His boss, my problem,

[notmyissue]

Posting because I need to get it off my chest.

DH bosses awkwardness is making my life difficult.

When we had children we sat down and worked out a split of childcare. I do all the mornings and drop offs. Then we split the pick ups 50/50.

On the two days he does the pick ups, I work late to make up the hours lost from all the drop offs.

His boss keeps booking on site meetings on the company WFH day, and late meetings on the day he needs to leave on time. So he can't do pick up.

My DH just accepts this, sends me a message saying he can't do pick up and then expects me to pick up the slack. Meaning I have to shuffle meetings arounds, let people down, and make up the hours in the evening or over lunch.

It's driving me up the wall! Burning me out and making me feel like keeping his boss happy is more important than me being happy. But his job pays more than mine, so it's difficult to risk pushing back.

Does the nursery close at 6 or can you book them in for slightly longer? I know it's already a long day for them but either extend nursery so he can still do pick ups or get a local person to collect them and take then home.

Failing that, instead of telling his boss that he has to collect the children he should block it out on his calendar as some sort of non negotiable study/evening class, or something else masculine enough that his boss doesn't try to scupper it, as collecting children is women's work after all

When you leave it to your DH to sort it out, it'll stop. It's his problem but he's making it yours by assuming you'll just do it and you rearrange everything and work late to cover for his problem.

Does he not have any women coworkers that need to leave on time?

He needs to block out those times in his calendar with something besides pickup.

Given your updates he really needs to push back, OP.

It is 2022. A man leaving work (on time) twice a week to pick up his children is perfectly reasonable behaviour.

If it is indeed a power thing (and it might well be) then your DH needs to rebalance that power. The employer/employee relationship works both ways. It will feel daunting to him to push back and say no, but he may find that his currency at work will actually increase if, speaking gently, he stops being such a doormat.

I agree with previous posters that you just have to refuse to do his minimal share. Out of 10 drop off's and pick up's he does 2! That is terrible. He chose to have the kids too, so he needs to make sacrifices and not just lump it all on you. So what if his boss wants him to do something else, he is free to do what he likes on hours he is not contracted to work and he is free to work from the location his contract states.

he can go back to his HR and request flexible working again, and put that he leaves at 4pm not 5 on his pick up days, and works an hour later on aother day?

Agree it's his boss being an arse, but it isn't your problem, you already do all the drop offs. Do not reduce your hours or compromise your earning (and future employment and pensions) in any way - you are already stepping up and so must DH

And in all honesty looking for a few people to go. 'I was in a similar situation, it was tough but it got easier once they were a bit older. So stick in there'

Frankly? (not in UK so schools different) Kindergarten / pre-school was easier because fixed hours. School had later starts and earlier finishes and without a childminder we'd never have managed. So in your shoes I'd start looking now so you can get a routine established and the DCs can get to know them.

If my boss tries to schedule a meeting for after my contracted working hours, I just say "Sorry I can't do that on Thursday, how about Friday morning?"

He could even wind them up back by suggesting a time he'll be at work (or could be) but the boss won't want to be - like early in the morning.

if it's that the meeting starts within working hours but often goes on later, he just needs to say "that's fine but I will need to leave on the dot at 5.30". No need to give an explanation. (not least because they already know!!!)

It sounds like your husband either doesn't like standing up to people, or has decided that he's fucked if his career is going to suffer because of having kids when yours could be the one to suffer instead.

Please DO try saying no next time and see what happens. Even patient/flexible employers are going to start seeing you as flaky or less available if you often have to shoot off unexpectedly.

I also don't think he should come up with a different excuse about leaving early. Why should he? Children in nursery have to be collected before the nursery shuts. It already is a non-negotiable. The idea that women's responsibilities to their employers are somehow lesser than men's is never going to change until men step up and accept their share of the responsibility - even if that does mean upsetting a dinosaur boss.

Sorry to hear this OP, sounds stressful. I do think your issue is with your husband though, he needs to be more assertive and say 'I'm picking up the kids then, can we reschedule?'. He shouldn't be apologetic to his boss, just matter of fact about it.

Hope you get it resolved.

Yes or just "sorry I can't do that time on X day" and suggest another time.

His employer doesn't own him.

Does he have any discretion in his own job to make plans? Or does the boss know what he's doing at all times?

Another angle OP - why the hell should your employer put up with having the value they get from you eroded because your husband doesn't want to have an uncomfortable discussion with his boss?

I think you sound really upset about this and that's totally understandable as you rightly see that your husband is putting himself first.

I wouldn't let it fester.

He needs to push back on his boss, he's not asking for flexibility. He's just going to stick to his contracted working hours/conditions regularly.

If I ask someone to work outside their hours (and I do occassionally), they have every right to say no, and it doesn't reflect badly against them. Ideally they might offer an alternative day etc. but they have a right to say, sorry, I cannot do that then.

He needs to push back and say no. It sounds like HR aren't going to insist he does it, they are the ones pointing out that it isn't in the contract. Perhaps he could say that he has talked to HR, and they've clarified that these working times are not contracted and he is not required to be there.

As an alternative, can he do the drop offs (all of them) and you do the pick ups? Then he can stay as late as he likes and go into the office on a Friday if he's not going to refuse to do so.

sends me a message saying he can't do pick up and then expects me to pick up the slack.

This is a DH problem. I get that it's his boss, but your DH has agreed to a certain split of responsibilities and is just assuming you will pick up the slack for him.

