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Original poster

Marriage or child first - deadlock

284 replies

Tara40Fi · 14/02/2023 23:12

Feel I’m in a deadlock with DP. He knows that I want to get married. He wants us to have a child. Told him 2 years ago that I’d love to have a family with him but I want to get married first. So for the past two years we’re in a deadlock. I wait for him to be ready to set a date for the wedding, he waits for me to be ready to start TTC. I’ve addressed it with him several times, he keeps saying that we can get married ‘eventually’, but isn’t interested in taking next steps. Thing is, I’m turning 40 next month so I really can’t wait much longer to start TTC. I feel I’ve already wasted the past two years and I don’t know how much time I have left realistically to have a baby. So I feel like giving in now and starting to TTC. He’s very happy for us to have a baby and I don’t think he plans to run off at first opportunity given that he really wants to start a family with me, but it’s obvious that he doesn’t want to get married…I think I’ve hold off as long as possible, and given my age I just need to TTC without being married if I ever want a child. I own a flat and have a good job, so at least I would be ok financially. Not sure why I’m posting because there’s no real solution I guess…I’m just frustrated that we had another nice (Valentines Day) dinner with me hinting at marriage and him brushing it off and changing the topic :(

OP posts:
AllThingsServeTheBeam · 15/02/2023 10:05

Schoolchoicesucks · 15/02/2023 09:57

Do you want a child? Do you want a child with him? Do you want a child with him even if you are not married? Do you want a child with him even if you are not together?

If you do, then crack on and TTC. At 39, I would not be waiting around another year (or more) for the dream wedding if I wanted a child.

However I absolutely agree that this child should have your surname. You should decide whether to put his name on the birth certificate. You should take steps to preserve your earning potential.

I think he's a bit shit if he knows how much you want to get married. It's not just a piece of paper. It's a legal status. It's a statement and celebration of your partnership.

Go into this with your eyes open that he's shown and told you that he doesn't want this legal and public union with you. I'm sorry that you won't get to celebrate your dream wedding. But you can still celebrate becoming a parent. And being mature and independent enough to make your own decision about it.

I'm sorry... - You should decide whether to put his name on the birth certificate.... Wtaf? It would be his child?!

Wishimaywishimight · 15/02/2023 10:11

You need to proceed on the basis that he doesn't want to get married for whatever reason. Stop hoping this will change, it will very likely not.

So your choice is to either have a baby with him or leave him. If you leave you are highly unlikely to meet a new partner in time to have a baby with them.

If you really want a child then forget about marriage and just have the baby.

ZeldaWillTellYourFortune · 15/02/2023 10:20

Wishimaywishimight · 15/02/2023 10:11

You need to proceed on the basis that he doesn't want to get married for whatever reason. Stop hoping this will change, it will very likely not.

So your choice is to either have a baby with him or leave him. If you leave you are highly unlikely to meet a new partner in time to have a baby with them.

If you really want a child then forget about marriage and just have the baby.

That's hardly fair to the new human being that will be created. Women need to stop producing children with shit men!!

It's not fair to saddle someone with a bad / disinterested father and it's not fair to society to perpetuate the problems this causes.

Not having a child isn't the end of the world and it's better than having one in reprehensible circumstances!

Offdutypead · 15/02/2023 10:22

AllThingsServeTheBeam · 15/02/2023 10:05

I'm sorry... - You should decide whether to put his name on the birth certificate.... Wtaf? It would be his child?!

Show quote history

Why buy the cow if you can get the milk for free. Absolutely this should a consideration naming him as the father automatically gives him PR. This should be OP's decision. The only way this man can guarantee parental responsibility is to marry her. This does not affect CMS payments.

MarieRoseMarie · 15/02/2023 10:34

AllThingsServeTheBeam · 15/02/2023 08:55

Yes. That must be it. Oh wise one. How well you seem to know the inner workings of everyone's mind.

Have you actually heard yourself? I can imagine people IRL getting eye ache from all the eyerolling they have to do after having conversations with you

Show quote history

Oh, they don’t bother listening to me. They’re too busy getting married to men who love them and are willing to commit to them. It’s sickening, really 😄

Reugny · 15/02/2023 10:36

AllThingsServeTheBeam · 15/02/2023 10:05

I'm sorry... - You should decide whether to put his name on the birth certificate.... Wtaf? It would be his child?!

