My husband loves someone else as well as me

[Sazdun]

Bit of a long winded one but all my close friends are also friends of his or wives of his friends so have no one to turn to.
My husband and I have been married for 8 years and together for 15. We have two girls (5 years and 10 months) and life is pretty much perfect. Yet despite all this I have found out he is in love with someone else. I know he loves me too but having seen how he behaved last weekend I am now all over the place and feel shattered.
Back in 2013 a new girl joined his work and from the get go it was clear there was a mutal attraction there (I don't think anything aside from some slight flirting has ever occured) but she also moved very near to us and as a result my husband (fiance at the time) and her would share lifts, walk to work together etc and grew close. Since they both met she has also been with her partner too. This is why I don't believe anything has ever occurred between them.
Over the years my husband and her have been on work trips together, hung out together and we as a couple have socialised with her.
To be honest, current issue aside, I see what my husband likes about her, she is pretty and very kind. Over the years she has made a real effort to include me, give gifts to our kids, help us out but if I am honest deep down it has always left a bit of a nagging feeling that this is all just an attempt to seem great to my husband. I know this makes me sound paranoid but otherwise she would just be too bloody perfect.
In return my husband seems to make an effort in his friendship with her even though he is not an overtly sociable guy. They message each other fairly regularly despite working together and while the message are all above board (I've checked), he doesn't behave like this with any other women.
After a night out when people mistook her for his wife and his friends were teasing me about 'the other woman', we had an argument about her and candidly spoke to him about her. He said he doesn't know what it is about her but he likes her and cares for her and is someone he would like in his life. While that made me slightly uncomfortable and I don't really know what to make of that, at the same time I want my husband to have friends who he cares about who are a range of different people. It has meant Over the past three years I have stepped up to be a friend to her too, I thought that might guarantee there is less chance she might overstep the mark and do anything. As I have got to know her I can see she cares deeply for my husband but that she also values the friendship I have with her too. I also think she is quite lonely and insecure. Personally I think she can do better than the guy she is with and I can see why someone like my husband is the type of person in an ideal world she would be with however in this world he is my husband.
Anyway last weekend we were at her wedding and my husband's reaction to her freaked me out and brought everything that has been under the surface for the past 8 years to a head. As she walked down the aisle he couldn't take his eyes of her. He even said to me she looked stunning (he isn't the type of guy to normally talk about people like that) and at a point in the ceremony he looked about ready to cry (he didn't even look at me like that at our own wedding). Later at the reception when my husband and her danced together they looked perfect together and so happy to be dancing together. I honestly felt like I had been punched in the gut. We left not long after as I said I didn't feel well. When we got home the next day I spoke to him about how I felt and asked him if he loved her. He said that he ofcourse loved me but there was a part of him that did love her but he didn't know in what way and he has felt like that for years but would never do anything to hurt me and our girls. When I asked him if he wanted to be with her, he said there was no point discussing that, however now I can't get it out my head. He has known her since before we got married, he could have broken it off with me and got with her if he wanted and I feel she would have been happy to go with him but now I feel like she will always be the perfect one who got away to him and I will never be able to view their relationship as an innocent friendship.
I don't know what to do. She has invited us round for dinner next weekend but I can't even face seeing her and I now feel like my husband doesn't truly love me or that our life is the one he truly wants and I feel heartbroken.
Any advice on what to do would be great.

@Sazdun

Honestly a heartfelt thanks to everyone. He still hasn't come back from his walk and I haven't replied to him and his essay. Many of you are right I am feeling like the third wheel but I don't know if I'm making myself feel this way versus what they have actually done. Even I am conflicted about her the more I dig down. I have to an extent always been about keeping enemies closer and I do believe she is attracted to my husband but has not acted on it. He is good looking and I know people in the past have been attracted to him. I guess the kicker is that the feeling seems to be mutual and it is not some short lived crush but something deeper that has been going on for years perhaps without them even realising themselves. I have grown to like her. She had cancer a few years ago so can't have kids and I don't particularly rate her husband and do believe she could do better. He jokes about my husband's role in her life and even bought him a bottle of good scotch for saving him from having to listen to his wife's moans about work. By the sounds of what she has told me, he has a lot of exes who have remained friends so I think he isn't too bothered about it all. We are all out once near the start of all this when he asked me my thoughts on their friendship and I played it cool but that is the only time he brought it up and at that time they were training a lot together for a work charity marathon. As I said originally if he wasn't my husband someone like my husband is what she needs. Part of me wants to reach out to her because I do think she wouldn't want to see me hurting like this but im also afraid having his feeling in the open like this might accelerate something between them. Its such a weird situation because she has become very entangled in our lives. I think I have the life she wants, yet her behaviour isn't that of trying to oust me. She sometimes babysits for us to go on date nights, infanct her parents have even stepped in for childcare on several occassions as neither of our families live nearby. Her mom and step dad have knitted and made gifts for the girls and she has organised massages for me and dinners for us when I had post partum depression after my first pregnancy and we were hitting a rough patch. She isn't a bad person but after last weekend I'm now relooking at everything she has done through a new lens. I'm not an overthinker but this has my head in knots.

