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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Heartbroken by his double life discovered on Christmas Eve

113 replies

AquariusMum21 · 25/12/2021 00:28

Not sure why I’m posting here I just needed somewhere to write my thoughts. I was with my DP for two years fell pregnant by surprise at the start of the year and he changed overnight from being caring and romantic to absolutely vile. He said he’d be there for his son but I had my suspicions there was someone else involved he’s from the Middle East and said there was some family pressure but he hated this woman and she was after a visa. We spoke last month and he said he still wanted to be with me and would be there for our baby. I’ve just been on his Facebook and seen a tagged picture from this evening of him wearing a wedding ring. He told me he was going abroad to visit his family and would be back for new year. I feel really sick even though i shouldn’t be surprised by his behaviour it feels like a betrayal and I’m heartbroken for our son. How can someone life such a double life and lie? How do I even get over this my heart is so broken for my little boy. There is also another woman involved who he told me was just a friend, I’ve just messaged her on Instagram and shes confirmed she isn’t. Please can everyone be kind I have a newborn baby and my hormones are all over the place tonight

OP posts:
Latenightreader · 27/12/2021 07:53

I used to work for an MP. We dealt with several parental abduction cases over the years and I remember two where Middle Eastern men took their child(ren) to their home country for a holiday and refused to return them. In one case he came back leaving the child with his parents, in the other he remained abroad with the two children. One case was happily resolved but it took two years, I don’t know about the other.

I know men from the region who are excellent, loving parents and partners, but your ex sounds the very opposite of this. I would be very, very concerned about giving him any access to or contact with your son.

Outlyingtrout · 27/12/2021 09:26

@Tarne it’s a bit rich for you to be calling the OP naive when you’ve been advocating for her to establish as good a relationship as you can salvage with him because at the end of the day, your son has a right to know who is father is and meet his family if necessary, seemingly simply because he is Muslim. You have an ulterior motive here. Keeping the child safe is the only thing that matters.

AquariusMum21 · 27/12/2021 10:21

@Tarne

It depends how much the op has let this man into her life. Presumably he will have met your father and other relatives?

If he or his relatives and friends know any of your relatives and friends then how exactly is the op and her baby going to " disappear"?!

The op will need the support of her family in bringing up a baby ' it takes a village' to bring up a child.

How exactly is the op going to disappear? It's not practical nor feasible given her situation and community ties.

That's a huge ask of a new mother.

Op, the posters are correct to point out your ex's parental rights should he pursue this whether or not you try to claim Child maintenance.

Unfortunately even women who have suffered DV are forced through the courts to maintain contact with the father, as by law it is seen to be the child's right to have contact with his father.

If your ex is a wealthy man and/or has his family behind him- let's not be naive here- you are going to have an enormous legal fight on your hands especially given the promises he has given you.

Forgive me but you seem extraordinarily naive op. Are you very young?

I’m in my late 20s, have a degree and a stable career that I’ve worked hard for I appreciate your advice and I am taking the advice about abduction very seriously considering some of the posters have experience seeing cases like this which are unfortunately common.

I can still raise my son as a Muslim and in a loving home surrounded by other male role models who will look after him and I hope he’ll grow up to be a kind man. This man hasn’t proofed himself to be caring at all towards me or his son.

OP posts:
MakeMineAdoubleChocolate · 27/12/2021 14:40

Can you ask for advice at the nearest mosque sister please

psydrive · 27/12/2021 16:18

@MakeMineAdoubleChocolate

Can you ask for advice at the nearest mosque sister please
A lawyer would be more useful.
PurplePikachu · 27/12/2021 16:42

Ok, the fact that he and OP are both muslim is irrelevant. Please stop focusing on it.

What’s important, is that this man (who says he’s muslim, although he’s obviously not living like a good muslim would) is from a country where he has greater legal rights over the child than the mother does.

I would only have a child with a man from that kind of country if I absolutely one hundred percent trusted him.

In this case he is abusive, he’s a liar, and he has shown no interest in looking after the OP or their son.

