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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Mother moved out with baby with in the UK

112 replies

Moonsago · 10/01/2022 13:58

My collegue ( also good friend) has moved out of the house without telling to her husband. He knows where she is but she refuses to come back or have any sort of communication with him.

She is staying in a flat by herself with the child. She refuses to communicate or show the child to the father. She just is astronomically pissed with her H for being an arse and beleives its over. Husband beleives it not and he dosnt beleive he was wrong as he believed everything was rosy and his wife was happy. However, obviously he is wrong and this came as a bitter surprise to him.

Could this become a legal issue as the couple is still married and she just shuts down with the baby?

OP posts:
Wreath21 · 10/01/2022 15:02

To be absolutely fair, if there was evidence that your friend is mentally ill, or abusing drink and drugs, or has ever shown any signs of struggling to care for the child, it might be reasonable to ask for a welfare check to be made on her and the baby, but even then, she couldn't be forced to return to the man she has left, and unless whoever made the check found clear evidence that she was not capable of caring for the child, the husband would be told to suck it up and apply for a court order to get contact with the child (which does not include contact with the mother at all if she doesn't want it).

Wreath21 · 10/01/2022 15:05

Right, you already know he's abusive. Tell him to get legal advice regarding contact, but perhaps also remind him that if he harasses his ex wife in any way, there will be consequences for him. Do NOT tell your friend to 'be reasonable', support her in refusing to communicate with a bully she has had the sense and courage to dump.

saraclara · 10/01/2022 15:09

...he is extremely controlling and make her walk on egg shells 24/7. Judges her and wont just treat her like a human with feelings.

Ah. That's information you could have included in the OP. Would have saved me going on a tangent!

ancientgran · 10/01/2022 15:10

@BuanoKubiamVej

What is paramount is the rights of the child. It's not usually in a child's best interests to be cut off from one parent unless that parent has a history of being abusive.

It is definitely not in a child's best interests to be used as a pawn in a power struggle between warring adults and a parent who isn't capable of prioritising the child's wellbeing in order to score points off their soon-to-be-ex is risking being seen as not a good parent.

Good parents sometimes do find their relationships with each other fail and die. They need to act like grownups and talk in a mature and civilised manner about how to minimise the negative impact on their child and ensure that they can work together as partners in parenting the child even though they are no longer partners in life generally.

Yes, and yes.
MajorCarolDanvers · 10/01/2022 15:13

Here is some information that should be useful to both of them.

www.gov.uk/looking-after-children-divorce

litterbird · 10/01/2022 15:14

Ah so he was an abusive arse then. Congratulate her from getting away quickly. She needs to get lawyers involved and she needs to have all her findings of his abuse logged. She needs support to help protect her and the child from him. He will need to seek contact from the courts and measures put in place for him to see the child safely.

3mealsaday · 10/01/2022 15:14

@saraclara

If a man upped sticks and left with his child, you can bet your life that the mother would be messaging everyone who'd ever known him and doing everything she could to track them down.

(Again, playing devil's advocate to a degree, but it's interesting that everyone's decided that he must be a dreadful person who has no right to try to see his child without getting the courts involved)

But women, more than men, tend to be the primary carers for very young children. You can't just leave a baby behind if you're its primary carer... that's neglect. If you leave (and no woman is a prisoner), then the baby sort of has to go too.
Christinatherabbit · 10/01/2022 15:15

@saraclara

...he is extremely controlling and make her walk on egg shells 24/7. Judges her and wont just treat her like a human with feelings.

Ah. That's information you could have included in the OP. Would have saved me going on a tangent!

Same it kind of makes a difference when asking for advice!
Whattochoosenow · 10/01/2022 15:19

With all respect you shouldn’t be doing anything. It’s not your marriage or separation. There will be things that have gone on behind closed doors which you will no knowledge of.
It’s down to him and her to sort between them.

Whattochoosenow · 10/01/2022 15:20

*have

trickytimes · 10/01/2022 15:21

Stop letting her husband get to her through you. Google “flying monkeys” because that is what you are in danger of becoming. You are HER work colleague not his. Block him. This is not your circus. He needs to see a solicitor and get a child access arrangement put in place. The kid is a baby so unaware and it’s not going to ruin its life. This has only just happened, the kid isn’t a teen preparing to do exams, there is no catastrophe here. Him contacting social services is quite frankly ridiculous and bullying threatening behaviour. Tell him to grow the fuck up, stop messaging you and contact his own solicitor. Tell her to get a solicitor and they then exchange details. Once clear arrangements are made then the father can have organised, calm, 50/50 custody as it should be and if he does it now rather than flinging around drama this could be sorted by the end of January. I don’t blame her for going if his messages to you are indicative of his home behaviour. It’s absolutely nobody’s interest his emotions at her leaving. The only person who should be engaged or interested or remarking on that is him and his immediate family.

urbanbuddha · 10/01/2022 15:22

What is domestic abuse?
Have a read, OP.
Women's Aid will be able to help your friend.

trickytimes · 10/01/2022 15:22

I also suggest you post on the legal section of mumsnet if you want clear legal guidance. Also send her the link for mumsnet so she can get her own advice if she needs to

toomuchlaundry · 10/01/2022 15:22

Even if there has been abuse (emotional or physical) to the mum, doesn’t automatically mean he can’t have contact with his DC, unless abusive against them too. Will probably need to be supervised contact especially as still a baby

Ozanj · 10/01/2022 15:29

@Moonsago

Ok... I dont know if there was DV but my friend says ( cries :( ) that he is extremely controlling and make her walk on egg shells 24/7. Judges her and wont just treat her like a human with feelings.