Show quote history

Unfortunately some posters on MN think that as an unmarried mother you can stop the father getting his name on the birth certificate.

I know fathers who have.

It very easy if the father pulls their finger out and goes down one of the legal routes to do so.

The birth certificate is a record for the child and the state, and not for either of the parents.

Offdutypead · 15/02/2023 10:39

Reugny · 15/02/2023 10:36

Unfortunately some posters on MN think that as an unmarried mother you can stop the father getting his name on the birth certificate.

I know fathers who have.

It very easy if the father pulls their finger out and goes down one of the legal routes to do so.

The birth certificate is a record for the child and the state, and not for either of the parents.

Show quote history

The gov.uk website disagrees with you

www.gov.uk/register-birth/who-can-register-a-birth

Reugny · 15/02/2023 10:43

Offdutypead · 15/02/2023 10:39

The gov.uk website disagrees with you

www.gov.uk/register-birth/who-can-register-a-birth

Show quote history

Your link is garbled.

Regardless fathers who are interested in having a relationship with their child can take legal measures to ensure they end up on their child's birth certificate.

Schoolchoicesucks · 15/02/2023 10:45

AllThingsServeTheBeam · 15/02/2023 10:05

I'm sorry... - You should decide whether to put his name on the birth certificate.... Wtaf? It would be his child?!

Show quote history

Yes. But if they are not married then the mother gets to decide whether he goes on the birth certificate or not. If they were married, he would be able to register the birth. As he won't marry her, he's legally unable to do so.

mindutopia · 15/02/2023 10:47

If it's just a piece of paper, why won't be just do it? It sounds very much like it's a whole lot more significant to him than a piece of paper. The reality is that marriage sets up a legal contract that makes a family and a household more secure. You should both want that security before you bring another person into the mix. And frankly, it's wonderful to enjoy the day and a little honeymoon together without having to drag a small child around.

You are right that at the moment, you are more financially secure in terms of home ownership, but being self-employed, you're quite precarious in terms of employment rights/mat pay/leave. If you have a baby and don't get married, will he take the parental leave and cut back his hours to accommodate childcare? Because given your self-employment, you aren't the obvious person to carry the burden of the career impact.

Schoolchoicesucks · 15/02/2023 10:47

Reugny · 15/02/2023 10:43

Your link is garbled.

Regardless fathers who are interested in having a relationship with their child can take legal measures to ensure they end up on their child's birth certificate.

Show quote history

Yes, of course he can take legal steps after the fact to end up on the birth certificate. But he doesn't seem bothered about taking legal steps to be in a legally recognised relationship with his wife. So would he bother yo do so for his child?

Offdutypead · 15/02/2023 10:52

www.gov.uk/register-birth/who-can-register-a-birth

Offdutypead · 15/02/2023 10:52

www.gov.uk/register-birth/who-can-register-a-birth

Offdutypead · 15/02/2023 10:53

www.gov.uk/register-birth/who-can-register-a-birth

Reugny · 15/02/2023 10:54

Schoolchoicesucks · 15/02/2023 10:47

Yes, of course he can take legal steps after the fact to end up on the birth certificate. But he doesn't seem bothered about taking legal steps to be in a legally recognised relationship with his wife. So would he bother yo do so for his child?

Show quote history

Some guy's care more about their child than being in a relationship or married to their child's mother.

Their child carries their DNA their child's mother doesn't.

Reugny · 15/02/2023 10:59

Offdutypead · 15/02/2023 10:53

www.gov.uk/register-birth/who-can-register-a-birth

Not sure what you are trying to show with this.

No he can't register the birth but he can come to the registry office with the mother to register it like my DP did and one of my neighbour's DP's did.

Incidentally neither my DP or my neighbours DP have any claim to our properties not being married.

AllTheThingsIWantAreHere · 15/02/2023 11:07

Have either of you married before? Does he have kids?

Ceryneianhind · 15/02/2023 11:10

Ikeameatballs · 14/02/2023 23:18

He doesn’t want to get married.

Your choices are these:

TTC with him regardless
Leave him and look for another partner to TTC with
Leave him and TTC alone
Stay with him and wait for him to change his mind on marriage, meanwhile making the chances of getting pregnant less each day

For me in your shoes I’d secure myself as much as I could financially etc and crack on TTC. Would I stay if TTC was unsuccessful? Quite possibly not if marriage was still important to me.

