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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

DP said I was abusing him when I reacted to this behaviour

146 replies

Louyt · 11/08/2022 07:36

I can’t get my head around it. I know my reactions WERE abusive objectively but I feel like his own behaviour is now overlooked and I’m made to feel guilty for being pushed to breaking point. We found out I was pregnant around 8 weeks ago which was a surprise as we had been using condoms. However at new year we had both said we’d ttc this year at some point and he was happy when we found out…More so than me as I was quite shocked and scared though wanted the baby.

Two weeks go by and suddenly he’s asking me ‘what I did’ to the condom. Not exactly being nasty but clearly suspicious of me and frowning and being cold. I answer him and talk about it, obviously saying I have no idea how it happened just like he doesn’t. He would then randomly bring it up at tomes which was v upsetting and confusing, to the point where I (wrongly) ended up asking him to leave for a while as I was not able to cope emotionally with the sudden questions all the time. He’s said this was completely out of order and how dare I have made that demand.

He seemed to move past it but then became generally accusatory alongside drinking increased amounts. Asked me once if I had been in his wallet - I hadn’t. Had I opened his post - I hadn’t. I was really really insulted and stressed by this and shouted at him, swore and said i was sick of him putting me through this for no reason. When I worked away a couple of nights both evenings he had got himself too drunk to talk so had to put the phone down. Two days I didn’t actually hear from him at all as he was so drunk he didn’t have his phone even during the day. Again I was v upset with him and in his worlds verbally abusive. He forgot the first scan and was pretty much silent all the way to it, made me feel really awkward and uncomfortable in the car. We had a huge row on the way back as he again was barely speaking and didn’t say why when I asked - embarrassed to say I threw my sandwich on the footwell!

Im not saying I’m usually some angel but I’ve never felt so distressed/confused/alone before and it’s made me feel genuinely out of character. I know that these things are abusive so he’s right about that. I’ve apologised for them but feel he takes no responsibility at all for his side and I’m left feeling absolutely dreadful that I’ve done these things and called him names… which has apparently made him feel he’s done nothing wrong.

i know people will this this is simply toxic and just leave but it’s more than that for me. I feel horrendously guilty now that this is all my fault, that I am awful and actually he’s done nothing wrong really in comparison to me at least. I have a terrible guilt complex at the best of times and I am beating myself up despite feeling so sure he was in the wrong initially. I feel so confused.

OP posts:
Jewel1968 · 11/08/2022 09:33

When I read you saying how abusive you were I had to reread your post because I thought I had missed something. I hadn't! You weren't abusive.

I wonder if he thinks you had an affair and that the baby isn't his. Perhaps he doesn't understand that condoms fail sometimes.

SteveHarringtonsChestHair · 11/08/2022 09:34

YellowPlumbob · 11/08/2022 07:59

Classic DAVRO and a man becoming abusive during pregnancy. Seek outside support from Women’s Aid.

I thought DARVO before I even opened the thread. Reading it didn’t change my mind. I’m sorry OP, he’s an abusive twat. Of course you reacted to his nasty behaviour, silent treatment (stonewalling) and accusations. I would assume he’s accusing you of infidelity tbh. He knows HE used condoms so he thinks you’ve shagged someone else, hence the suspicions about you going through his stuff and getting blind drunk when you went out without him.

He sounds like a nasty piece of work and not someone I’d choose to be the father of my child. I get that at your age it feels like now or never, but imagine this behaviour towards you and your child for the rest of your life.

Louyt · 11/08/2022 09:34

@BeggarsMeddle i think I did change my behaviour a bit to accommodate what he wanted but that was my choice wasnt it, it’s not his fault I accepted that. I think I just considered he was a decent man, decent job, stable home, quiet, not laddish etc. And I thought nobody is perfect and me and him did get on really well. I was early thirties when I met him too so I was keen to make it work.

OP posts:
Nautica · 11/08/2022 09:35

At the very least, there needs to be a separation for a while to reflect, but it'll be much harder to leave whilst you have a baby and things are settled. It's sensible to live apart, even if still in contact, if you can. Family support available?

