April 2022 - well we took you to Stately Homes

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

It’s April 2022 and the Stately Home is still open to all comers.

@AttilaTheMeerkat thank you for the recommendation of Dr Ramani. Very useful!

Is it usual to have memory blanks of poor treatment? I seem to have forgotten stuff that’s happened and husband will point out well xyz happened didn’t it. And I’m like oh yeah, I forgot.

Like stuff has been glossed over.

Like I should be grateful for what I had not for what was missing or what hurt me.

Can I join?

I grew up in difficult family. My dad was very much a Jekyll and Hyde character… loving one minute and violent the next. I was afraid of him but also loved him very much. He died a decade ago after a short illness and deep down I’m a mess of complex grief.

My mum has an intellectual disability and was neglectful. She was also unhappy and used me as her personal therapist, sharing extremely inappropriate things with me when I was very young. In effect it was me who had to mother her.

As a result my dad had to take care of everything, which I think only added to his stress and outbursts. But he always made sure my sibling and I were fed and cared for, looked after us when we felt unwell, took us to the doctor, helped us with homework etc. I know this is the bare minimum of what parents are supposed to do, but at least I knew I could always rely on him.

I was estranged from my mum for over a decade, but in the last couple of years we’ve had some contact. She hasn’t changed much. No interest in my life, just talks about herself, doesn’t ask questions. She doesn’t actually know anything about me.

I’m currently going through quite a serious health scare that kicked off when I ended up in hospital. I tried to reach her but couldn’t so sent her a message. It took her two days to get back to me because she’d had her sister staying. She expressed five seconds of concern before moving on to her own stuff and she hasn’t mentioned it since. It’s been two months. If she texts me it’s ‘Hi hope you’re well blah blah this is what I’ve been doing blah blah bye’. I think she’s forgotten.

I’m struggling to keep my head above water at the moment. I miss my dad so much. I wish I could talk to him about what’s happening and how scared I am.

I’m so full of grief. Grief for him, grief for the mum I never had. I don’t know what I was expecting from her really. I know she’s incapable of giving me what I need but it makes me so sad and I wish things could’ve been different. Just needed to get this off my chest.

I think it is. When my mum and I got back in touch she mentioned all sorts of incidents I’d either forgotten about or had no recollection of. Quite shocking. I think our brains try to protect us by hiding it away.

Welcome@orchidmad you're amongst friends here. It's good to get things off our chest.
I really hope that things are under control with your health and that you're going to feel better soon. It's tough to go through some things in life without that support that many take for granted. In difficult times it can really hit us, what we have to go without, what we never had, what will never be. Like a multiple serving of hard things. I am really sorry you're finding it tough at the moment and I hope you are looking after yourself.
Keep talking to us and take care.

Brains do protect us but my brain recently released a memory that validated my interpretation of events, so wow, how about that.

........ I got a flashback of my mother crying dramatically in the car that she was a terrible mother and I was sitting there not knowing what to say. She had just screamed at me over nothing (I felt) so I do remember not disagreeing with her. I do remember that clearly, I wondered should I say ''oh no you're a great mother'' but I remember also that I decided not to say that. Authentic as always, god I just had scapegoat written all over me.

We fell out 3 years ago because i wanted her to acknowledge that something she did hurt me. Not say sorry but just show me some understanding that she understood she'd hurt me. She turned it around, made herself the victim of me, gave me the silent treatment, trashed me to the relatives good and proper, and now blames me for ''destroying the family''. I'm not contacting any of them at rather than being no contact. If they contacted me I'd respond but they never do. My mum has written me out of her play.

At this point I cannot imagine fixing things, so much damage has been done. I've been letting my therapy sessions settle, I've been watching Jerry wise, Jay Reid, Patrick Teahan, learning about self-compassion and practicing it. But that memory popped out from under the parapet the other day and made me realise, on one level my mother knows she has failed. Why oh why oh why could she not just say I never meant to hurt you. Instead she has given me the silent treatment for nearly three years.

I used to post on this thread two years ago, so hurt, so confused, still angry, still half believing that one day my mother would GET IT.

Now I'm just left with this sadness.

My mother accused me of being unhappy though, so I feel like I can't admit that. Her most recent text was '''we're sorry you're so unhappy, you're in our hearts, don't bother to reply'' so I feel angry that ''unhappy'' is the latest thing projected on to me.

I am not unhappy. The relationship with my parents or the total lack of it is sad but I'm not unhappy.

Maybe my brain only released that memory now because if it had come to me years ago I would have taken it to her, as ''proof'' but she would have denied it and insinuated I was lying. So it would have achieved nothing.
By releasing the memory now, it comforts me, validates my interpretation of events.

which I knew to be true anyway. All I ever did was stand firm in my interpretation of events and the whole family has labelled me mad, crazy, insane, sensitive and now, drum roll...........''unhappy''.