Allowing him any access at all, formalising any kind of relationship with the son, or making it easy for him to trace that son would be an insane risk to take.

youvegottenminuteslynn · 27/12/2021 17:28

@MakeMineAdoubleChocolate

Can you ask for advice at the nearest mosque sister please
I don't think that's the best place for completely impartial, objective advice to be honest. Womens aid and a decent solicitor without any personal relationship to either OP or her ex is a far better, more sensible idea.
Yuledo · 27/12/2021 17:41

Agree that the hassle isn’t worth the money.

NoToLandfill · 27/12/2021 19:01

PurplePikachu is exactly spot on.
OP we are all routing for you.

NdujaWannaDance · 28/12/2021 08:51

Totally agree with PurplePikachu

MakeMineAdoubleChocolate seriously, how cloth-eared can you be?

This is not something a mosque can help the OP make sense of and it's frankly dangerous to ignore the very real issues that he poses as a flight risk with the baby, by sending her for advice from someone who will just put Islam and the father's 'rights' completely front and centre of this mess.

He's lost any right to claim he's a good Muslim father in every way.

MakeMineAdoubleChocolate · 28/12/2021 08:58

Cloth eared????
Have you have read any of my previous posts on this thread, I have said that op should leave him. You're saying I am cloth eared like I am stupid and don't understand the op situation. I actually do and op has appreciated my advice.
And my suggestion on going to the mosque for advice was to start divorce proceedings, as its an Islamic marriage and not a legal one and to start getting herself sorted and away from this man. Then she can go to the lawyer and so on

Its clear not many people understand that Muslim women have the right to go and seek divorce if unhappy, being abused and so on. Muslim women have the rights to property, to work and vote long before UK did. So op has the right to go and ask the mosque she married in to help her with divorcing this guy.

Yes, being Muslim is relevant because the baby will grow up as a Muslim which is fantastic as he won't lost his fathers and mother's faith.
@nduja
There's no need to be insulting.

MakeMineAdoubleChocolate · 28/12/2021 09:04

You c
Clearly, you don't know anything about Islam.
And are just thinking what you think by going by what you have heard by small minded people and social media. You're the same kind of person who probably thinks all Muslims are isis when isis are actually scum and enemies of islam

Just to let you know,

When prophet Muhammed was asked who should I love first. My mother or my father?? He said your mother. The boy then asked and then who? He replied your mother. Then the boy asked him a third time, then who and he said then your father.
There is also a saying in Islam, that heaven is at your mother feet. So mothers are very important and the imam or shiekh at the mosque will know this and help op.

Fwiw, Women have the right to seek divorce and any good mosque would give her that as well as advice on the child. She should then also see the lawyer about not allowing the father to whisk the baby off to Iraq.
You're making it sound like I am in support of the father. I am not and have made it clear in previous posts as well as private messages to op. Which she was grateful for and glad for the advice, religion wise and in practicality.
Have a good day

youvegottenminuteslynn · 28/12/2021 09:29

Muslim women have the rights to property, to work and vote long before UK did.

Eh? The rights of women vary from country to country, there are no universal voting / working / property laws for Muslim women - it depends which country they live in.

Outlyingtrout · 28/12/2021 09:34

@MakeMineAdoubleChocolate the OP has not said that she is in an Islamic marriage with this man. She refers to him as her partner, not her husband. And regardless, an Islamic marriage is not a legally binding marriage in UK law so it's irrelevant in terms of the actual legal issues at hand around keeping her son safe. OP needs to stay off this man's radar as much as possible. The less contact she can have with him and the less information he knows about her, the safer her son is from being abducted and taken abroad. It happens. Religious and cultural ceremonies are surely not more important than this child's actual safety and wellbeing.

And you can pack it in with the Islamaphobia accusations. Of course PPs don't think all Muslims are ISIS 🙄

NdujaWannaDance · 28/12/2021 09:42

MakeMine I did see those posts, I just didn't register that they were from you, who then said 'ask for advice at the nearest mosque.'

So, you're Muslim too?? Sunni???
Did you do a nikah with him,?

Unless the OP has responded to you privately, I cannot see where she has answered that question. You say she's married Islamically but not legally, but the rest of us don't know that. we can only respond based on what the OP has said on this thread.

