What will replace relationships?

[JoonT]

I may be talking nonsense, but it seems to me that the conventional relationship, the one most of us grew up believing was the norm, is less and less popular. Obviously men and women are always going to fall in love, have kids, and commit to the long haul, but that's increasingly one of many options, rather than 'the norm'. The young seem so much more cynical and wary of relationships. I know three people in their early 30s who've never bothered at all. When I was a kid (in the 1980s) that would have been considered odd.

So, my question is (assuming I'm not talking rubbish), what do you think will replace the conventional relationship? Until very recently, women needed men. Today, women can pursue a career, own property, even have children without a male partner. As a consequence, a lot are now asking "what's the point of getting involved with a man at all? If somebody really awesome comes along, great, but if not, I'm not going to 'settle' like my grandmother did"

However, people still want the same old things. They still want love and company and security. They still want somebody there for them when they're old. And they still want sexual intimacy (as opposed to random/casual sex, which is generally unfulfilling). Do you think something new could fill the void?

I've thought this too. I can see it being a very sensible set up.

Men are increasingly concerned about themselves not having a sex partner or someone to facilitate their lives as far too many women are simply unwilling to do that anymore.

They've had decades to change and actually figure out how to be the type of human, women would actually want to be around and enjoy being with.

As women no longer invest their lives into a man's, I see more women creating amazing things that benefit society. I also see more women prioritizing their education and career. I also see small groups of women pooling their resources and buying homes together.

What a fascinating thread...

I'm in my 60's so have seen a bit of life and experienced a few relationships. And I'm hoping that I might just the first person who lives to 200

I've always been heterosexual, only really sexually attracted to men. Wouldn't rule out a relationship with a woman but feel like I would need to 'do' more to keep the relationship going.

In late teens / early 20s I think I had a strong biological urge - find the right man, have kids. Despite all the possibilities for women to go it alone, I still think that biological drive is strong. There are so many threads where women are panicing about their age, and sadly even more where they compromise their ideals (e.g. marriage before babies) for the sake of having a child, and then never get the married status they are longing for.

Although there are so many options, there are still many women who seek to be settled long term with one person, and want the stability/commitment/legal protection that marriage brings, and want that person to be a partner for life.

In my 30s, with kids and 2 demanding careers and an 'old fashioned' husband who thought he was the head of the household and that he should have conjugal rights, I was convinced that living apart together was a better model. He didn't and we divorced. I think that the years of a young family are the most challenging in any relationship. Competative tiredness, resentment, unequal load in household responsibilities, financial inequality... I'm not surprised that so many realtionships break down during this phase.

However, I think all too often it lets men off the hook. From being an equal partner in a relationship with equal responsibilities for a family, they see dc EOW and the rest of the time are 'free men' to date someone unencumbered who can give them the attention they craved, and then they marry the new person and have kids, and that cycle starts all over again.

When I divorced I was so happy to be single, determined never again to live with anyone. Then I met my now dh. He was, and is, entirely responsible iin all his attitudes, our relationship is equal in all the ways that matter, after 13 years we combined most of our finances, and 2 years later we got married. 15 years on we still are. At this stage in life (he's retired, I'm doing 'hobby' work) our shared memories are the most important thing. Laughs we've had, trials we've faced together, shared ridicule at our creaking knees and lost car keys. The thought of starting again now horrifies me. I anticipate us being together until...

Well there's another stage: my very elderly FIL has dementia, he drives his previously tolerant wife up the wall. After more than 60 years together, she would prefer not to live in the same space as him

I could imagine living in some kind of communal space with elderly couple friends (with the costs of a professional carer shared between us).

So my life/relationships are/have been conventional. My dc less so. One is a single parent, the other is in a polyamourous relationship.

My thoughts for the future are that there might be more communal living - women (and families) supporting each other, rather than everyone in their isolted box. Models for older people where they can remain part of a community even if their partner leaves or dies or is demented.

My fear is that these models might work for those who have money, flexibility, adaptability. For those who don't there may be unhappy confinement to a single ongoing 'relationship'. And I agree with others that there will be an increasing number of angry left-out men who will prey on the weak and vulnerable.

I remember seeing a seal colony where the female seals and pups were all contented and calving, there were one or 2 dominant males, and the rest of the males were just fighty, angry creatures, biting lumps out of each other.

It's such a refreshing change to see an intellectual discussion on here, as well as insightful and respectful comments. Thank you OP and everyone else, I'm finding this a fascinating thread

Fascinating thread, thank you. I've just ordered Sapiens.

