DH and DD at war. Don’t know what to do.

[Maximoose]

DH and DD have always had a really lovely relationship (he’s not her real dad but been in her life since she was 2). She calls him daddy, and up until 2 years ago she preferred him to me and they did everything together.

2 years ago we had to move counties, not too far, still close enough that we can do day trips to see friends and family but far enough that we had to move schools and get used to a new area.

She has blamed him entirely for this and has hated him ever since. She makes things up a lot, trying to get him into trouble with me. She has succeeded a few times, and we’ve had blazing rows but 90% of the time I’m in ear shot of their conversation so I know that she outright lied to my face about him being mean to her. She seems to deeply unhappy, and I feel like I’ve exhausted all avenues now and don’t know what to do. We’ve tried private therapy, camhs, the school have counselling for her, we’ve tried more time with just me, more time with just daddy, more time with all of us together. We’ve tried completely backing off and letting her do her thing and we’ve tried being firmer and establishing boundaries.

She is so so sensitive and really really reacts strongly to the slightest thing. This mornings argument was my husband had asked her nicely to stand back and give him some room as he was injecting his insulin. I heard all this through the baby monitor. She then storms into the kitchen in hysterical tears saying that daddy told her she’s not allowed to play with her baby sister anymore and to go away.

It’s gotten to a point now where my husband doesn’t want to be alone with her as he’s sacred of what he’s going to be accused of next. However, he does all the morning school run as I work early. Some mornings she’s fine and he’s the best guy in the world, but a lot of mornings she screams and cries and won’t let me leave.

It’s her birthday next month as we have planned a lovely family trip away but I’m honestly dreading it. She’s having some sensory issues currently the school are monitoring and I have questioned her maybe having ocd or autism but camhs have no concerns.

i just don’t know what to do. I want to enjoy my child again but we are all just walking on egg shells around her.

I'd say this family will be torn apart by the end of the year

Wow, catastrophising much? I think OP's had some very insightful advice which she can sift through and that will hugely help the situation.

I think it's likely if they live in a tent or 'couch surf' then the pressure of that really would make the family implode. I'm not sure what alternative reality you live in Yoyo, but I do feel for your DC.

I agree that your dh needs to work on his relationship with your dd. It sounds as though he needs help as he’s emotionally closed off.

Have you explained to your dd how love works? My dd is a black and white thinker so I tried to break things down logically. Maybe try the sort of thing I would have done? Ie say you already loved her and when the baby came along, your heart got bigger so that you could love her brother too. You think the same thing happened to her because she also now loves the baby and ask her what she thinks. Then say you love her even more because of how much she loves the baby. And tell her you think it’s exactly the same for her daddy. Perhaps she will then open up about her feelings.

Have you talked about her anger and explained anger is a mixture of different feelings like sadness and fear? So you can see she’s angry with her dad and ask her if she’s feeling those sort of feelings. Really break it down and suggest are you maybe sad that x and afraid of y etc.

I'd live in a tent for my daughter, anything for her needs. She has a home she can sell that would tide them over/buy a cheaper house in the old area. According to the OP they both have jobs so won't be unemployed for long
How do you know houses are cheaper in the old area? Does OP have the money for conveyancing fees, stamp duty, removals? How do you know what unemployment is like in the old area? Where are you pitching this tent, do you own land? Does OP? Does social services know about this tent? How do you wash, and toilet? Is it a registered address for post and bank accounts? What’s your plan for surviving winter storms like Arwen, or summer heat like the recent heatwave? Or are you in fact talking bollocks?

Aww poor little thing it sounds like she’s had to deal with massive changes which even as adults we’d struggle with.

The biggest issue here is you getting pregnant.

The baby is biologically yours and your DHs so in her mind you will be a happy little family and she will be left out.
Of course baby’s need a lot of attention so her fears have come true when she sees DH spending time with her.

She knows that your DH will probably have a stronger bond with his baby because it’s his own flesh and blood and that really hurts, as she thinks he’ll love the baby more and there’ll be no more room for her.

Of course at 8 she can’t explain her feelings so she acts out so she can get attention and get noticed.

Him asking her to stand back whilst he deals with his baby is a massive rejection to her and in her mind he basically told her to go away as he only wants to be with his baby.
Of course he was just being sensible but a child is not going to see that especially when they’re already feeling rejected.

