about that, no matter what you do and who you are with. To hide that you are skint and live from paycheck to paycheck is one thing, to hide that you have a six-figure debt is completely another thing and you need to be a very skilled con artist to do that and for such a long time.

OP I'd tackle this the same way as if someone had fallen for someone else who was married.

They need to sort out their life (free from debt or a spouse!) and then look to starting/ continuing the relationship

You are quite free to tell him to get his act together and come back when he has.

Meanwhile, you are not his therapist. You are too emotionally involved.
The risk is the lines will become blurred.

He needs time on his own to sort his life out.

If you both love each other as much as you say, you will wait and he will sort his finances out.

You were lovebombed and he was so nice to you because he has seen you as his potential cash cow. He has debt, you have savings: a match made in heaven. It's that simple.

I disagree.

This is based on a subjective view - your opinion- that he found the OP and their relationship was premeditated.

It's really quite dangerous to spout stuff like this as it's The Truth when all it's simply your own version of things, constructed in your head.

He could be a man who has made a mess of his life financially, but that doesn't mean he set out to find a woman to bail him out.

You don't know that.

I am struggling with the idea that all our laughs, hugs, feelings, discussion about everything, little and big moments, all the support he gave him while I was dealing with court and my ex, the way he is as a person OUTSIDE of the lie about having it together financially, was that fake too?

Worst case scenario : yes.
There are people who lie convincingly for years and lead double lives that shock even those closest to them.

Less worse case scenario : he is a good person who got into a financial mess. BUT who still did not have the courage or integrity to tell you much sooner what his finances are like. Like I’ve said before, he has waited til now to tell you when he could have done it as soon as talk started about houses and weddings. That’s the point that someone who was mature and serious would have come clean, tempered your expectations or started dealing with the situation.

If you hadn’t pushed him to move in, would he have admitted it?
Why does he have the foresight to have savings in cash but not paid anything off on his debt : with a payment plan and consolidation agreement, $20k would have gone a long way to clearing that and showing you he is serious about fixing things.

He isn’t.
I wonder if, as another poster said, this was his way of getting out of the relationship.
He presents a scenario that ruins the plans you had, but puts the onus on you to call it off so he is still the good guy.

If he is the good guy you want to believe, he will sort this situation without you needing to control his finances.
If you love him as you say, you’ll be happy to wait.

He can take up to 5 years to repay a heavily discounted version of those debts. You think I am just going to wait for him for 5 years until all is better?

6 figure debt?
Wow how did I miss it was THAT much.

I mean hundreds of thousands of pounds in debt is extreme. That's hidden gambling habbit territory I'd say. Either way though, run.

No idea if he set out to con you but either way, it's fucked up. Not something you try to help him with.

As for posters talking about the 'whens' of telling a partner you are flat broke (and then some) ...wouldn't you notice during dating? Didn't he ever say 'hey, I can't afford that nice restaurant'. If not, then he was STILL living beyond his means when you started dating.

Or, did you just pay for everything?

Personally I'd expect hints in the first six months along the lines of 'money is tight right now' or 'ive taken on a second job'. And probably before any talk of moving in together in future etc...I'd expect to know if he had substantial debt. Or at least, when 'our future' first came up in convo.

This guys just bullshitted you throughout. And I don't know if he was lying to you or to himself but either way, he hasn't changed if he's been future faking you all this time.

Ps, consider running a Claires law on him.

I know that's about abuse. But con artists often abuse partners.

So if you're planning on continuing to see him I any capacity, thats the first thing I'd do.