even if your not up to thinking about how to handle any of this right now , if the thought of having dinner with her makes you ill , then dont go , the bottom line is shes his friend , he has emeshed you into being in her life because he wants to be in it . it would be great to be friends with her and shes not a bad person and all that if your husband didnt have the feelings he does for her .

its all very well keeping her close , presumably so it makes you feel more secure and you can see if anything untoward is happening , but you shouldnt have to , no person should , have to police so to speak their other half , its putting yourself in a permanent state of worry and insecurity . i get and i might be wrong that you are feeling that if you refuse to go to these meals , have anything to do with her that you are worried about what this may mean , that you wont be able to control what happens next ,

if this is the case then clearly something needs to change . it cannot go on like this indefinately or it will make you ill with stress.

its making you stressed having her in your lifes and stressed at the thought of not having her in it , personally if you cant handle doing anything just yet i would at least take some control of it by refusing to have anything to do with this emeshment with her in your life

Don't hang around waiting for him to give you "more answers" how dare he. Kick him out and make him work for his marriage if he wants it to continue!

@LetHimHaveIt I am interested in all perspectives, I came from a household where my parents split when I was young and my dad had multiple relationships, overlapping along with infidelity. My mum never went with anyone else because she was hung up on my dad. Ironically I vowed never to be like that. I thought I had managed to jot repeat that cycle by meeting my very traditional husband. He obviously had a teenage/early 20s stage where he sowed the wild oats but we settled down along with all our friends from uni and seemed to have created this nice wee life or so I thought. I can accept that we go through life sometimes being attracted to people and having a short term fantasy, hello Jamie Dornan but I guess it is the depth if this that hurts so much and how I can get over it because I don't know if my husband will, can or wants to. I believe for our family he would not contact her as much but ultimately she will always be there whether she speaks to him or not and I suppose I want him to get passed loving her and I don't know how to facilitate that.

@beastlyslumber

I have had women genuinely look at me and wonder why he is with me based on looks alone

They've said that to you? Or is this low self-esteem talking?

Is your H really that great? He sounds like a dick, tbh. He may have some good qualities but surely first and foremost what you want in a husband is love and loyalty. To you and your DC, not some random woman he fancies.

Bloody hell op. You know why you have such low self esteem? Because he hasn't made you feel amazing. Even my shitty exes made me feel attractive in looks, personality and brain. He's continually reinforcing that he finds this cow beautiful, attractive, kind and interesting. Don't you realise that that is what he should have been doing with you?

You consider him gorgeous, nice, kind etc and I bet you show it too. He should be doing the same to you. That's what people in relationships do or should do.

He can cut down contact, and get over 'loving' her if he values his marriage and his family.

This needs to be his decision - he needs to see what he's risking losing if he continues with this self indulgent friendship. That should shock him enough to realise he needs to back off from her. On his own terms, by his own decision. Over time he can think of her as an old friend who maybe could have been his wife, but he's got a different wife who he loves.

If you force him to do it, it will backfire.

‘You say you like to fix things, I think you may be looking at the wrong thing to fix. There is one marriage where you are the husband and you can fix it, but it can’t be done while you have ‘conflicting feelings’ which are just too complex to understand or explain to simple me. I can’t accept this situation, I won’t be a bystander or second in your romantic life. I think I need you to take a few days elsewhere and see if some space helps simplify these so complex feelings of yours.’

“I have had women genuinely look at me and wonder why he is with me based on looks alone“

Did he tell you that OP?

I really feel for you.

I knew a man who sounds similar to the way you describe your husband. The “better looking, sociable, flirtatious/friendly” type. He had a wonderful wife, who he was completely non-deserving of.

She was the “plainer” one, in the background, apparently indulgent of the ‘friendly’ attention he gave to other women.

One was a beautiful “old friend” who he turned out to have been hankering over for years. My friend’s self esteem was in tatters by the time she left. But she did leave.

Then ended up being swept off her feet by a lovely man who plainly adored her and couldn’t believe his luck. Strangely enough, she blossomed and it suddenly became apparent that she never was plain after all, she had just seemed that way while with the first one. Had believed it herself I think.

