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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Is it me? Am I toxic ?

125 replies

Moff2k · 16/01/2022 19:10

Been with DP 2 years. We are both divorced and don't live together. We see each other a lot though, the 50% of time he doesn't have his primary school age dc infact. Mine are young adults.
I always stay at his because my dc don't see their dad.
DP is only my second relationship and I'm 48.
I was with exdh from 17 until my early 40s then got with DP.

I feel unsettled and don't know why. I've googled it and it appears I suffer from retroactive jealousy.
I hate hearing about him and his exw. They coparent 500 so are in touch a lot. Daily infact. Its only about the dc. I've seen message's and heard phone calls, its always child related. But it bothers me SO much. I'm so jealous.
I hate that she ended it and he asked for marriage counselling to fix it ( he told )
I hate the fact he said he was devastated and will always feel he failed at marriage.
I hate hearing the phone ping and him replying.
I hate he asks her opinion on dc stuff.
I hate knowing he married her, I hate the thought of them cuddling in bed, laughing and talking.
Today we were talking and he mentioned he used to email her every morning after dropping the dc off at nursery, to update her, tell her he loved her and to have a good day. We were talking about how things end in relationships , to give context. He was saying that it was a hard habit to give up
He texts me similar every morning and I have always loved that, but now it feels tainted, like its not our thing.
I hate he bought a house with her after only 18 months of dating, but to me he has said he never wants to marry or share finances again. He says he loves me and sees me in his future but not us married.
I'm so so jealous. Its affecting my moods, my life, its all I think about.
I've never dated anyone with an ex because he's only my second relationship.
Is this normal? Is he normal? Is feeling this way normal? I feel out of control quite honestly.
This has been our weekend together and honestly I've ruined it, being quiet, brooding etc.
I've tried to talk to him about it and he's reassured me so many times, saying even if she came back saying she had made a terrible mistake, he would never go back. He says he could never forgive her etc. This weekend I said I hate I have to share him etc and he got irritated, telling me I was being silly, that it's only about the kids etc....
How can I stop ?
Is this even right for me?

OP posts:
Moff2k · 16/01/2022 23:51

We talked about this yesterday when I got upset again.
He said perhaps he wasn't giving me what I need
That he loves me but he's been upfront from the start about never marrying again.
And that's true.
I'm just so jealous she got it

OP posts:
TheCatShatInTheHat · 16/01/2022 23:56

This is your issue OP. My DP stays at his exW once a month. No issues because I feel secure and attached.

scoobydoo1971 · 17/01/2022 00:05

This is not all your fault. He is rubbing your nose in it by expressing how he was with his ex, how their dynamics were and how he won't offer you the same...assets, marriage etc. He is being blunt and socially inept, or brutally unkind to your feelings. I read your first post and it spelled out how his needs are being met. You are his friend, advisor, lover etc. It doesn't show how he meets your needs. Quite the opposite in fact, it shows what he doesn't do. Anyone who feels the need to email their wife or lover everyday to reinforce 'love' has a problem of emotional dependency. It becomes as routine as brushing your teeth after breakfast. Nothing heart felt or sentimental about that. It just says to me this is a needy man who wants validating every 24 hours by someone...anyone to prop him up. Stop beating yourself up about this and stop accepting the crumbs he throws you. His words of love don't equate with actions. It is just plain nasty of him to declare he won't marry you, or commit to you fully. You are not his ex, and you are worth more than a man who will forever compare you to her. His marriage could not have been that great because it failed. It is no doubt the reason why you are so riddled with self doubt and anxiety about the whole situation. I would be, in your shoes. But, for what it is worth...I would run and stay single until I found someone 100% into me.

Aquamarine1029 · 17/01/2022 00:13

Take away any feelings of jealousy, his sense of loss from the end of his marriage, all of it... If you want to get married again in the future, he is not the man for you. Time to end it.

BraveGoldie · 17/01/2022 00:16

@BringOnTheOtherWorlders

It's a You problem, yes, but he's also basically told you if the ex wants him back, he would go back with her.

You might need to date someone else.