I wouldnt be TTC with him - he doesnt want to get married, but has basically told the op that he does eventually. IF she manages to reproduce

So if OP cannot get pg (either his issue or hers), then what? He's going to trade her in for someone who can?

Pinkfrogs45 · 15/02/2023 11:15

TTC but say any children will have your last name, if you ever get married then you can all have the same last name

Ceryneianhind · 15/02/2023 11:17

Luredbyapomegranate · 15/02/2023 00:05

Blimey you aren’t 17. Marriage is a contract that protects you financially, it’s not about a white veil.

Just tell him you are booking a registry office and ask him if he wants March or April.

Assert yourself ffs. You are nearly 40, waiting around for Mr masterful is not working out. If you want a family make it happen. Do not allow yourself to be financially fucked over by not getting married - it’s not just about you it’s about your future child.

Just tell him you are booking a registry office and ask him if he wants March or April.

He doesnt want to get married - forcing him to go to a registry office isnt going to change that
OP deserves so much better

JustHereWithMyPopcorn · 15/02/2023 11:18

Married first, too many stories of women having children outside of marriage and being done over by men later.

Buenosfairies211 · 15/02/2023 11:21

Wishimaywishimight · 15/02/2023 10:11

You need to proceed on the basis that he doesn't want to get married for whatever reason. Stop hoping this will change, it will very likely not.

So your choice is to either have a baby with him or leave him. If you leave you are highly unlikely to meet a new partner in time to have a baby with them.

If you really want a child then forget about marriage and just have the baby.

Doesn’t that put op in quite a vulnerable position though? What if, God forbid, the baby has health problems and she can’t work? What if she is ill after the birth? What if the childcare options in her area are few and far between? All of those scenarios could potentially lead to the op taking a massive financial hit. And so could having a sibling pretty soon after their first baby.

I would never have a child with someone I wasn’t married to but that’s a very personal choice I know.

I am sorry you are in this position op. What is most worrying is that he isn’t willing to have a frank and open discussion with you about this and you are reduced to making hints. I suppose all of this depends on how long you have been together and when you first discussed marriage and dc?

Offdutypead · 15/02/2023 11:23

Reugny

What that link demonstrates to me is that it is the unmarried mother's choice whether the father is on the birth certificate or not. It shouldn't be a given if parents aren't married.

Buenosfairies211 · 15/02/2023 11:31

Offdutypead · 15/02/2023 07:21

ChrisTrepidation

I am in no way having a go at OP, but the narrative that a man has somehow "stolen" your fertility window smacks of a learned helplessness and an external locus of control.

Any reasonably intelligent woman knows that her best chance of carrying a healthy pregnancy to term is to have her children around 23-37ish. There is no conspiracy, this information has been freely available for at least 30 years.

Women need to take control of their own lives, their fertility, their finances and their living arrangements.

External locus of control? How patronising!

Real life doesn’t always go to plan with milestones being hit in a sequential timely manner like a well oiled machine. Call me naive but marriage involves love and other messy emotions and another unpredictable human being. And women’s fertility doesn’t always fit in to a perfect timetable. Have some compassion and stop blaming the op who has come on-line for support not sneering!

LimeCheesecake · 15/02/2023 11:31

In my experience - men who claim marriage is just a piece of paper so don’t want to get married, know full well it’s not just a piece of paper, any more then their employment contract is just a piece of paper or their car insurance is just a piece of paper or house deeds etc. they know full well it’s a legal contract and one they want to avoid being in for whatever reason. (If he really thought it was meaningless yet important to you and he wanted you to be happy, he’d go along with getting this meaningless piece of paper to keep you happy. He’s not because he doesn’t think that at all.)

you have to work on the principle the reason he wants to avoid being legally tied to you is that he doesn’t see your relationship lasting and wants it to be as easy as possible to walk away. That might not be the reason, but in the absence of a real explanation - you have to plan for the worse.

at 39 i would try for a baby but be clear the baby is having your surname, you are going back to work full time and while his “traditional” industry may refuse flexible working requests /part time working requests, he is the one who doesn’t want the legal protection of marriage so he has to at least apply for part time /flexible working.

keep the house in your name, make all decisions based on the premise your relationship is temporary, even if you do end up spending the rest of your lives together.