Elsiebear90 · 11/08/2022 09:37

CheekyHobson · 11/08/2022 09:24

He sounds exactly like my best friend’s husband, she was his first relationship as well in his 30s. He says he wants something, they both agree to do it, only when it happens he turns nasty, gets paranoid and starts accusing her of all sorts, says he doesn’t want it or never really wanted it or has changed his mind, starts drinking more and generally just blames her for everything including his awful behaviour

Yes, I do think the OP's boyfriend has got some serious unprocessed issues from his childhood. He sounds chillingly like my ex - and the guy above. Will say he's keen for something, the plan moves ahead, once there's no going back he starts acting funny but insisting he's fine, and then weeks, months or years down the lines it's all "I never wanted that" "You forced me into it" "I felt like I couldn't say no or you'd go crazy" etc. Rewriting history, behaving like a total asshole and more importantly, feeling fully entitled to behave like an asshole because he (apparently sincerely) feels he's been abused or taken advantage of first.

Please, OP, pay very close attention to this behaviour and see it as a massive red flag. It's a dysfunctional pattern and it will repeat over and over again. It's nothing to do with you, it's a product of his dysfunctional background, paranoid mindset, and constant feeling of victimhood.

False accusations are a covert form of abuse and one that's a massive headfuck. I was accused of so many things by my ex - lying, cheating, forcing him to do various things, taking drugs, lazing around, treating him as sub-human - none of which was true and of course because none of it was true, he didn't have the slightest shred of evidence for his accusations! Didn't stop him from making them though, and in a way that seemed absolutely sure of himself at the time. And because I was a decent person, I felt horrified that he thought such terrible things of me and tied myself up in knots wondering what I could have done to give him that idea, and how I could prove that I wasn't the awful person he thought I was.

Get out now, OP. You will be an absolute shell of yourself in years to come if you don't.

Totally agree with this.

My best friend’s husband has a lot issues from childhood as well.

OP this is just the tip of the iceberg, you’re going to spend the rest of your life fending off accusations, treading on eggshells trying to keep him happy and living in fear of the next thing that could set him off for months.

dehloh · 11/08/2022 09:42

i think I did change my behaviour a bit to accommodate what he wanted but that was my choice wasnt it, it’s not his fault I accepted that.

It is absolutely his fault you felt you needed to do that. That is manipulation. This man is abusing you. Forget your reaction or throwing down a sandwich and remember that he is playing tiny games insider your head where he acts like a cunt and you change your behaviour to accommodate.

He. Is. Abusing. You.

Maray1967 · 11/08/2022 09:42

OP, please read this carefully. There aren’t many women who would stay calm if their partner basically accused them of tricking them into a pregnancy. That is what he has done.
Everything stems from that. Your upset, name-calling, chucking the sandwich etc - it all comes from that. Your behaviour has not been perfect but it is entirely understandable. He is equating abusive with shouting etc . Abuse can also be delivered quietly and calmly - and that is what he has done.

I would not be able to get past my DH accusing me of having tampered with contraception to trick him into a pregnancy. But he would never have done that.

I would sit him down calmly and make it clear to him what he has done and how awful it is. I would act according to his response. Abject apology? I would try to move forward with him. Continued gaslighting and denial of any fault on his part? End the relationship.

Louyt · 11/08/2022 09:44

dehloh · 11/08/2022 09:42

i think I did change my behaviour a bit to accommodate what he wanted but that was my choice wasnt it, it’s not his fault I accepted that.

It is absolutely his fault you felt you needed to do that. That is manipulation. This man is abusing you. Forget your reaction or throwing down a sandwich and remember that he is playing tiny games insider your head where he acts like a cunt and you change your behaviour to accommodate.

He. Is. Abusing. You.

@dehloh i think the poster was asking generally about the relationship. I meant I went into it knowing he could be quite selfish with his time etc. So I chose to stay in that and weighed up overall that I wanted to give it a go and to be honest I did fall in love, he seemed so decent and not in your face etc.

OP posts:
Raindancer411 · 11/08/2022 09:44

After reading all that I seriously would be going this alone. No way would I want a person who drinks heavily around a newborn. I would move out and if you really wanted to make a go have counselling.

MyneighbourisTotoro · 11/08/2022 09:44

Honestly OP you were not abusive, you lots your temper and anyone would in those circumstances.
He is gaslighting you into thinking you are the bad guy.

I’d seriously be considering my future and the options available to me, not only will you be tied for him to life he will play a massive role in the upbringing of your child and that is something you need to carefully think about, there are so many woman in the world tied to abusive partners who continue to control them despite being separated.
I know an abortion is not an easy choice for many and obviously not something that should feel forever on you either but from my own experience I would personally go down that route rather than have a man like that in my life forever and the possible implications it would have on the child and their own future.