She is sad that he will do the same to the son.
She wants to prove that he wont be a great father so that she can just live seperately with the child.

I dont know the legalities about it but she also recorded him yelling at her while she was just trying to reason with him. I do agree it wasnt pleasant. The H dosnt know she has the recordings.

I think like pp said she isnt ready to start proceeding herself with all the proof she has but just taking a break from him and his micro management now.

All I was worried was if she could have a case on her but that seems to be unlikely, so .. thats a relief.

Get her to a good solicitor if you can. They will be able to help her with the legalities. While it’s not illegal it social services do get involved at this stage on his say so then he might be able to use it as an example of parental alienation to get custody. I should also point out that emotional abuse is still classed as domestic violence so she can and should seek police advice and file a police report - it will help them support her in case he escalates while also letting social services know they need to vet him.

In fact it might be a good idea for your friend to contact social services and let them know he has an abusive partner and to support her (do it after the police and legal appointments).

trickytimes · 10/01/2022 15:42

No he’s not going to be able to use it as parental alienation. That’s rubbish. It takes a lot of proof and sustained action over time to get that judgement. Eh if there is a consistent refusal to comply with court ordered visitation schedule.
There isn’t even a schedule yet!
He and she need to appoint solicitors. Any action has to happen through court now. This takes time. He will struggle with this if he’s controlling because he now doesn’t get to tell her what to do. The law does and he has to abide by it.

Lovemusic33 · 10/01/2022 15:42

What a odd thread.
Many women leave their husbands taking the child/children with them, there are thing the dh can do to get access to his child, to start with he can apply for a court order. Chances are the child is being kept from him for a reason. He does not have legal right to make her return with the child, being married doesn’t mean he owns her but of course it’s his child and he can go down the correct rout to get access.

I don’t understand why you are getting involved unless this post is about you OP?

trickytimes · 10/01/2022 15:43

She needs to file now today a deed of separation and apply for residence for the child at her current address and if he is abusive file a restraining order. If you want to be useful tell her to do that and send her details for 6 local solicitors to choose from or help her book an appointment

Quartz2208 · 10/01/2022 15:43

I agree OP you need to block him - he is clearly unhinged and potentially dangerous.

She needs to seek legal advice and see if a Non Mol is possible and start the process of getting away from him.

Lovelydovey · 10/01/2022 15:47

She can unilaterally decide it is over. He can’t unilaterally decide it is not and force her to come back/try again. So sounds like it is over.

For contact go through the courts - get it moving ASAP.

SofiaSoFar · 10/01/2022 15:56

What's her reasoning for not allowing him to have contact with the baby?

The mother was obviously free to leave, which she did, but what else is going on?

Original poster
Moonsago · 10/01/2022 16:05

Thankyou for all your messages.

Yes she knows he is messaging us all but 2 of them left their jobs with the company and the 3rd one is abroad now so only me here.

I wont ask her to be reasonable.. not my place. She is my friend and I am on her side.

Sorry to pps who sais I should have given the abuse audio info in the first post. I agree I should have. I actually posted for legal issue side of it but the thread took its turn.

and icing on the cake is that he views her as the manupulative/cunning kind Hmm because she came out of her first marraige with a narc by recording his abuse. I dont see how coming out of a bad relationship is 'cunning' Confused.

She actually went thru this before but she had all her family by her side sorting out stuff for her and it was not in the UK. So she has gone thru it already but not thru the legalities of it.

Honestly, I feel like I should give just the solicitor advice to both and move away. The more I read here, the more it feels like above is the right decission.

OP posts:
lottiegarbanzo · 10/01/2022 16:09

It sounds as if you believe he has to consent to separation. He doesn't. She has left him.

There will be applications to court for custody of the child.

If he was abusive, practising coercive control, he could be prosecuted for that, separately from anything to do with the child but only if she wants to make that complaint and there is evidence.

TheOrigRights · 10/01/2022 16:11

My advice would be to advise her to seek legal advice as soon as possible and to point her to DV sites/Women's Aid.

mathanxiety · 10/01/2022 16:12

Tell the woman to make a phone call to Women's Aid.

0808 2000 247
She will need to leave her name and number, a message about her situation, and a good time to call her back.

She needs Women's Aid's help sorting out the future for herself and her baby.

Her husband being ready to explode, talking about calling social services, etc - all this threatening and anger is awful.

I am glad she got away and I hope she stays away.

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