How do you end a game of complaint tennis?

[CornishMade1]

Maybe complaint is an extreme description here but my DP counters literally every request with an example of something I do inadequately. As an example, yesterday my DP swept a pile of breadcrumbs onto the kitchen floor and I asked if he could sweep them into the bin instead. His response was ‘well can you not leave things in the sink’. Another time I asked him not to leave wet towels in the bed - his response was ‘you should keep the bedside table tidier’.

I've tried everything to end this constant volleying including taking his comments on board and fixing them but I’m now at a point where I can’t mention anything without a volley back. I personally don’t feel I’m a particularly lazy person - I work full time, do majority childcare for my DC as well as a huge amount for his DC who stay with us frequently and I genuinely try to do any of the requests he makes. This may seem minor but it’s making me become mute in my own home.
Has anyone else every experienced this and have any advice?

Say to him you are deflecting from what I just said but referring HT back to me. The towels are the issue you can bring up the bedside cabinet next time I do it.

I truly wasn’t expecting this level of support when I posted this or to hear that this is something other people experience. I was bracing myself for comments about how I sound like a nag, so this thread has been useful in so many ways. I’ll try using some of the suggestions which will give me a welcome break from feeling completely powerless.
@ittakes2 - his DC think we are both mad and that we bicker about everything (which I’m so conscious about) but as they’ve grown older they have started pushing back on him. I deliberately don’t raise things in front of the DC but inevitably the simple requests create tension or his rants that then ripple throughout the day and I genuinely feel insane when the DC ask what he’s annoyed about and I have to admit it’s because I asked him not to leave plates on top of the dishwasher or not to cut his nails onto the edge of the sofa. They have seen their parents split and it hurts me knowing that they basically think adult relationships are disfunctional.
i am so aware of the impact on my (our) child as I grew up in a tense household and have memories of holding my breathe when my parents rowed. But (and this is a whole other thread ill never start) this is a better the devil you know scenario. I can’t leave - at least until my DC is older. So all these tips will be a life saver. Just having people tell me this is not just me being a nag is so so helpful.

This is interesting, it's a way of responding that I've noticed from my h, most of my il's conversations are shaped like this. They speak to my dc like this (luckily they barely speak to my dc, even when the seen them). I've been struggling to name it, but now I can and I will raise it next time it happens. Thank you all.

How utterly infuriating!

I think I would counter by immediately jumping up "right, I'll clear the sink, you sweep the floor" and hand him a broom. "I'll tidy my bedside cabinet, you take those towels down, and you'd better add the bedsheets too as they're damp now". Essentially deal with his complaint and in doing so, make him do more work than you originally requested.

Yes, This is exactly what happens. In the past I have calmly asked why there is a need for this defensive request to such simple things but there is always a pause and then a barrage of ‘well you do this and this and this’. He doesn’t respond to the question so it’s impossible to know if he’s even processed it. He’s even in the past said he has to bite his tongue on so many things because he thinks I accuse him of micro managing me. I have accused him of that in the past but with a very clear definition of things that can be done a multitude of ways but which he wants done in a specific way just because that’s the way he likes something done. We had a break through on that and he did really chill out and recognised it wasn’t a case of doing things wrong, it was a case of doing things differently. Anything that is logical, I totally take on board and I have a massive mental list of all the requests he’s made of me, most of which are logical. He said he has 100s he doesn’t say but can never think of even one when I ask. It’s generally something really random when he does volley something & v clearly something he’s just thought up, rather than something that majorly bugs him.
Its an insane way to live and currently I mostly just never say anything but I agree this is very unhealthy for children to see.

The above was in reply to @BatshitCrazyWoman

@Thissucksmonkeynuts Ive also found this very useful. This has never been something I’ve felt comfortable discussing with friends because I can totally imagine if coming across like we are simply a nightmare couple rowing about breadcrumbs. But living with it day to day is so painful.
A few people have mentioned his upbringing. We live in the same village as his parents and genuinely his parents are the loveliest, most rational, helpful people you could meet. I’ve never seen his behaviour in either of his parents but I guess the lesson is that no one really knows what goes on behind doors. His mum is definitely the typical mum of that era - does the housework/cooking etc and they definitely have the odd bicker about wives ‘nagging’ (I really wish this word could be banned as it’s never used for men, is it!) but I don’t sense it’s a learned behaviour. I’m so thankful for them as they don’t ever sit by and let him be bossy with me or the DC. No PFB syndrome there thankfully!