It’s time to stop blaming yourself, you have taken accountability for your actions and the next step is to remove the source otherwise he will continue to treat you this way and it will be a downward spiral.

No matter what choices you make I really do wish you all the best, I have been in more than one abusive situation, it leaves a horrible lasting foot print and I wouldn’t wish it on anyone.

newbiename · 11/08/2022 09:45

lolorwow · 11/08/2022 09:25

OP, how many weeks pregnant? 8 weeks!

She found out 8 weeks ago

Louyt · 11/08/2022 09:47

What’s hard is he has lots of texts with me calling him a cunt etc and saying he needs to leave etc. In isolation it looks wholly like I am just awful.

i know he will re read them in work etc and make himself think I’m terrible again. I hate that I lost my temper. I was so so upset with it all.

I think I’m going to tell a friend today. I’ve not told anyone yet.

OP posts:
WandaWomblesaurus · 11/08/2022 09:49

YellowPlumbob · 11/08/2022 07:59

Classic DAVRO and a man becoming abusive during pregnancy. Seek outside support from Women’s Aid.

This.
Keep your baby.
Make plans for him to leave.
Make sure you have support and don't keep his behaviour a secret from your family.

Tippexy · 11/08/2022 09:50

Are you and your baby going to stay with him?

BeggarsMeddle · 11/08/2022 09:53

Louyt · 11/08/2022 09:34

@BeggarsMeddle i think I did change my behaviour a bit to accommodate what he wanted but that was my choice wasnt it, it’s not his fault I accepted that. I think I just considered he was a decent man, decent job, stable home, quiet, not laddish etc. And I thought nobody is perfect and me and him did get on really well. I was early thirties when I met him too so I was keen to make it work.

It is not your fault - honestly. Think about it. If we'd been taught about about all the different types of relationships at school we'd be more aware. But we aren't, and sadly, our ignorance means we don't always respond to and reject these behaviours in the way we ought. Hindsight is wonderful.

You have some of the knowledge now so you can do what is best for you. Being naive is not a crime. The best thing we can do is learn from our experience and know what to look out for in the future to protect ourselves.

At this stage it is probably still all bewildering and you'll likely still have massive doubts. You may still be hoping that you can do something to save this relationship. Trust us when we say we believe it is not a salvageable situation. His behaviours haven't changed and won't change for the long term. You may see a temporary let up though. Only temporary.

You may even find yourself faced with a man crying and begging you not to end it but try to remember all the behaviours that have got you to this point of posting on Mumsnet.

Louyt · 11/08/2022 09:55

You know more than anything I just feel devastated I made such a silly choice in man.

Without sounding arrogant I had my fair share of choice and why on earth did I pursue this. I don’t know what I was thinking. Massively taken in by good job and stable looking life.

If I end it he will absolutely want no involvement as he will see it as a ticket to resume his life in full. He already found it hard to accommodate me I think.

OP posts:
TommySaid · 11/08/2022 09:55

At the very least, there needs to be a separation for a while to reflect, but it'll be much harder to leave whilst you have a baby and things are settled. It's sensible to live apart, even if still in contact, if you can. Family support available?

I agree.
This isn’t healthy for anyone, including the baby.

You need to separate for now and both have some space.
Then you can hopefully communicate like adults and decide whether to try and start the relationship up again or if it is time to end things completely.

This relationship will end eventually.
But you can decide whether to try and keep it going for as long as possible and be stressed, upset and act out constantly.
Or if you think enough is enough and you put your unborn baby first and realise it’s not a healthy environment to be brought up in and end things sooner rather than later.

I agree with the PP that a trial separation should be done asap as it’s so much easier doing these things before a baby arrives.

Louyt · 11/08/2022 09:56

@BeggarsMeddle thank you. Can’t even believe I am posting tbh :(

OP posts:
dehloh · 11/08/2022 09:56

i think the poster was asking generally about the relationship. I meant I went into it knowing he could be quite selfish with his time etc. So I chose to stay in that and weighed up overall that I wanted to give it a go and to be honest I did fall in love, he seemed so decent and not in your face etc

The point is he manipulated you into accepting that. There is nothing decent about a man like this.

doodlywoodlydingdong · 11/08/2022 09:56

Op, look at the words you have used to describe your day to day feelings since since you got pregnant. Ask in relation to your partner.

