Threads about how I would never be abused because I’m XYZ really wind me up, does it to anyone else?

[Rainbow03]

I shouldn’t get involved in those threads.

A colleague a couple of years back when I was really suffering from PTSD said to me that I’m far to clever to ever let someone treat me like your husband, I’d never be abused.

Most of these people are coming from a place of never experiencing abuse. Really does my head in now. No wonder people keep quiet.

You just haven't met a con-artist yet........or are not yet aware that you have!

By the time you know, you are on their hook!

@ZeldaWillTellYourFortune no one is saying otherwise. What we are saying is that life is not black and white. Who you are today is not who you are in the future. People can become vulnerable who aren’t vulnerable today. People can have strong foundations weakened by the death of a loved one, illness etc etc. Abusers access vulnerabilities. Being vulnerable is not a problem, it’s not something any of us can avoid, making abuse not something that you are immune to.

Nobody can abuse you without your consent, to paraphrase Eleanor Roosevelt.

Honestly, this is exactly the kind of victim-blaming bullshit that this thread was started about.

Of COURSE people can abuse you without your consent. ALL abuse is done without the victim's consent. It may be done with the victim's acceptance (at least external acceptance), or without them fighting back to the point of leaving, but that is in no way giving consent to the abuse.

Most women who are in an abusive relationship that they're not currently leaving (though many will be wanting to leave or moving towards leaving) are caught in a tangle of hope for better, financial or physical vulnerability, misguided compassion for the abuser or an attempt to protect their children from more direct harms than the abuse towards the woman currently seems to be causing them.

Your comment is sheer ignorance and if it's not ignorance, it's shameful.

I watched my dad die of cancer over the space of a year, it was the worst experience of my life. I sat with him in chemo each time. I held his hand when they they turned his life support off. I could not have been any more destroyed as a person as I was that year. I was outgoing, finished my masters degree, had my own money, my life ahead of me and I couldn’t of given a shit about any of those things. Guess who I met, when my guard was shattered. Guess who exploited me in my weakest hour. My vulnerability, my dying dad, a really sick man.

the title is rather vague and honestly sexual assault (unwanted grope) can happen in an elevator or while exiting a plane anywhere tight basically.
someone verbally assaulting you can happen by some random nut case while walking down the street, i had some strange druggie type take a swing at me while i was crossing the road last summer. as a (retired) nurse i've experienced violence at work by patients; breasts groped, trays of food thrown at me, and a blue streak of verbal abuse by all and sundry.
i'm rather alert and aware but i certainly don't think i'm immune and in certain circumstances the reality is no one is.

The only reason I’ll never be abused is because I was abused as a child and then married an abuser.

Result? I’ve been single for a decade and will never, ever have another relationship again.

I think that some people can be more vulnerable because of their early life experiences, but it’s no-ones fault but the abusers. I think ‘co dependency’ is over used.

I was quite good at protecting myself as an early adult, but looking back this was because no one had ever protected me as a child so I just learnt to be quite good at instinctively keeping away from danger. However that was just the immediate danger, and I found an amazing man who was really kind, supportive, gentle and lovely. And when I had moved in and became pregnant I was in too far to protect myself when he turned up to be a serial cheater and not that nice a person at all.

We are all experts in hindsight. It’s one of the clever tactics of an abuser, never let their victim have enough time to process anything.

Yes, but hindsight is a lesson. Those who have been abused can learn from it, so that they don't stick around for it a second time. Really not sure why that winds you up, it's how life works: you make a mistake, and if you like, you can let it teach you. What's the problem with that? Are you saying that we are actually powerless and it's inaccurate for us to say that we refuse to be abused again?

Yes. I think when people say it it's a form of self-preservation. A way people convince themselves it'll never happen to them. I take it with a pinch of salt.

I hear you OP.

I think even when we start to realise that this isn't healthy relationship, we doubt our judgement - I know I did. Because he didn't hit me it can't have been abusive. I still question whether he was really abusive or not. But when I look back, I just didn't see the red flags and I was a boiling frog.

I have a degree and postgraduate, responsible job etc. But didn't recognise it for what it was.

If I had had Mumsnet back in the early days, I do think I might have got out before I got too entrenched.

@Watchkeys most of the people answering these threads are people who have not been abused, they do not have hindsight. Mine and yours and whoever else has been abused answers and resolutions to our traumas are personal. What heals me doesn’t heal have to heal you. We are not talking about how People choose to see life and heal after the trauma of abuse. The thread was about can you avoid being abused in the first place. Which is no, to be human is to be vulnerable. Some of those poor humans by bad luck will cross the path of a bad person and something bad can happen.

What happens next is human reactions to survive, a lot of them primal, which means they happen without thought unfortunately. Then something happens,
most likely your brain and body are feeling so much in danger it makes you leave, you don’t know why. You go no contact,
a bit of time passes, the brain starts to process little my little and then boom, there’s the abuse, now is the time you only start to see it.

Abusers are very good at identifying the point at which you lose your power.

However, al5hough I'm not disagreeing with you that it can happen to anybody if there is an imperfect storm, I know that if my parents had not groomed me to have no 'self' I would have got turned off by him much sooner.

I might have still had an income, less time "invested" more courage and confidence. Don't misunderstand me, the main reason I didnt get away sooner was that I had nowhere to go and no money when I got there.