That is not true. He has literally said the exact opposite of this. Don't feed her paranoia.
BraveGoldie · 17/01/2022 00:20

No evidence he is rubbing her nose in it. OP, did he volunteer all this information about his ex?

I am guessing you have quizzed him a lot?

Sounds like he has tried to answer honestly?

If he brings it up and makes comparisons, and volunteers lots about his last relationship then yes he's probably feeding your jealousy as a way to keep you on the hook.....

..... but nothing you have said so far suggests that.

WorraLiberty · 17/01/2022 00:26

@AlbertBridge

Read "Rebecca". Then dump him and find someone who likes you more than this bloke does.
I'm confused as to why you think he doesn't like her?
AtrociousCircumstance · 17/01/2022 00:35

I wouldn’t want to put up with that. Someone telling me wistfully about the love emails he’d send to his ex every morning, someone who never wants to marry or share everything again.

Fuck that.

PaulRuddsWife · 17/01/2022 00:42

@scoobydoo1971

This is not all your fault. He is rubbing your nose in it by expressing how he was with his ex, how their dynamics were and how he won't offer you the same...assets, marriage etc. He is being blunt and socially inept, or brutally unkind to your feelings. I read your first post and it spelled out how his needs are being met. You are his friend, advisor, lover etc. It doesn't show how he meets your needs. Quite the opposite in fact, it shows what he doesn't do. Anyone who feels the need to email their wife or lover everyday to reinforce 'love' has a problem of emotional dependency. It becomes as routine as brushing your teeth after breakfast. Nothing heart felt or sentimental about that. It just says to me this is a needy man who wants validating every 24 hours by someone...anyone to prop him up. Stop beating yourself up about this and stop accepting the crumbs he throws you. His words of love don't equate with actions. It is just plain nasty of him to declare he won't marry you, or commit to you fully. You are not his ex, and you are worth more than a man who will forever compare you to her. His marriage could not have been that great because it failed. It is no doubt the reason why you are so riddled with self doubt and anxiety about the whole situation. I would be, in your shoes. But, for what it is worth...I would run and stay single until I found someone 100% into me.
I agree with this. It's no wonder you feel like you do. This man sounds damaged and he'll fuck with your head.
1forAll74 · 17/01/2022 00:52

You could eventually ruin this relationship. it you dont learn some facts about how some people can think about their past mariages or past relationships. and that some meaningful things can still matter from previous times in a persons life..You should be concentrating on how things are right now with your partner, as in, are you happy together etc, and banishing any thoughts about how his life was before with someone else. Dwelling on things, can send you loopy in time.

ConsiderablyRicherThanYow · 17/01/2022 01:22

I don't know... I wouldn't like to hear my partner talk about how hard it is to not email his exw he loves her either. I'm not sure I'd want to date someone that needs to talk to his exw everyday even if it is about their children. It sounds like these are not short calls either? How much needs to be said everyday?

However, I think that if the possibility of marriage is important to you then you're not compatible with this man. I think if you're not truly okay with his not wanting to get married again then you need to leave.

I don't know if you're a toxic person or not, but it doesn't sound like this relationship makes you happy anyway. Maybe take some time out for yourself, think about what you want and look for a partner that has those qualities. Your partner has done well to make his boundaries, desires and needs clear. Maybe things would work out better for you if you did the same.

TheresSomebodyAtTheDoorNeil · 17/01/2022 01:45

He's wise to not want to remarry tbh. His dc will be his priority and he'll want his inheritance to pass down.
My dc are my priority, I'd never marry for that reason. It muddys the waters too much..... As for the rest well toxic is a bit harsh but you definitely have issues that need addressing.

GrannytoaUnicorn · 17/01/2022 02:08

@BringOnTheOtherWorlders

It's a You problem, yes, but he's also basically told you if the ex wants him back, he would go back with her.

You might need to date someone else.

He actually said the opposite. Try reading OP's updates again
GrannytoaUnicorn · 17/01/2022 02:19

@Moff2k OP you need to grow up. I don't mean this nastily but you sound like a young, jealous early teen.
He simply cannot cut contact with his ex - they have primary school age children! No amount of sulking and stamping your feet will ever change this. It would be vicious & cruel to expect him to. Especially on the kids.