Also totally agree on the self esteem issue - does your DH ever make you feel like you're not worthy of him based on your looks?

He chose to marry you, not her. He chose to have children with you. You are the woman he chose. Not her.

I’ve honestly never looked at a couple and wondered why the husband was with the wife. I’m not surprised your self esteem is very low but please try and speak to/about yourself as you would your daughter/sister/best friend and be kinder to your self.

I want him to get passed loving her and I don't know how to facilitate that.

This is so heartbreaking. OP, this is not within your control. You can't help your husband get over another woman. Even if you could, it wouldn't be fair on you and how could you ever forgive him for telling you about all these feelings?

Years ago, when your husband caught feelings for this woman, he should have cut her out of his life completely. That was the time to be honest, if he had to, and tell you that you and the DC are his priority, and he won't risk undermining those family relationships by keeping this woman around.

Instead, he decided to deepen his relationship with her, bring her closer, and involve you in his relationship with her.

Now you're taking responsibility for getting him out of this. But he doesn't want to be 'over' her - if he did, he could have fixed this himself at any time over the past 8 years.

Has he ever tried to organise couples counselling? Ever gone to individual counselling himself to try to address this? I'm guessing no. And as much as you might think he is wonderful and you're so lucky to have him, the fact is that he has been willing to risk his family over this woman and is still, even now, not taking responsibility for any of it.

You can't facilitate him getting over her. All you can do is let him know that he can't have both of you. That might clarify the situation for him.

you cant faciltate it , only he can , you might not think it , but you do have a lot of control , maybe you just arent seeing it , only by using some of that control will you be able to acheive some results .

if you start of by telling him your not interested in being friends ,meeting her it will force something , he will have to realise that if he wants to continue this thing with her ,he cant use you to excuse it .

if he continues to persist with it then you can then decide if you want to ask him to leave .
you dont have to sit quietly letting him make a muppet of you by using you to carry on the way it is .
personally me i wouldnt issue any ultimatums to him to end his friendship of change jobs , you shouldnt have to force him to stop seeing her , its got to be for him to want to otherwise its pointless .

This is an emotional affair, no question about it. That message he sent you seemed to have no thought for you in it. He just spewed his feelings for another woman everywhere. I don't think I'd be able to come back from that.

As soon as he realised he had any inappropriate feelings for her, he should have ended the "friendship" not encouraged you to be friends with her.

Do you think he would have been friends with her if she was fat and ugly?

His text to you although it refers to your relationship, is still all about her and him and their wants and needs. I know you do no want to split and must accept your decision, but eventually this will destroy you. Because you are worthy of someone who puts you first and does not hanker after someone else.

I speak as someone who used to go out with a so called handsome man who other women hankered after. Now I see he was a self absorbed, egotistical bore who cared only for himself. But he was just a boyfriend, not a DH with whom I had children. His text is revealing. You have not moved any further forward and he is just sorry he has hurt you with his words, not about his love for another woman.

OP I’m so sorry you find yourself in this awful situation.

His text is a load of self indulgent bollocks.
He needs to love you enough to protect you and take responsibility for sorting out his own shit rather than expecting help from you.

We all meet people who could have been a partner if we weren’t married with kids but he is. I have a colleague who I could imagine being close to if we were both widowed. But we’re not and I’m not going to discuss it with DH or nurture a special friendship with the colleague.

It’s my responsibility to maintain my own boundaries and care for my marriage so I will without torturing my DH with it. It’s nothing and will stay that way. DH works with a lot of women and I’ve no doubt he’s had opportunities to have flirty friendships too but he either hasn’t or he rightly hasn’t burdened me with his imagined opportunities to feel special.

You don’t need to hear all about his emotional/fantasy affair for your marriage to survive this.
He needs to stop it and commit to his family or not. If he can’t then you are better off without him.

'@LetHimHaveIt I am interested in all perspectives'

I'm sure you are. But the PP was purporting to give the perspective of the man in this scenario, which she couldn't, as she wasn't. She was oddly reluctant to give the perspective of the OW, which she could, because she was.

I wish you luck, OP. I hope you don't have to keep dressing-up in your gym kit to get him to listen to you. You're worth so much more than this shitty carnival.

If it’s not her it will be someone else. Time to move on. I say this as someone who’s husband was constantly falling for her friends. It was used as a means of control. I am so much happier without the constant worry.

Seriously OP, find your self respect and put your foot down now.

Your husband has publicly humiliated you with this OW on numerous occasions and hurt you incredibly badly.

When he should be out buying you the biggest bouquet he can find and your favourite chocolates, instead he's mooning over her in a café and writing an essay about how much he loves her. Notice how the essay contains about 3 lines about you and 65 about her.

