Dads: This is what happens when you emotionally abandon your wife

[Chalkandchina]

Consequences

Dear ExHusband,

I could see, this morning, when you came over to deliver H's Nintendo Switch which she left at your parents' house, where you're staying, how sad you were and I sensed you longing for the children as you hugged them at the door.

I felt a pang in my heart for you.
Then I had to remind myself that at no point have you complained about the contact time you have with the children. At no point have you asked for it to change. At no point have you tried to assert your needs as their parent. For this lack of assertiveness, there are consequences.

When you chose to leave me alone on my birthday with a newborn and a toddler to care for during the 12 hours that you went to enjoy your hobby after I begged you not to, I struggled to feel the same way afterwards.
There were consequences.

When on nights out with friends, you chose to belittle me instead of standing proudly by my side, a team, against the world together, for me there were consequences and eventually, for you there were consequences too.

When you didn't go to the doctor about your health issue, which grew and worsened and came between us, there were consequences.

When you stayed up late watching box sets instead of sleeping so that you could be the "on" parent during the day time when I'd been awake all night, there were consequences for us all.

When I couldn't make any more effort in our relationship anymore because whilst I was prioritising Us and the children, you were only thinking of yourself as an individual and there were consequences.

When you failed to stand up to your mother when she made underhanded remarks about my parenting, ignored me and treated me like I was invisible for 2 years and you told me I needed to be more tolerant? I distanced myself.
And there were consequences.

When the relationship therapist asked you to take the lead and make some effort to explore yourself, your wants, your needs, your hopes and dreams and make some effort in our relationship, you ignored her and there were consequences.

When the therapist told me to take some time out, for myself because I was exhausted trying to make a failing relationship work single handedly, I extended that time out for my own self preservation and so there were consequences.

When I tried to talk to you about how to resolve all of the hurt so that we could find a way, when I asked you to go to individual therapy and you didn't, there were consequences.

When you say NO to doing any inner work and NO to relationship work and NO to parenting and NO to sleep and NO to team work and NO to me.
I'm sorry, but there are consequences.

And now, I have to remind myself that I can't protect you from the consequences anymore. Even when I know that being away from us is making you sad, angry, resentful, hateful of me because you think it's all my fault, I remember that there are consequences. For all of us. But mostly, you have to face your consequences, like you faced your choices.

I'm coming round to the idea that Mumsnet exists purely for bitter people to vent. The OP's ex-DH sounds weak and thoughtless with health problems and an overbearing mother - none of which sounds great - but time and again the posts on MN seem to be about relationships where both parties can't communicate.

Ending every paragraph with the same phrase doesn't make it poetic or impactful - it just reads to me like a list of petty gripes. Yeah you weren't suited to each other - who knew?

Another example from dh last night which left DS15 unsure of what to say to me about his dad's choices.

I was planning to go and see my brother who is stuck in an awful care home - he refuses to eat the food so me and other family members take food in for him when we visit. Anyway, admittedly it was a last minute plan to go and see him as had been poorly earlier in the day and I wasn't sure if he would want me to come in, but he texted to say yes please come in and bring sandwiches, so I got ready to go at around 6pm as dh was finishing his work (wfh) and I was about to say I had to go. Then when he saw me with my coat on he leapt up and said "are you going out? I'm going out! I'm going to the cinema!" So I told him yes I was going to see my brother as he needed his sandwiches, and he just literally grabbed his shoes and raced out the door. I thought he was going for the bus as he usually does, so I quickly thought about what I should do and went up to ask DS15 if he wouldn't mind if I nipped out for a couple of hours. As we were talking we saw the car pull away. He took the bloody car. So I had no option at all to go out, and DS just looked at me as if to say "this isn't right" but we kind of stood there in disbelief not saying anything. Every single time, his plans take priority over everything else. He was happy to leave knowing my brother would be expecting to see me and I'd have to cancel. And no doubt it will be my fault for not giving him any notice of my plans. But he can disappear for several days at a time and sends me a one word text WHEN HE IS ON HIS WAY to wherever he's going.

I was furious for about half an hour, having to text my brother to say what had happened, and mulling over the fact I'd have to make this the final straw and say the words. But I still didn't say anything when he eventually came in. Why do I do this? And tonight no doubt it'll be all father of the year time, excitedly watching the final of The Apprentice with the boys and me like a great family experience, as if none of these other things have happened.