Honestly, it sounds like you & him are not compatible at all. Some of the things he's said to you are completely out of line also and don't sound to me like they go well with your current state of mind. He has certainly told you things he shouldn't have shared, which have no doubt only served to make your feelings of envy even worse!

Ultimately I'd end it personally. Though I know that's easier said than done when you're in love!

sammylady37 · 17/01/2022 04:46

It is just plain nasty of him to declare he won't marry you

No, it is not plain nasty. It is him being very clear, avoiding any doubt or misinterpretation, not stringing her along, and stating his boundaries. It’s also him prioritising his children. All admirable things. If the op doesn’t like it, she knows what to do. Hint, she can end the relationship. Not quiz him endlessly about his past relationship and sulk and ignore him because he dared to have a past. A man doing that to a female poster would be rightly decried here as an abuser.

withsprinkles · 17/01/2022 06:14

Wow OP... I would feel exactly the same as you.

Reading this thread is quite shocking to me. I clearly need serious therapy. In fact, I know I do but did not realise how disordered my thinking must be till reading these responses.

sassbott · 17/01/2022 07:43

@Moff2k I think it is hard to know exactly how unboundaried he is being vs how much of this is you. Sometimes these dynamics can be subtle.

The first thing I will say is that it is very common after toxic relationships and learned behaviours within those toxic relationships to then replicate those unhealthy behaviours elsewhere. You say your ex was jealous and controlling so there are parts of that dynamic you will have absorbed. Jealousy could well equal love to you at some deep down level - you may well be replicating dysfunction.

In terms of your partner? To me nothing sounds (on the surface) as problematic. If someone as to ask me today (6+ years on from divorce) how I feel about my exh, yes I still have moments of sadness that our marriage failed and that our family was ripped apart. When younger children are involved, it’s heartbreaking. And it doesn’t matter what you do, you never recover the one true family feel. I adore my kids and our unit feels complete, but it’s not the same. Will I ever go back to him? No. I’ve done a lot of work to process my emotions, accept the family breakdown and move forward. Bluntly it’s a thousand times healthier than people stuck in anger/ bitterness. To me it’s healthy that he can be this honest and open.

In terms of the relationship he has with his ex? Superb. Amicable co-parenting is healthy, best for the children and actually healthier for everyone involved. I don’t know how much they message/ talk, and whether that is OTT, but it sounds like it is all child orientated so again, sounds fine. As the children get older, this will lessen.

In terms of marriage etc. Again I can’t fault him, he is being very honest and giving you complete clarity. Again I don’t think it is unusual that he doesn’t wish to remarry - I am exactly the same. Been there, got the t-shirt with the father to my children. I’m not having more children and therefore, my assets/ priority are my children. I will happily enter a LTR committed relationship, but no marriage here. I won’t risk my assets / complicate my personal circumstances again.

Jealousy re the past? I think you’re onto a bit of a no win game here. Short of finding a man with no kids/ no exes, what is the answer? Everyone has a past. I’d be more worried if someone didn’t by this age.

The thing is no one on here can tell you what to do. He can either meet your needs or he cannot. If one of your needs is to remarry and that is something very important to you, then this may not be the man for you. You have to be honest with yourself.

Personally? I would get into therapy asap. If I met someone kind, boundaried, respectful, loving, honest and open (whom I also fancied) I would think long and hard before letting them go. None of what you have said to me would cause an issue with me. But I’m not living it and there may be nuances of behaviour here that are unsettling.

Therapy OP and be careful. Because his recent comment of maybe he can’t meet your needs? He’s now very conscious that you are not happy. A healthy person will eventually walk away from a situation like this. There’s only so long you can seek to constantly reassure an insecure person.

I’m curious did you do any therapy after leaving your relationship that sounds emotionally abusive?

Mumof3confused · 17/01/2022 07:47

I don’t think I would want to remarry honestly. He has been burnt before and he now has children to consider. He sounds like a good guy.