You have no idea if they have had sex, but that's pretty irrelevant given that he's told you he loves her and has feeling for her that 'he's never had before'.

She's not your friend. She's colluding in his shitty treatment of you. If the first time she wore stupid heels it meant he had to give her his arm then why on earth did she keep doing it? And are you supposed to be grateful that she pretended to be his wife for a whole night to stop another woman flirting with him? There's a reason that all their colleagues think they are having an affair - if she was your friend she would have put a stop to that.

Where is your outrage? You've let him chip away at your self esteem until he actually thinks it's ok to treat you like this and to continue to let you do the wife work while his head and heart are full of this other woman.

He should be coming up with solutions to make things right again, such as offering to change jobs or move away.

If you don't sit down with him and tell him things have to change right now then all you've got to look forward to is more years of playing second best to a manipulative woman. She very, very clearly does not have your interests, or your children's interests, at heart.

Good luck and I hope you can either make him see sense or find the strength to kick him out.

You need to ask yourself how you’ll feel when they finally do act upon these feelings. When you’re in your 40s and your kids are older and you feel it’s too late for you to start again. How will you feel then?
From their point of view it will be this ‘love of the century’ that they’ve fought so courageously but can fight no longer. For you it will be just like all the other poor women who’s husbands get bored in their 40s and who are then stuffed emotionally and financially. Don’t let yourself be her.

I don’t think they’ve had sex but I think that’s part of your problem. She’s this just out of reach perfect woman who occupies his daydreams. He’s currently sitting in a cafe indulging those daydreams whilst you’re at home washing his pants and looking after his children. Fuck that!

Tell her he's admitted he loves her and see what happens next

He really shouldn't get to continue with his (one side?) emotional affair and expect you just to put up with it

Tell her

And you have a lifetime of the pick me dance ahead of you if you do nothing

It's already started with you choosing to have a conversation with him in your gym gear because he thinks you look hot in it

He is not scared of losing you. This might be because he knows you are mad about him and think he's too good for you, or it might be because he doesn't care for you as much as he says, who knows. But, he's prepared to write a long essay about her to you, he's loving talking about her, and their special connection, surely you can see that!

As for what you should do, I think everyone has covered it. But you won't because you are probably going to do what your mum did and try to hang on to him.

I would ask him to leave, I would be so insulted, no-one is my love rival in my own marriage.

I would not have her to babysit and I would no longer be friends.

Basically you are in an unwilling love triangle. He's not going to get rid of the other part of the triangle. Are you?

The situation op is that you are so emeshed in your dhs life, such an intrinsic part that he has lost all sense of acceptable boundaries, and maybe your boundaries were not correctly in place from the beginning.

It seems to me he sees you as his mother/confidante/best friend - he has massively overstepped I guess in an effort to soothe his conscience - he has been ‘honest’ so therefore absolved himself of all responsibility for the hurt he has caused. He is not cheating in an emotional sense because he has shared it all with you.

You, with your smoking work out gear and lack of self esteem have given him everything he could wish for in life you have been consigned to the shadows. The ‘friend’ plays the starring role in your lives. She gets to be the chased and idolised heroine whilst you get to wash his filthy socks and pants and makes sure the home fires burn.

How dare he do this to you.

How dare he blatantly hanker after this woman so openly and publicly.
When did he last call you stunning op?

I would not continue with this charade any longer. I would use his disclosure now to expose your reservations from the beginning, and if you don’t want to ask him to leave - his bags would already be packed if it was my dh (thinking of your own mother here) then issue a serious ultimatum.
He either cuts all contact with her, moves jobs and devotes himself to you or he leaves.

This woman is NOT your friend, she has played along with this dreadful deceit for her own reasons.
I would tell her over a coffee it’s come to light that your dh has feelings for her, and to protect both marriages it is high time it stopped. You are asking him to cut contact - and ask her respect your wishes. She may or may not reciprocate dhs feelings but she is unlikely to want to blow up a brand new marriage.

You are playing the unenviable role of second fiddle. I suggest you find your anger and snap fiddle number one in two whilst you have the chance. Do you think you can trust him ever again after this?

He is a deceitful, highly manipulative player and I’d be getting a job lined up and a Plan B, he is not who you thought he was….and almost certainly never was - you knew this 9 years ago when the first red flag came into view.

You say you think she is insecure and lonely. When we label and criticise others we are normally describing ourselves. Careful what you tell the world.

The twat actually thinks you should be grateful he's still with you. He's been allowed to get away with this totally inappropriate "friendship" for so long that he thinks he's bulletproof. You've been a doormat for years, sadly.