@J0y

........ I got a flashback of my mother crying dramatically in the car that she was a terrible mother and I was sitting there not knowing what to say. She had just screamed at me over nothing (I felt) so I do remember not disagreeing with her. I do remember that clearly, I wondered should I say ''oh no you're a great mother'' but I remember also that I decided not to say that. Authentic as always, god I just had scapegoat written all over me.

My mother did exactly this. Repeatedly from as early as I can remember. My job was to tell her it was ok, she was OK. Be her emotional support animal. She destroyed every boundary, every shred of individuality I ever had. My job was to please her and to be whatever she told me to be.

I hate her

@J0y what a shitty , horrible thing to say to anyone let alone your own child. What a pathetic text. No wonder you are feeling sad. I get it, my mother said that about me too. She wished!

These memories that resurface out of nowhere, do you write them down? I find it really helpful generally. I have a notebook somewhere which I titled 'the shitty little book', I just write free-flow in it, never read it, once the stuff is there it's gone.

@Merlott 'My job was to please her and to be whatever she told me to be.' Did she really tell you though or did you have to guess? I had to guess.

Anybody going to listen to Jenette McCurdy's book on audible? I think she's a really strong character and I find that inspiring. Not going to listen to it in a ''misery porn'' kind of way. I just like her.

@roestbruin yeh, that text made me realise she is unreachable. It was the moment I just GAVE UP. I needed to give up. I'd spent two years hoping she'd give me some clue that she understood she'd hurt me. Giving up is such an important part of putting it behind you but it's so hard. In a way that horrible text accelerated my arrival at Having-Given-Up

@Merlott I hear you. YOu have to rebuilt yourself from scratch with a mother who tells you who to be.

@J0y Giving up is so hard! Took me decades. Even when I thought I had given up I hadn't iyswim.

And then rebuilding yourself you have to work at evicting their codes and expectations and find your own voice.

I saw something funny somewhere it was a clip, someone saying 'getting rid of fear, obligation and guilt? It was a gift from my mother! you don't get rid of a gift!'

@J0y - it must have taken a lot for you to get your Mum to acknowledge the hurt she caused you. And instead of even saying a simple sorry, she turned it around and made it all about her and that she was the victim. And then her recent text is odd - almost as if she is feeling good about reaching out to you - but doesn't want your response!

It must hurt so much. A simple sorry and a hug from her could have made a very different outcome. It is almost as if making herself to be the victim and telling you that she doesn't want a reply is much easier for her to deal with than realising and accepting what she has done. Her crying in the car is again making it all about her and wanting her young daughter to 'forgive' her - rather than trying to make amends or asking what she can do to help you.

I'd like to think that deep down our parents know what they have done but prefer to hide it and rewrite history, come up with multiple excuses, or play the victim. They are cowards. They are not brave enough to say sorry or even try to change things.

Well done for Giving Up on her- for hoping for something that she will never do or can't do. You are free. I feel that having hope and expectation emotionally ties us still to them.

@orchidmad - I hope that you get better soon. You must have had to deal with so much playing personal therapist to your own selfish Mum. It's in times when we are in desperate need, (it takes a desperate need) , that we find out whoare toxic parents really are and their true colours.

Grieving for the parents we never had is a hard journey.

I try and be thankful that we understand what bad looks like and that we are not repeating history with our own dc.

@briarhill - your post about your family acting joking and chummy after a devasting and traumatising visit really resonated with me. My family did exactly the same. When my ds died, it took me that event for me to realise this is what they always do - pretend everything is OK, brush it under the carpet. I used to go along with it - live the lie to keep the peace. They constantly used religion about forgiveness and moving on. I was never peaceful with it - more resigned to it. You're right not to live the hypocrisy of it and wise to recognise it now and most importantly, not accept it.

Bloody hell @J0y, what your mother did is exactly what mine has been doing for my nearly 50 years and that text you received is pretty much the same context as the email I got from my sibling (based on what she had told him).

The more I read on here the more conclusive it is that I’m NOT going crazy, too sensitive or ‘loopy’ like they told me I was.

My fear is not having the confidence to recognise any ‘bad’ behaviour I’m pushing onto DD or seeing any signs of poor
mental health within her, because I genuinely don’t know what ‘normal’ is now. How do I know she’s ok and will be emotionally healthy when I thought I was OK but growing up seemingly wasn’t?

The realisation of the difference in my upbringing to my ‘brothers’ is brutal, it’s a knife through my heart. I keep seeing his words of ‘Mum and Dad have hearts of gold’……yes they did……for him.

Upthread I said my GP had as a matter of urgency put me into the Mental Health Crisis Team….I had 2 calls with them and they’ve let me down. Said I’m too traumatised they can’t help me so have put me back in the system for a different organisation to ‘help’ me. That was 3 weeks ago. Not sleeping, barely functioning & holding it together for my DD & DH. I didn’t deserve this.