I see two types of fathers at work, those who are not available for some part of each day (or some days in the week). They get this agreed with their management and stick to it, cannot accommodate short notice changes ?but do occasionally with more notice).

The other kind are almost gleeful at not being able to help with the parenting, counting it a win anytime they have an excuse to be let off.

Which do you think your DH is?

Unless your H is going to start pushing back and saying ‘sorry I can’t do the 5pm meeting on Tuesday, can we do this earlier or the next day?’ Then nothing will change.

he has already spoken to HR and they’ve told him to leave on time so he needs to do that, he can’t be fired for leaving on time.

your company may be flexible but you are damaging your career / reputation by always dropping things and not making up your hours when he drops you in it so he needs to pull his weight.
he just doesn’t want to because he doesn’t want to rock the status quo. It’s 2 days a week FFS, he can stay late the rest of the week if he wants to .

He's going to have to push back on his boss or get a job that's more flexible. I wouldn't be surprised if your work isn't getting frustrated that it's always you having to be flexible already.

He needs to push back. In my world it has become a lot more common for both sexes to say "I can't do that call I'm picking up/dropping off".

These meetings are scheduled to run after his contracted working hours , he is well within his rights to say no, even if it was just to go for a walk, no explanation needed. Bad management to schedule meetings so close to end of day

Are you getting a childminder to help when the 3yr old starts school? Or are there good breakfast and after school clubs available for the times you need? If a childminder, perhaps you need to start that arrangement a bit earlier? Although I know the cost will be a kicker.

I agree with others that your husband is as much the problem as his boss. He needs to start blocking out the time in his diary that he needs to be available to collect the kids and decline any meeting requests his boss puts into this time. So if he needs to leave the office /his desk at 4.30pm or 5pm put that in as a recurring appointment and makes it a priority. HR have already told him that he doesn’t need to do a flexible working request because picking up the kids fits in with his current working arrangements. He now needs to protect his time to make this work and if his boss makes that impossible take it up with HR.

In my experience this is not something that becomes easier as your kids get older because childcare becomes less seamless when they start school - dropping them off at 8.30am and collecting them at 6pm from the same place will seem like an absolute luxury when they are at primary school and you’re juggling childminders, breakfast clubs, afterschool club, extra curricular activities, cover for all the inset days and public holidays!

Agree with PP who say your DH needs to push back - let him experience some of the juggling conflict us working mums have been dealing with for decades! Yes, it may mean that sometimes the interesting task or meeting goes to someone else. That’s the reality of juggling parenthood with paid employment. And the more that dads do this, the more people like his boss will have to start thinking about their approach. (And his boss might also start noticing how efficient your DH is precisely because he has to leave on time).

At some level, he assumes this is easier for you and that your career should take the hit because you’re female. That’s not right.

This is a very bad dynamic and very disrespectful of your career.

Perhaps he needs to move job.

Do not allow him to compromise your job.

I would take this very seriously and tell him apologies are neither acceptable or good enough.

This is deal breaker stuff.

He is allowing his boss to dictate your job.

He did talk to HR about a request. But was told that the WFH Friday was already in his contract, and because he just needed to leave on time and not early on the other day it wouldn't be required.

This is the really important point. WHat's happening here is that your DH's work is asking him to do things out of his contract and he is agreeing. Now, to a certain extent, I think this is normal in many industries and so in itself, it's not a problem. The problem is a) is his office/boss doing this on purpose and b) is your DH not pushing back sufficiently?

If it's the former, you and your DH need to discuss whether he needs to consider a complaint or a new job or some other thing that will solve the problem.

If it's the latter, then you need to have a tough conversation with your DH. Unfortunately, in my experience, men will always find a reason to maintain their job is less flexible. eg, if he works in Tesco and she has the WFH office job, he can't be flexible because "shifts" and "letting the team down". If she is the Tesco worker and he has the WFH office job then it's all, "but I earn more, so I can't risk pissing my boss off".

I would be very interested to know how any women in your DH's office cope....

I had a manager who was similar - if I ever worked from home (rare) he would deliberately schedule things in to ensure I worked beyond my contracted hours. If I was in the office, he’d schedule meetings at the end of the day to make sure I stayed later. It was infuriating because I knew he was 100% doing it on purpose. The only way I overcame it was to schedule the time out in my diary which you say your DH has done, but instead of calling it ‘pick ups’, call it something work related or simply schedule it as OoO and be ruthless about declining meeting requests which clash.

Definitely a DH problem.

He just sends you a text, then assumes that somehow you'll 'sort it' ??

So he's just 'offloading' his 'responsibilities' rather than simply tell another man 'no' ??

Doesn't matter that the other man is his boss ! What if your boss gets 'snarky' because it's always you 'taking up the slack' ?? Will he then 'relent' and tell his boss 'no' ? i sincerely bloody doubt it !

Don't let this simply become the 'norm' for you as a parent ! Because, it never ends ! It's whenever either child is
unwell
has an accident
nursery/school inset days
school holidays
play dates
birthday parties
sports classes
extra curricular activities
Xmas parties
School stuff/parents evenings/costume days/fundraising days/sports days....

Trust me, the bloody list is endless with everything required for 2 kids at different ages, and it carries on until they're bloody adults !!

You started with having a discussion about joint parenting 'jobs', but he's already NOT keeping HIS side of the agreement...

Have another talk, and actually divide ALL drops/pick ups, as well as decide who takes time off when they're ill or for holidays etc, and STICK TO IT !
Regardless of what anyone's 'boss' or 'colleagues' has to say about it !