My brother is furious, my mum is furious, the kids just expect this, and I just carry on. How do I make it stop?!

Sorry to hijack your post @Chalkandchina but your OP made me think about all the small things that add up without anyone really seeming to notice until it all blows up and the dad who never steps up thinks they're the victim. They can't see that they had a choice every time, and they took the wrong one.

Hear hear.

A very similar story for my Ex.

He thought that working hard and “providing” was all he needed to contribute to our marriage and our kids. And that his desire to suit himself and pursue his hobbies (and later conspiracy theories) above saving his marriage cost him the in tact family he swore he wanted.

During marriage therapy - the marriage therapist couldn’t conceal his amazement that on a “make or break” weekend away - he’d manipulated it to be part of his hobby. So arrived 2 hrs late to the hotel on the first night - sweaty & horrible , 5 mins before dinner where I’d been waiting since the late afternoon.

And now sadly he is reaping the consequences.

I am not without blame at all. Not least I allowed a lot of this behaviour originally thinking I needed to suck it up. I feel v sad for him, for our kids, for us. But he did have a choice.

If that's what you took from the op, that hers were " petty " grievances, I'm flabbergasted .

@Amy1992Brighton If those are your ideas of petty grievances, you've got a big problem.

Is anyone going to be suited to a checked out partner?

Here's a poster who is clearly the problem in a relationship! 😂

It doesn't always take two to tango. I suppose you also think a rape victim also played a part in the problem? Sometimes people do things because they alone are the problem, it's not always a two-way street.

It's not so much that the individual things are petty - most of it does sound really bad - but somehow putting it into a long list like that makes it look petty, and bitter.

The OPs ex sounds weak and like he avoided any kind of confrontation which is really lame, but the OP starts mentioning a lot of stuff about doing "inner work" and therapy which (by the way it's put) sounds like a lot of navel gazing / hippy to me.

And why do so many MNers have DHs who have "hobbies"? What are they all doing - stamp collecting or collecting comics? It makes them all sound like they are about 12.

It's not so much that the individual things are petty - most of it does sound really bad - but somehow putting it into a long list like that makes it look petty, and bitter.

Putting it into a list should show anyone with a modicum of empathy how someone's bit by bit neglect of a family and a relationship can build up and destroy a marriage. It helps a poster realise that actually, each of these things may be small in itself, but put together they show a pattern of a partner who always put himself first.

But you do need to be equipped with empathy to work that out, otherwise you might start accusing women at the end of their rope of being 'petty and bitter'.

Spot on . It's a bit like the age old " nagging" jibe being used against someone who dares to raise a grievance or injustice.

Exactly @pointythings Each individual event can be brushed aside as 'nothing' but when it's hundreds of those things, they add up to something massive. Just over a year ago he ate a cream scone I'd been saving in the fridge for later, and I took off my wedding ring that night. Seems crazy in isolation, but it was (one of) the last straw(s).

@AlwaysTheGoodGirl and people like @Amy1992Brighton don't see that it isn't about the scone. It's about the years long pattern of uncaring and disrespect.

It amazes me, that these men can't see how they are sabotaging their relationships, until it is too late. How thick do you have to be?

My grievances :

Smooching with a colleague in front of me, when I was carrying our first child
Going missing in a nightclub for an hour, with a different colleague
Flirting with a single friend and eyeing up her tits
Trying to kiss all of my friends
Tying to get in to bed with my sister
Trying to smooch with my Mum
Leaving a works night out with another woman and staying at her flat
Placing his hand on a friends wife's lap and leaving it there all night
Beating me up - twice
Kicking me under the table at restaurants
Sleeping with my very best friend
Not getting up with the children in the night - not even once because he had the BIG job

I told him I was going to leave if he didn't change - and he still didn't change. Then he was shocked when I left him. And I mean, truly shocked. Started with the begging, which quickly changed to telling me that I would regret it and neve find anyone else.

He got 20 years out of me.

The crazy part, is that I was (in looks) a 10 and he was a 5.

2 months after leaving him, I met my wonderful DH. He's been my rock and we ae still going strong 14 years later. He's twice the size of ExH, and ExH is scared of him.