Another one who's experienced this. My ex cannot handle any sort of perceived criticism. I would ask him to do something differently or stop doing something round the house and he would immediately counter with something I do, aggressively and loudly . I would then feel bad because whatever it was would genuinely be something that I could do better. I'd ask why he hadn't already brought that up if it was so annoying, he'd say HE doesnt like bringing stuff like that up all the time like I do because HE likes us just to get on. I would then shrivel into the background feeling guilty and whatever I had originally raised would be entirely forgotten, much less addressed. If I ever tried to push my request, he would resort to shouting and calling me a fucking cunt etc which was very effective in getting me to back down. Basically it is incredibly selfish behaviour designed to avoid him having to face any sort of remotely negative feedback or criticism.

Have you tried a tact of not verbalising but making your point clear?

Wet towel on bed - move it to his side quite obviously and leave it.

Crumbs on floor - pretend your getting something from same cupboard, hand him the dustpan and brush and say "here you go".

Sometimes actions speak louder than words.

But no I couldn't live like this. Not constant defensive tit for tat - but even more someone who was so lazy they couldn't be bothered to sweep crumbs into their hands and throw in bin!

If he leaves his plate on top will he put it in later?

If he cuts his toenails onto side of the sofa will he move them later on?

Those things wouldn't annoy me if there wasn't an expectation I cleared it up for him.

@BreakinbadBreakineven That’s eerily close to my scenario.
@itsgettingweird That’s a good question and yes sometimes he will argue that he would get to tidying it up. He’s a bit of an all or nothing tidying - e.g he doesn’t help keep the kitchen tidy day to day but when he does tidy it, he doesn’t it on a major scale. This is I think where he will be able to pick out examples of how I don’t do things as well as I do. Which I guess is a fair point on his behalf. With 3 DC in the house, the housework is endless, even with a cleaner so I tend to just constantly be doing something. He however will pitch in less frequently on a major scale. So I guess that’s maybe an approach I can be more appreciative of.

So many typos in that - darn autocorrect!
(examples of how I don’t do things as well as He does)

He sounds like a gigantic baby. Sweeping crumbs onto the floor and expecting you to clear them up - wtf?!

I think as other posters say you have to keep coming back to the issue at hand.

OP: you've just swept a pile of crumbs onto the floor! Can you go and get the dustpan and put them in the bin
Dickhead: but you leave dishes in the sink
OP: OK, but right now we're talking about the crumbs. Please get the dustpan and sweep them up
Dickhead: you drive too slowly
OP: right now we're talking about the crumbs
Dickhead: there are hundreds of annoying things you do
OP: you can tell me that when I do them. Right now we're talking about the crumbs

Or: just leave. He sounds awful and it won't necessarily be easier to leave when your DC is older.

OP

You need to bring it up in the real world as such, as at the moment you're still processing/ not quite getting how disturbing (I don't want to ssy psychologically abusive) it is.
Bring it up with his parents.

How utterly infuriating!

I think I would counter by immediately jumping up "right, I'll clear the sink, you sweep the floor" and hand him a broom. "I'll tidy my bedside cabinet, you take those towels down, and you'd better add the bedsheets too as they're damp now". Essentially deal with his complaint and in doing so, make him do more work than you originally requested.

OP,

This is his way of controlling you and shutting you down.

Why would you want a child growing up in such an environment.

You sound like a house skivvy.

Look at planning on leaving.

Both you and your child deserve better.

In the mean time drop the rope and leave him to looking after his children.

You can't deal with him, stop trying to.

Can you leave and visit family?

Start doing that at weekends until you are organised to leave.

Take space from this.

How old would your child be by then in terms of leaving?. Kicking the can down the road as you are really doing here in asking how to cope with this will do you and your child no favours at all. Better to be from a so called broken home than to remain in one.

Its not easy to leave but better to split in the short term than in years to come when you are further beaten down by this abusive behaviour from him. His own children unsurprisingly are copying their dad's behaviours now too; its becoming their "norm". It will become your child's by him "norm" too. Look at the crap you learnt about relationships when you were growing up; this has affected you markedly. I am so very sorry your parents let you down abjectly but you have a choice re this man and your child does not.

It sounds like you've both got into a a situation of expectation and verbalising it and now it's become too ingrained.

How about sitting down and agreeing simple rules?

But if he keeps batting things back that are reasonable (the sweeping crumbs on floor was unnecessarily lazy) then I'd be re thinking my future.

Sometimes these arguments and tit for tat are a symptom of a failed relationship and underlying annoyance at each other and sometimes they're a sign of lack of communication which can be rectified.