You've all made me think - I've just realised that out of all my fiends, only me and my best friend are single. I could definitely see myself possibly buying property with him at some point in the future.

*friends 😂

My thoughts for the future are that there might be more communal living - women (and families) supporting each other, rather than everyone in their isolated box.

@venusandmars Yes, I agree that communal living would be far more beneficial for most people than our current tendency to have our “own” homes and potentially end up isolated. Sone people prefer their own company, but most of us benefit from collaboration, esp. our mental health.

Isin’t everything just as it has been always?

Everybody I’ve know wants to date, a partner, sex with them + casual - most people are busy collecting ’notches on bedposts’, most want marriage and even more want kids.

Not shitting on op, or this thread, but I don’t understand what this drama is about?

Literally nothing has changed or is changing…
Can someone explain, please?

Nobody is saying that people have given up on relationships. The majority still pursue them, and the majority still marry and have kids. But the number of people who choose to live alone, or who just don’t bother with relationships at all, is increasing. If life expectancy continues to rise, the number will increase even more.

The title IS a bit misleading. I didn’t mean what will replace relationships, more what is going to fill the void for those who opt out.

I'm happily married, albeit we have had and probably will have our challenges. The future doesn't look as straightforward as I used to think. For some reason I see myself in some sort of communal living situation, possibly with DH plus others, or living on my own with lots of good friends and a like minded community nearby.
Either way I see myself being good friends with DH and in each other's life as we have a DC. I think he feels the same, we both have an independent streak. The idea of not being with him isn't horrendous, though I love him so much. I really can't explain it properly. It's like there's an alternate me that could be living a different life and only now at my age (almost 40) I don't find that problematic. In my 20s I definitely felt the societal pull to find a mate and not be left behind.
I also think a group of women raising a bunch of kids together would be amazing. It always feels easy clubbing together with friends and their kids. We just seem to think alike and anticipate what needs doing for everyone, it's harmonious and always fun

As more people choose to divorce or separate and have the options of leaving relationships, which is entirely valid, there will be fewer examples for future generations to see any benefits of remaining together.

Benefits that many do not see at an earlier age are not usually apparent when young, the advantages of keeping family units together, older children, grandchildren, great grandchildren, all still very much together and very secure, is the ideal really.

Not judging, just pointing out those faimly units will not be the norm to create examples for younger generations to aspire to.

Aspirations can change with fashions, and those fashions are being steered into a more individual, independant mode. A mode which seems to be more advantageous for men, to inseminate women and not have to be accountable or responsible for the offspring of those sexual encounters.

I dunno but I have been lately that I feel a bit sorry for men... I think a lot more women will be up for relationships with other women what with the growing awareness that a) heterosexual marriage/LTRs are on the whole better for men than they are for women b) women don't need the involvement of a dick for an orgasm and c) the fact that women can have kids without being in a relationship with a man. Men are going have to work hard to seem like a better prospect than being with a woman. 😉

But realistically, I'm not sure that much will change for most people.

The way the world of work is going, with those who can get jobs having to do three or four just to survive, hardly anyone will have time for a relationship unless they're very, very wealthy. And the very rich - the only ones who'll be able to take advantage of all those, er, lovely scientific advances you mentioned - will probably just design their own VR companion and continue to pay surrogates if they feel the need to replicate....

Oh, okey, I think I understand better now.

Sorry, I just haven’t seen any changes, so was wondering….

I’ll just add that ’being single’ doesn’t really mean person being single these days:
One, people may choose to live alone, but still be in a relationship.
Two, there is so many names to ’pretty much being in a relationship, but just not calling it that’ etc.

So, I’d still say that nothing has really changed, labels are just a little different.
Vast majority of people are still dating, fucking and are (going to be) in a relationship, perhaps under a different label, but it’s still as boring as it ever was😁😂

@Willowtre1 maybe it's harmonious and fun because it's not how you all live every day? Maybe you're all putting the effort in - as many people do at the start of a new relationship.

I recently had a weeks holiday with a good and longstanding friend. However, we paid a lot extra to have separate rooms and we had time apart as well as together - we know each other well enough to know what works and what doesn't.

I think even in some kind of community, there needs to be living apart and living together.

That’s very true. Problem is, we’re all in the same trap (well, most of us) in that we want love and sex and intimacy, etc, but find long-term relationships, and especially living with someone, really flippin hard. Or, to put it another way, I want love and support, but I don’t want to share the TV remote!

As society grows less and less religious and less and less judgemental, I suspect all kinds of weird arrangements will evolve. As you write, being single these days doesn’t always mean being single. But fifty or a hundred years ago it probably did. Things were more clear cut. In the future, they won’t be.