How is it that you know so much about his past relationship, have you quizzed him or did he just come out with this info?

sassbott · 17/01/2022 07:49

And no, I don’t think you are toxic. That’s an unnecessarily self critical term IMO which would make sense if viewed against the backdrop of your previous relationships. It’s highly likely that a long term relationship that featured jealousy and control would have left you with low self confidence / self esteem.

I think you have unresolved issues from your past relationship that you are still carrying with you. It is your job to work on those and do the emotional work to feel self confident and self assured. It is not your partners job to fill that gap inside you. He cannot undo his past, and he doesn’t wish to remarry. Either that works for you or it doesn’t.

Moff2k · 17/01/2022 07:51

For context we were having a conversation where I stated how difficult it was sometimes, not having my dc father around to share the load, finance's etc or even to just share an anecdote or tell him something about his own children.
He responded that he understood that, that he used to update his exw with the daily email after drop off, and that now when the dc do something cute, funny etc he can't share that with her as they are divorced and he doesn't want to have those kind of conversations with her, so he shares them with me or his parents.
We were being very honest.
As for the no marriage, he's told me that from the start. He feels duped and wounded, financially and emotionally. However, we see each other a lot and he seems to always want me around.
The company and warm body comment above worries me, as that resonates.
He's often said he woukd feel lonely and lost without me.
I think the key things are that this is only the second relationship in my life, I don't know how " normal " it is to have daily text, not phone contact with an ex.
It unsettles me.
I'm anxious all the time.
To make it worse, he hardly kisses me. We have sex a lot, cuddle, he tells me he loves me, but we barely kiss.
I don't know whether I'm just romanticising how things should be or if I'm a mess.....bleurgh

OP posts:
dangerrabbit · 17/01/2022 07:52

Well, it didn't work out that well for them did it, seeing as they split up?! Maybe you should do the same since he seems to thrive on triangulation to keep you in line.

Coronawireless · 17/01/2022 07:57

Your partner is being honest about what he can give you. It’s not 100% because he has baggage. (You do too). If you’re on the same page and don’t need 100% from someone this could work. Otherwise you’ll be unhappy and it may not work.

Be open in a calm way with him about how you feel. See if other aspects of the relationship are good enough to overcome the less good parts.

I don’t think you’re unreasonable to be jealous. I would be too. The question is, what to do about it.

Moff2k · 17/01/2022 07:57

He IS a good guy. He communicates, does what he says he will, never messes me around, is open, as far as I know honest and he is a truly excellent father. So patient, kind and involved.
I need to get a grip or I will lose him.
@sassbott thank you for that post it is so insightful

OP posts:
TellMeItsPossible · 17/01/2022 08:00

Lots of armchair psychology going on in this thread, but in my mind it boils down to this:

If a relationship isn't making you happy, why are you in it?

If you feel out of control, over the top jealous, etc etc, find a good therapist to talk it through and figure yourself out.

Part of developing healthy relationships is through being in one, but a person needs to be ready to bring someone else into their life first.

Do the work on yourself to get healthy. (PS You are not his therapist , and he isn't yours.)

feedthepeony · 17/01/2022 09:47

I don't think he's being unreasonable at all.
The marriage thing and the fact he's been clear from the start shows his priorities are his children. So they should be.
I don't think he's offloaded too much to you and from what you've written I don't think he's ever rubbed your face in it.

You're going to push him away. It's so refreshing to see parents coparenting amicably and I'm sure he wants to protect that.

His children will always come first. And he has a past. Don't we all? Some bigger than others. But he wants you and is with you. Of course he loved his ex at a time. Shared good times with her cuddles etc he was married to her! But he wants you! He doesn't want her and I think this intensity is really quite unfair on him and will ultimately push him away.

If he was ringing her for random chats or deleting messages or saying 'I remember when..' to you about times he shared with her that's a total different kettle of fish.

No one's perfect. But from what you've written he sounds like a decent guy with his priorities straight. It will wear thin with him one day and you too. If you're not happy and not compatible it's unfair on the both of you to continue this relationship. But if you ever met someone else, these feelings may well arise again as almost everybody has a past. It's part of life and all of life's lessons.