So you don't believe that some of us were raised with the same knowledge that you and I learned through being abused? You're essentially saying that no parent is able to raise a child with enough self confidence to avoid/walk away from abusive situations. And that the only way to obtain this is to be abused, first. It's nonsense. It would be disempowering, if those who were raised with emotional intelligence and self respect took any notice, but fortunately, the fact that they were raised this way will ensure that they won't take it on board. You'll get a thread that represents, mostly, people who agree with you, because most of those who don't won't bother to comment.

Absolutely, it's not a reflection on those of us who are clever and have been through this.

I read that belonging to a group of survey responders with the belief "i could never be scammed" put them at more risk of being scammed than being in the group that answered, "im always vigilant and i hope it never happens to me".

@Watchkeys I'd see it as a perfect storm. It's rarely 100% impossible.
A woman coukd value herself but broke. Or value herself and have a child with a disability. I could list off different scenarios here but life is a bit more nuanced than just can you afford to value yourself and leave? The answer could be "yes, but.... I can protect my children more if I don't leave yet".
I left when mine were tiny so that's not my story, but I understand how it is never easy.

So an abuser can abuse anybody they want to then, and it's almost impossible for any of us to not fall prey to it?

What a low opinion to have of people.

It might be that they're talking about a certain type of abuse.

I know they I couldn't be subject to physical abuse by a partner, because it just scares me. I tend to go to the worse place in my head and think it could lead to death.... so I just wouldn't stay.

I also read some threads where women are being verbally abused and belittled on an almost daily basis and I know that's not something I'd be able to be around. Not because I'm too clever... but I know myself.

I read a comment from a woman, who was also with a partner who had kids and he told her the only reason he was with her was so she could look after his kids and for her financial contribution.... he was clear that he didn't love her. This may not be something she considered abuse...BUT this wasn't enough due her to leave. I KNOW that I would never stay in such a relationship where I was being used as a nanny and an ATM.

It's really not about being clever, people who are lawyers, doctors and many other intelligent professionals have been abused. Some abusers are very clever.

I've reflected on a relationship I had when I was 20 and see that I was manipulated (not abused) in certain ways...where they wouldn't happen to me today.

This

@Watchkeys I believe what I believe because life is completely flawed and imperfect. I will raise my daughter to have my knowledge, but she is not me, she will have my knowledge yes. But she is unique, she will have her own traumas in life and will have her own vulnerabilities as I can’t out knowledge that out of her. I can’t stop bad things happening to her. Will I not get sick because I only eat healthy, run everyday, no. Does it make me feel better to do those things yeah but will it actually make me immune no. Will I tell others I am immune, no. Will I blame a sick person for getting sick, no. Will having parents who teach me the ins and out of illness stop me from ever getting them, no. Can I have the best upbringing, the most money, absolute rock solid boundaries and go out in the grass one day living life and get bit by a tic, that’s it Imvulnerable, yes. But despite knowing this I get up and live my life. Do I become cold to other people, selfish, lock myself away and never show my vulnerabilities to anyone, I don’t. As a previous Victim I can use my healing and hindsight to give me strength, I can still be a victim and vulnerable. To not be vulnerable is to not live a full life.

yeh it's not an assault on your intelligence
It's an assault on your boundaries, or even your sense of yourself because when you're young, you're not even conscious of what a boundary is. It's more of a weird feeling of discomfort.
And then, it goes back to your parents, were your groomed to believe that your weird feelings were you being awkward and difficult? Or were you raised to believe that you feeling weird was a good enough reason to say no thank you with the nodding support of your parents.

I know i would never put up with it NOW. I say that, but my entire family of origin has scapegoated me. I sometimes try to communicate with them. Maybe that's a low boundary.

@Rainbow03 I don't want my daughter to have my knowledge. I went through a phase of trying to warn her about everything when she was younger but luckily I realised, no this is doom mongering and age-inappropriate. I didn't get parenting right (either) when she was younger but I've got better. I listen to her now, I hear her, I seeeeeee her, I encourage her to have faith in her own ability but i'm there to step in and help if she asks. I support her ideas. I don't shoot them down but I ask questions about the various next steps. I think now, she's nothing like me, because she has experienced validation and support. She has experienced somebody seeing her and being curious about who she is. So I guess figuring that out just in time (she about about 12) helped us form a much much better relationship that isn't based on me warning her about everything that could go wrong. She's 19 and no boyfriend yet but she does get turned off by crappy behaviour and she gets turned off by mixed messages and half hearted expressions of 'interest' so she's doing better than I was doing at 19. But saying that, she's not invincible I know. Still by her side if she needs me.

@Watchkeys thats like saying that there is no way anyone could ever come up to you in the street and hit you in the face for no reason, it’s entirely possible. Then putting the blame on the person for being in the street. An abuser can abuse anyone in a romantic relationship unless they decided to never ever be in one and to never be vulnerable to another person for the rest of their life. The people who replied with that I believe. They are the same people with acrophobia who would never be in the street to get hit in the first place.

I was raised with enough confidence to walk away and know my own worth. I had no interest in bad boys, I knew I'd be with someone for several years before I would marry them to make sure they would be kind, loyal, reliable, financially secure and able to commit. I had walked away from people who were lovely but then after a year or so the negging started, I walked away from people who didn't know the meaning of loyalty.

Then I met a covert narcissist and spent 25 years with him with absolutely no idea, I waited 4 years before we got married, another 4 before we had a child and I thought we were amazing, turns out he was trying to sleep with anything that moved behind my back the whole time while telling me and appearing to be wonderful, my mum and everyone else thought he was great, the lies and manipulation were incredible.

I absolutely thought I was one of those people it could never happen to because I did everything 'right' and wouldn't put up with any crap. Turns out I was wrong. I'd never say never now.