It sounds like you’re both doing a really good job at trying to solve the issue which is great!

I would try and include her and have her help as much as possible so she feels needed.

Can she help with the insulin?
DH acting like he needs her help to hold the bottle or hold her sisters hand will honestly make her feel so special and needed.

Also they could look into doing a hobby together that only they do, so they can create a bond separate from you and the baby.
You are married and the baby shares his DNA whilst she has no actual ties to him, so they need to create some sort of connection with each other in a different way.

@Maximoose
I agree with pps. She is feeling insecure, and needs reassurance. Keep talking, getting her to name and accept her feelings, it’s ok if she feels jealous of the baby, she could be struggling with that, and not liking herself because of it.
Try not to feel guilty. For you to be able to steer the family through this, you need to feel ok with yourself and your choices. You have done nothing wrong, and this is resolvable. Keep that safe feeling when you talk to her, and try not to let your fears and pain spill out, accept them and let them go.
You will get through this. I have a similar dynamic in my family, I wish I’d held my nerve more!
It will be ok. Keep talking and respecting everybody’s feelings no matter how negative they are.

One on one time with her both you and dh. Without the baby. Make her feel loved and safe. My daughter was 6 when my youngest was born I still have her letters asking me if I still loved her . Heartbreaking. She adored her sister too she can adore her sibling and still feel pushed out x

@YoYoLife
Moving back is not going to be the magic pill. From what op said her dd is settling in and finding friends. She’s perturbed by having a lot of upheaval thrust upon her in a short space of time with the added complexity of potentially having additional needs. In short, if they move back now they will only take their problems with them.

I agree with this PP. Also, do you have any 1 to 1 time away from the house with her since the baby was born? I’m not surprised she’s acting out. She had to deal with a house move away from her friends AND a new baby sibling in a very very short period of time. Not sure why you reject her whilst you’re breast feeding. I’m 9 years older than my youngest sibling and I stayed there with my mum if I wanted to. Your dd makes “too much noise”? She’s a child. She will learn. Get her involved with the baby rather than shooing her away.

I don't really see why not. I agree you can't be the only one, but I would have thought this is definitely a situation where teamwork between you and DH is required - especially as your daughter is involving you by crying to you with lies about her dad.

Why on earth do you assume that moving back will magically fix the problem, and that it is the only thing which will? There is every reason to believe that it also has to do with the baby, and in fact that it has deeper roots given that the school also seems to have significant concerns. It's highly likely that if OP moved back it would make no difference at all to her daughter.

She used to sit in with us for the bedtime routine but now she chooses to sit downstairs or in her room and do her TT Rockstars and a bit of Minecraft. She’s happy, it’s ME that feels guilty. And that’s literally just for an hour while I feed baby to sleep and put them down. Moving back to our hometown just isn’t an option for us atm so it’s not going to happen. That previous poster clearly has no idea what it’s like to sofa surf/ be homeless with children. I was the child in that situation and I will NEVER put my kids through that.

Im just desperate for her to be happy and for my marriage to survive .

I was a practising psychotherapist. Your DD's feelings towards the baby are not as straightforward as you think.

She is quite obviously feeling very insecure, and probably jealous, and your partner is bearing the brunt of it. None of these feelings is her fault, and they're entirely understandable, but I would be getting help in one form or another for the family as a whole, so that you can better understand the dynamics at play.

What's going on at her new school? The fact she's so upset about the move implies she may be having a really tough time at school and it's this part of her life that's not working out...

School is fine. She told me all the time that she hates it and she has no friends etc. Had a meeting with her teacher who said she’s the happiest, smiling little girl ever and she’s very popular. Her teacher is the one who has added her to the sen register. Her teacher is brilliant.

She used to sit in with us for the bedtime routine but now she chooses to sit downstairs or in her room and do her TT Rockstars and a bit of Minecraft.

Where is DH when you’re putting the baby to bed?
This would be a perfect excuse for him and her to have some 1 on 1 time helping her with her homework and showing an interest in her Minecraft.

At work unfortunately

Sorry, yes, I saw your earlier post that she had made a lot of friends.