I still hate my ExH and will never forgive him.

Another kicker - his family all blamed me for the break up, because "he was just having a bit of fun, whereas Beachblondey broke up the family"....and they never spoke to me again.

Their loss.

Aaaargh......and breathe!!

It's not so much that the individual things are petty... ...but somehow putting it into a list like that makes it look petty and bitter.

On the contrary. On their own each might be seen as petty. Put together as the OP has done, the pattern of behaviour becomes evident. As a previous poster put it: death by a thousand cuts.

Hmm, I'm sorry I'm obviously not making my point very well. I don't think you're nagging @ladygindiva!

The first time I read the OP, it seemed quite poignant, but then when I re-read it I wasn't so sure. The second half is mainly about therapy, and whilst I'm not knocking all therapy, it comes across as someone who is ultimately quite unhappy. Phrases like "inner work" seem like a flag to me that the poster is a bit self-obsessed.

Really though my point was that perhaps they could have communicated better during their doomed relationship. The ex sounds like he wouldn't say boo to a goose, and she says she shouted at him that she hated him. No wonder it didn't work out, but perhaps they just weren't suited to each other.

@Amy1992Brighton if you really read the OP properly it should be very clear that there was someone doing everything possible to communicate with the ex and to try and make things work.

It wasn't the ex.

I hope that your posts are a reflection of the fact that you are with someone who communicates well, doesn't put you down, shares the load and understands what being a partnership means. And if that is so, realise how lucky you are and how there are many women (and men) who are not so lucky.

"Phrases like "inner work" seem like a flag to me that the poster is a bit self-obsessed"

And you know something? People who write that they get red flags when someone else does 'inner work', usually are the ones who most need to do their own inner work.

I'm guessing you've never had your own therapy or worked on yourself? That's as much evident! A person comes across as quite a limited, narrow-minded and ignorant person if others' doing inner work is considered self-obsessed.

How does anyone grow, develop or improve anything if they never do any form of self reflection @Amy1992Brighton ?

As for him "never saying boo to a goose". That is the outward persona that he portrayed to others funnily enough. However, behind closed doors, he could be very difficult, argumentative, impatient, unempathetic, accusatory and sometimes, paranoid. This is in addition to him checking out of family life.

Ommitting to connect, contribute or grow in an intimate relationship is doing an awful lot of damage. A relationship requires a person to "relate." You can not just sit back and "never say boo to a goose" as you naively put it.

Oh maddy maddy maddy. If you consider my post "jumping on you" then you have a lot to learn. You can't post on a thread how you did then claim victimhood. If you want support then make your own thread rather than making a post with opposite views to the main thread point. Thats just showing zero empathy or trolling behaviour, and surely you don't want others to view you as that. I was helping you to grow. Embrace it. ❤

I hope you get all the therapy you need, @Chalkandchina ... I think therapy and self reflection are a good thing, I'm not saying they are all bad, but your original post mentions them quite heavily.

You hadn't previously mentioned your ex's other behaviours - and I'm sorry he was like that. I was only going off the parts in the original post where you said he was unresponsive to the therapist, wouldn't stand up for you against his mum, didn't assert himself about contact time with your children etc. Again, I'm sorry if I have misinterpreted what he is like. I don't know. I'm glad I don't!

@Amy1992Brighton the exh's belittling of OP in social gatherings was in the OP, as was his refusal to take on his share of parenting and choosing to stay up all night watching box sets instead.

@AlwaysTheGoodGirl
You tear rashers off him when he gets back. His actions resulted in your brother going hungry.

You take control of the remote and you turn off the TV. You do not participate any more in the confusion of your children. You refuse to play happy families any more.

And you hide the car keys. Over your dead body should he have the option to take the car out when you need it. He needs to be punished for what he did. Maybe when you make the keys available again there can be a white board in the kitchen with time periods blocked in for each of you. If you deliver food to your brother every evening then he can't have the car in the evening. The needs of a human being for food trump everything else.

You are married to a sociopath BTW.

Ultimately you're going to have to make solid plans to call a screeching halt to this 'relationship'. What your children are exposed to matters. The shit he's making you wade through matters.

Well I'm hardly going to write everything in a single post @Amy1992Brighton. Would you like me to write a book next time?

Yes please

This is brilliant OP x