Good point. I agree. There is a certain type of man who’s really struggling. I mean men who crave love and security, and don’t have many friends, but have nothing to offer - ugly, boring men, with shit social skills. Until very recently even men like that could find someone. Women needed a partner. They needed them for security, money, and children. For the vast majority of women, being single just wasn’t an option. Men had the upper hand in all sorts of ways, and they exploited it.

Today that has gone. Women can pursue a career, buy their own home, even have children without a man. As a consequence, a lot of them are asking why they should bother. Or, to put it another way, they can afford to be more choosey. If a woman is going to live with a man, he now has to offer something. If not, most women just think “what’s the point?” And that IS new. Even when I was a kid, back in the ‘80s, most girls just wanted a husband. And if they couldn’t get a good one, they’d settle for a rubbish one. Now, they won’t settle. Men are having to work a lot harder. And the ones who have nothing to offer are being left behind. I’m sure that explains both the high suicide rate among young men, and also the rise of misogyny. Men are frightened, and the fear is turning to anger. They’re frightened because women don’t need them anymore. (Women may like them, love them, care about them, want to share their life with them, etc, but that’s different.)

This thread has been so interesting.
I think men are definitely less 'needed' than before and there is a culture via social media of encouraging self love (which I'm all for) and not accepting under par relationships where you are giving more than you are getting in return.
Definitely much less stigma around being single too, I have a number of single friends in their 40s who are happily solo and have no desire to couple up again (bit if it happens it happens). They already have children though which is key.

I'm a single woman with a child, a career, a house & mortgage. This is already the norm as far as I am concerned.

I will happily consider a new relationship with a man but it could only be on the basis of being equals. I don't need a relationship. It would be a nice addition but not something I will sacrifice my happiness or financial security to achieve.

Surely that's the healthiest way to be.

@MintJulia do you have any support (help from other family members or friends), for example? I’m not trying to be goady at all, but among my friends, I see a huge difference between the single parents who have some support and those who don’t. Those without any have a significantly harder time and that’s why I suggested that communal living might be a viable way forward in the future.

I can’t see communal living work, at all.

Just look MN, so much arguing what is the right way to raise kids.
Most relationship (that hopefully had at some point deeper connection) start to go shit when kids arrive.
Imagine how bad it would be with random women who don’t own anything to anyone.

Even if it wasn’t a big shared house, but living on a same street for example, let’s get real: soon it would be fighting who’s done this and that less than others, shameless users, different views.

And most importantly: many will date/have arragmenrs come over etc.
They just would.
Would other women want random men in their home (if they live together) or they’ll move to be with a man.

As a man i agree with pretty much everything here. Most women don't need the support of a man anymore.

However its also true that competent men need the support of a woman far less than historically.

I have a dishwasher, washing machine, robot hoover and a once weekly cleaner., my place is spotless.

I'm a high earner so have no issues funding my life and future retirement / care.

I'm in a LAT relationship and see my girlfriend frequently for physical intimacy.

In between times we communicate via text or video to support each other emotionally.

I've absolutely no reason to move in with someone or have someone live with me.

Technology and social progress has really moved things on.

I take your points! If conventional relationships aren’t the norm anymore though, parents will still need support from somewhere though. Raising a child on your own is hard work and all the single parents I know irl still need some support from some other adults-not financial, more emotional support mainly from grandparents and siblings/friends, discussing decisions with other trusted adults, sometimes childcare, etc.

I’m assuming that if LTR relationships and having several children isn’t common anymore, those support networks will also change.

@hambone No, I don't have any help but ds is healthy & pretty self sufficient and we get on well. Ex has DS about 20 nights a year so I do get an occasional break, and ds is a teen now so much easier than it was.

We have a nice home and, while not wealthy, we won't starve either. I've been very lucky. I'm not sure we'd be very good at communal living although I can imagine it suiting some.

I'm single. There's not really a void. I have good friends and I think that's the most important thing, as well as enjoying alone time. I love podcasts and feel like they are there speaking with me while I get things done around the house.

I have a child so that's a huge amount of company. I enjoy chatting with multiple people all day every day via messaging apps. I'm very close to them, some I've not seen in years, some I've never met, some are my closest friends. But I never feel alone.

I enjoy my independence and I feel like relationships were fun in the past and now redundant.

If I fell in love I would still keep my independence and want someone who wanted to keep theirs.

It's just different now, but not only because times have changed but because I have, over four decades, and this is the place I'm at now.