I don't think moving back is the answer - everything wouldn't magically just fall back into the place it was then. Things have changed and it's not clear what the main problem is and how her relationship with your DH has changed so drastically.

Sorry, no answers, but I wish you luck x

You say he’s at work in the evening. Did your DH’s work pattern change when you moved or had he gone from being out of work/ on furlough to working again at the time of the move? Did he go from being able to give her lots of fun and one-on-one time to working late and not being able to spend much quality time with her? I’m wondering if she might feel pushed out and rejected by him in this case if he’s no longer able to do things like bedtime routines or school pick ups that he was once doing?

Obviously not his fault if his work hours mean he’s around less than he was, but maybe the solution is for your DH to build in more one-on-one time with your DD and show her that he loves her and is interested in her. Is there anything she likes doing that he could do with her? Maybe a TV show or book series or game they could enjoy together and have as their special thing that DD doesn’t do with you or anybody else. At the weekend could there be a couple of hours each week where he and DD go and do something together one-on-one? It sounds like they need to find some shared interests and activities to help them bond again and if DD is feeling rejected (even if the reasons for that aren’t anyones fault) then building in time to show how much DH enjoys spending time with her and loves her might help.

He’s always worked these hours, but during covid he lost his job and didn’t get furlough so while he was home it was a very high stress situation as he was the main earner. Then I lost my job too, and then we got priced out of our hometown by second home buyers so we ended up moving into the house we had bought to sell. It’s been a nightmare for all of us.

This is such ludicrous ‘advice’.

Sell your house you're currently in (you said you own it), move back. You could afford to make the move, in the first place. I personally think you can't afford not to. I'd rather take charity food handouts than see my child suffer.

That's ridiculous.

This! Just be patient and loving (however hard it is) and she’ll get there..

Op please ignore the appalling advice that you should drop everything and move back to your original home. This is clearly about so much more than that, and even if you could afford to move and both found jobs back there, you would almost certainly have the same problems. Possibly moreso because you'd have moved again and caused more upheaval.

You did the right thing for your family by moving. You lost your jobs and owned a home somewhere else, somewhere you could both get jobs. You did the sensible thing.

Moving house, moving county, is not an unusual event, and children quickly learn to deal with change, usually. Moreso when they are younger than when they get a bit older and have longer term friends, routine hobbies etc,. If moving house was the only cause of your daughter's unhappiness then all the more reason not to just move back. You can't make huge decisions like giving up jobs and moving house because your 8 year old isn't happy about moving!

IF it was just the house move, she would quickly get used to that, and wouldn't benefit from further disruption of another move.

However, it is far more likely that this isn't about the house move, at least not just that. It could be a diagnosable health issue. It could be the house move, new baby and new school all came at once. Whatever it is, you are seeking advice and are talking to her school. Make sure she knows, every day, that she is loved and important to you. Be sensitive to her feeling pushed out by the baby. Make sure your husband knows that, as the adult in their relationship it is up to him to do all the running to build bridges and rebuild their lovely relationship.

She might well be masking - it's incredibly common.

Please don't beat yourself up that it's your fault & you've failed your DD. You really haven't, but I understand that feeling as that was me too, no doubt your DH also feels it. It took family counselling with a therapist who understands ND to unpick it & get things back on track & understand that masking overwhelmed DD & she crumbled & lashed out at the slightest perceived slight where she felt safe to do so & still be loved.

Like a lot of people in recent years, you've had a lot of shit to deal with & have dealt with it in the most sensible way to keep a secure roof over all of your heads. That's good parenting, not failing her, you have a lot going on & have done what was necessary to survive. Unfortunately what sounds very like nurodiversity is clouding how well she copes with the changes & what her understanding of it all is & she's struggling with overwhelming feelings & lashing out at the person she feels safest with, your DH. There'll be added layers of angst over new baby, hormones kicking in etc too, all making her a hot mess of angst & overwhelming feelings with she over reacts to seemingly minor things with.

Do listen to her view in school too. 7/8 was the age my DD started to feel she didn't fit in with her friendship group (& these were here friends since nursery) as they were doing what kids do that age & starting to gossip about others etc, even talking badly about a teacher would really upset my DD, so where as she still played with them, still ran around trying to make the best of it & have a good time, because she was mirroring her friends behaviour to mask & try & still fit in, she was thoroughly miserable