@Parishcouncil

I’m really sorry the crisis team let you down. Years ago I was in crisis and had the same - we can’t help you, you’re too traumatised. Last year I tried to find some low-cost counselling but everyone I tried said their trainees weren’t able to deal with trauma like mine. It felt like a slap. Do you know what service you’ve been referred to? I hope they get in touch with you soon. Unfortunately it sometimes takes a bit of persistence with them, but of course that’s very difficult when you’re already on your knees.

Hi @orchidmad
I do know which 2 organisations I’m waiting to hear from as they’ve both emailed but it’s all a shit-show. I was self-funding privately but had to stop.

I wonder if letting the GP know will shimmy them on, he’s always been on my side. It does feel
like a complete slap to both cheeks doesn’t it? You suffer in silence then find the confidence to acknowledge and speak up about the trauma just to then have zero support.

Apparently today is Mental Health (Awareness) Day. What a joke. Just not a funny one.

Yes, I think it would be worth speaking to your GP and seeing if he could give them a prod. A GP on your side is worth its weight in gold. Three weeks + is much too long when you’re in crisis. 💐

Interesting that you said that helping with homework, fed, clothed etc is bare minimum... when I tried to talk to my Mum about my feelings of having been neglected she got so defensive 'I've fed and clothed you what more do you want'.

I am lucky in that my Mum has had an autism diagnosis and that has allowed her to re-examine her mothering and to talk it through with me, in a spirit of trying to understand my POV

Although she has said to me that she couldn't change anything because she lacks empathy due to her autism. 🤷🏻‍♀️ you win some you lose some

parishcouncil

Like J0y you also have a narcissistic mother and were raised in a narcissistic family structure.

So sorry to read this but I am not altogether surprised by the response from the Mental Health team. Apart from anything else they are completely under resourced. When the likes of them come up against people traumatised from narcissistic abuse they are simply not able or equipped to deal with it. At least they've told you now rather than make you wait for weeks to be told no we cannot help.

I would contact other organisations like the BACP and NAPAC; the latter are for adults who were abused in childhood. Read the Out of the FOG website. Youtube has good resources on narcissistic abuse; try Dr Ramani Durvasula as a starting point. Keep posting here too.

’I’ve fed and clothed you what more do you want?’ That’s very sad, and of course way off the bare minimum. My mum’s favourite and answer to everything is ‘I gave birth to you you know’, as if that was enough or she wants a medal, or that I should be grateful for being born into such a dysfunctional family and made to pay the price for the rest of my life.

Did you find her diagnosis helpful? Was she remorseful of her treatment of you?

Hi everyone,
I have posted a couple of times on here in the past and I follow. I find that the posts always resonate with me and make me feel like I am not the only person in the world going through this.

Around 6 years ago, I started to wake up to the way I was treated within my family. It coincided with my father's passing and meeting my husband (who is a great support). Since then my mother's behaviour has got worse and worse towards me. Regular silent treatments, gaslighting and being outright mean and I suppose abusive (I always feel like I don't deserve to use that word as I should be able to handle the mean comments). This all got worse when I had my own children and I now see her playing favourites with the grandchildren so I have gone very LC.

Unfortunately, my brothers have married women very similar who have sought to 'take over' all family meet ups and now contact to the point my brothers rarely bother to contact me at all. (Recently one has cut me off as we said something he didn't like- long story) These women play the 'who's the cutest grandchild' competition, put themselves in charge of buying my mother gifts (telling me they will do it for me now) and lots of subtle behaviours when my brothers aren't there. In my family, whenever I complained my mother would label me 'crazy, funny (as in weird), angry' which my brothers seemed to accept. Therefore when I bring an issue with them they deny all knowledge and say I'm the problem.

My husband recently spoke up about an issue (he has found it very difficult to bite his tongue but did it for me). He only spoke up as it was affecting our DS to the point where he could get hurt. We were cut off without warning by brother (deleted from all social media and blocked) and the rest of the family blamed us for raising the issue. However, his wife tried to keep contact. Now other brother barely speaks, but I will get regular messages from his wife trying to find out what we are doing. Unfortunately, one simple text can send me into anxiety mode and all these feelings come flooding back 'I'm crazy, angry, got a problem' and they are all fine.

I know that to anyone else, if I explained the message they would say I'm overreacting and I can't tell my brother as it would cue the 'you are crazy' response. I think I know really what I need to do but I just feel so sad that every time I go lower and lower in communication, it even ends in disrespect and me feeling terrible.

Sorry for the long posts. I have also been having flashbacks to childhood memories and wonder about my perceptions as I don't know how I didn't see things clearly for so long.

@orchidmad I felt deep empathy for her as she obviously struggled with her image of herself, her reality and the social pressure to confirm that's she's lived with for years. She took the time to apologise 1-1 and to talk to me about it. Her remorse was expressed as 'you deserve to know because I can tell that you've not found it easy having me as a mother'. I was the first person she told. So yes, it's been healing. Interestingly when I tried to balance it for her and said things like 'oh please don't worry it wasn't that bad' she actually said to me, 'don't minimise it; I lack empathy, I've always been like that and always will be. Your challenge is to accept it'