Scared
Anxious
Feeling sick with anxiety
Begging
Pleading
Crying

And look at his behaviour. He Denies any problem, remains ultra calm while treating you terribly and pushing you to breaking point with his horribleness. Then, like others said, he Attacks you by saying that YOU are abusive ( he is Reversing the victim ( you) and the offender ( him). This is called DARVO and is absolute text book domestic abuse. Is very common for it to start in pregnancy. His drinking escalation is a HUGE red flag and this is only going to get worse.

You can not bring a baby into this relationship. If you carry on with the pregnancy he will be tied to you for the rest of your life. If he is trying to control and manipulate you now, you Honestly think he won't try to do that through a child? If you intend to go ahead with this pregnancy then you need to get rid of him and move away before the baby is born. Your options will be very limited after both as he can apply to court to stop you moving away etc.

CheekyHobson · 11/08/2022 09:57

i think I did change my behaviour a bit to accommodate what he wanted but that was my choice wasnt it, it’s not his fault I accepted that. I think I just considered he was a decent man, decent job, stable home, quiet, not laddish etc. And I thought nobody is perfect and me and him did get on really well. I was early thirties when I met him too so I was keen to make it work.

Tale as old as time. I was exactly the same. And there's nothing about what you did that was terribly wrong - you were, perhaps, overly accommodating, but in the course of normal relationships, there is an expectation of give and take. You give happily in the unspoken expectation that sometime it will be your turn to be prioritised. With healthy relationships this expectation rarely even rises to the level of conscious awareness, because it doesn't need to - your turn does come, and nothing feels 'off'.

With dysfunctional relationships, your turn never does come, and when you start feeling that things are 'off', your mind makes justifications that allows you to continue seeing the other person in a positive light. You tell yourself that it's not them, it's a pattern you've fallen into, and sort of your fault. But if you bring it up, your partner will protest that there's no imbalance, or if it is, your expectation that it would be rebalanced by now is OTT because they've been going through a very hard patch, or you're being oversensitive. Or they promise to make amends, but the amends last only a short time before it's back to the same old story - them first, you second. Then the cycle repeats.

Part of the trouble is that there are a whole range of upsetting/weird/off/difficult behaviours that initially present in dysfunctional relationships. When you see each one for the first or second time, you see them as being discrete, not part of a larger character context of selfishness, lack of empathy, blame, paranoia, etc. So you give each of them the benefit of the doubt. It can take a long time before you start to see them again and again, and the pattern becomes clear.

Selfishness, false accusations of bad behaviour on your part, acting the victim and blaming you, heavy drinking, 'forgetting' the scan - they're all part of a larger pattern of poor emotional control, faulty logic and executive function, a mindset that externalises blame, lacks empathy and is self-centred.

Guys like this regard themselves as individuals who have to fight to be the winner in win/lose situations even with their partner (and resent it deeply if they feel they 'have to' let you win), and not a member of a couple who are both seeking win/win situations.

Daleksatemyshed · 11/08/2022 10:03

Sorry Op, he lied, the ttc for him was just talk, and talk is cheap. He wanted you as an add on to his life, an extra, and for everything else to stay the same.
He feels trapped and angry and the nice guy has gone. Plan for you and the baby to go on without him.

bluewhitegrey · 11/08/2022 10:06

@Louyt why do you think you should not leave him? He doesn't even have to be nasty to just leave if you are unhappy with a dp.
And yet he is being very nasty and as others have said, this sort of abuse usually ramps up. Who cares if you've been nasty too, surely you can still focus on what is good for the baby. And a toxic relationship which this clearly is will not be a good environment for the baby?

lolorwow · 11/08/2022 10:08

Tippexy · 11/08/2022 09:50

Are you and your baby going to stay with him?

Emotive language helps nobody. It isn't a baby yet. But it will be and OP needs to think very seriously about subjecting a child to this man before continuing

CharlotteCollinsneeLucas · 11/08/2022 10:14

The calmness which you envy is the absolute proof that he is abusive. Abuse at its heart is about power and control. He is in control and he has you walking on eggshells.

His calmness is also why your idea that he can't cope doesn't make sense. He is eerily in control of his behaviour. In fact, when he silently cleaned up the sandwich, I bet he was feeling smug and superior. He knew he had new ammunition to use against you.

Do read the Lundy Bancroft book mentioned, why he does it, or some name like that. There's a portrait of a calm abuser who you might recognise.