Only you know and are experiencing which of these it is. But don't keep flogging a dead horse relationship if it's genuinely not working.

Omg I'd have throttled him by now that would drive me crazy.

@Bonheurdupasse I agree with everything you’ve said. I’ve held back from talking about it in real life because on the surface it all feels so incredibly petty and I find it hard to articulate the impact it has on me without sounding like a nag. Which is why this thread has helped, because it’s confirmed my own underlying feeling that this is border line psychological abuse in nature.
@AttilaTheMeerkat i don’t disagree and in all honesty this is the tip of the iceberg and there is no doubt we are very unsuited and I deserve a better life. However, without totally diving into a whole new issue, I’ve had a glimpse into what life might be like if I left (as I can see how he treats his ex) and all things considered, I’d rather live with the devil I know than open myself and son up to the devil that could be. I totally get how messed up that sounds and maybe it’s the wrong choice but I’ve explored every route and staying is the better option. Hence I’d rather try and work out what I can do to make this better. (I totally know I’d be shouting at a friend to leave so my eyes are wide open)

@billy1966 this is definitely the tactic I’ve started lately. I make sure I get away when I can when his DC are here to try to force the parenting back onto him. I’ve spent years trying to compensate but in truth they are now at the teenage phase where they are also moving me into skivvy mode too (which I could cope with as I expect the exact same from my DS- but in that scenario I’d be speaking my mind and nipping it in the bud so he becomes a better adult than his dad). Getting away definitely helps - it reminds me of how capable and independent I once was. And my closest friends are aware (not of details but of general uneasiness) so are great at reminding me that I am a good person and that I’m loved.

I do this to my DH.

I was constantly criticised as a child. Could never do anything right. Was always being told things I had done weren’t good enough. My brother was the obvious favourite. I am still trying to please my parents at the age of 49 and I am still not good enough.

Nobody outside of my immediate family would ever have thought my mum and dad were like that.

If my DH picks me up on something (like crumbs on the floor) I think it just brings back memories and I must admit I do sometimes react in the way your DH does. I guess I am lucky because my DH knows this about me. He’s helped me to try and overcome my feelings about my parents and I try my best to bite my tongue.

@Teenagekicksmyass it’s incredibly sad to read the impact that childhood has had on your adult life. It sounds like you have a thoughtful partner who accepts you for everything you are and the very fact you can trace those dots, shows that you have a compassion your parents sadly didn’t.
My childhood has also left me with invisible scars which I’ve made good progress with over the past year with the help of a therapist. I think I excused a lot of my partner’s behaviour as partly caused by me and my own habits reflected from childhood but I think I’m slowly recognising I have just been unlucky twice and found myself living in damaging households. I do love my parents and am very thankful for a lot of what they did with me, but I’ve finally made peace with what wasn’t my fault and can disconnect myself from that inner child who is still trying to fix things. I hope you find that inner peace too.

You say in your OP that it's your home, which I hope it is because that makes splitting up so much easier.

Why do you think the relationship with the mother of his first 2 DC ended? Probably for similar reasons, his first wife/DP left him, why do you say you can't?

This dynamic really isn't a healthy environment for your child to grow up in, I'm not sure why you'd want him to. Just be aware that your son will potentially mirror his father's actions and end up treating his future partners the way that your DP treats you and living in an unhappy home; is that what you want?

He doesn't sound like a true partner in any sense of the word and he doesn't seem to be making your life happier and better, he seems to be making it sadder and stressful; life is really too short to live like this, please believe that you and your child deserve better.

@whatstheteamarie his ex left for reasons I very much recognise in my own situation. They have never found a way to be amicable for the sake of the children and it’s been a war zone for years - but initially I was less aware of it as I was in a full on job and lived in my own house until v far into the relationship. She and I have met a few times in an effort to show the children that adults can be civil and on those occasions she has admitted that sometimes she regrets leaving because it’s been so painful Co-parenting with him. He speaks incredibly badly about her in front of the DC and plays a lot of mind tricks with her - all of which I challenge him on (I’m not a wallflower, even if I appear so on here) as I passionately believe it’s incredibly damaging to have children pulled apart in break ups. And that’s my concern - that I won’t be able to avoid that with my own DS, who is my absolute world. I know he’d fight tooth and nail for 50% custody as he didn’t ask or get that with his DC. I can’t face a future with only 50% of my DC - he’s everything to me so I’d do anything to have him in my life every day.

Ask him why he does it and ask him not to and if he has a problem with you doing things a certain way for you,both to sit down and discuss it together and agree a way forward.