My response to your suggestion that she seeks advice at a mosque was based on the assumption that she was NOT Islamically married. If she was, then I don't understand why she didn't mention it from the off.

Either way her partner has not acted like a good Muslim OR a good partner/husband OR a good father by not discussing his intentions to marry a woman in Iraq with her. He's disappeared at a time when she is most in need of the support of her partner, when their first child was due. Being around for the birth of his child with a woman hw purports to love should have taken priority over EVERYTHING else, regardless of whether he is Islamically 'entitled' to take another wife or not.

It sounds as though he has been absent, flaky and avoidant throughout most of her pregnancy, oscillating between being cruel and distant and then saying he wants to support his child and be with her.

Based on that, it's no surprise I assumed they were unmarried.

Women have tonnes of rights in Islam.

But sadly not the right to keep primary custody of their children, if the father decides he wants to have primary custody himself.

No matter how much of an irresponsible, absent and all round poor excuse for a husband and father he may be, in many countries where the law is based on Islamic principles, his desire to keep 'control' of his children trump hers every time. For a whole bunch of very questionable reasons that put patriarchy, family money and family honour and yes, ISLAM ahead of the wellbeing and happiness and established family routine of the children.

Many Muslim men would gladly see their children stripped from the arms of their mother, who has been the only constant in their lives, and dumped into the care of extended family that the children may not even know, with no intention of taking an active daily role in raising the children themselves, just to exert control and power over their mother.

A man who can behave the way this man has so far, strikes me as exactly the type who might do that, just because he can.

Am glad you're the same religion so the baby can be raised Muslim also.

Is that the most important thing in all this for you? I fear that it is.

AquariusMum21 · 28/12/2021 09:48

We did have a nikkah (Islamic marriage) at the end of last year however I am referring to him as my partner as Im not sure as it was even valid considering we spent no time together and he kept me as a secret I wouldn’t even class it as a “marriage” and he dosent deserve the title of husband. I know my rights islamically and it’s not hard for me to leave without having anything to do with him or him knowing my whereabouts. He doesn’t have any rights towards me or our son considering under the law he was just my partner hence why I don’t think his man deserves the title of husband.

The issues around his control and taking our son out the country are very real and I am taking them seriously. He hasn’t proven himself to care about us at all and has been nothing but abusive and a liar.

OP posts:
AquariusMum21 · 28/12/2021 09:53

According to the laws of this country we are unmarried, as I registered his birth alone and explained the situation to the registrar she also confirmed this. Should we be in Iraq this would be very very different however I don’t feel like this man wants me anymore and I’d rather not get into a religious debate. My priorities are changing his surname, re registering his birth certificate then applying for the passport. I’m also considering deleting my social media and changing my number.

OP posts:
NdujaWannaDance · 28/12/2021 10:04

Well done OP. I'm glad you get it. Stay strong and don't let anyone guilt trip you into jumping through the hoops of cultural expectation or Islamic 'law'.

None of that should come ahead of the very real safety concerns for your son.

youvegottenminuteslynn · 28/12/2021 10:08

Well done OP, sounds like you feel more confident in those decisions - which are absolutely the best thing for your son. I'm so sorry this man has turned out to be such a wanker.

AquariusMum21 · 28/12/2021 10:10

Thank you for your previous message I’ve re read it a few times. I know everyone means well and has different views, as I’ve previously mentioned he can still be raised with my values in a loving home but away from any toxic cultural behaviour that will put him at risk. He has proved himself to be the complete opposite of the loving and kind person he was when I met him and has shown his true colours and intentions and I really do believe if he is capable of constantly hurting me and letting me down during my most vunerable time and marrying someone he repeatedly told me not to worry about weeks after his “son” was born he’s capable of anything and is probably a sociopath. I had to have an induction and pethidine because my stress and anxiety was so bad at the end of my pregnancy due to him I couldn’t have the natural labour that I wanted. He was in Tenerife whilst I was having our baby.

OP posts:
NdujaWannaDance · 28/12/2021 10:16

Clearly, you don't know anything about Islam.

I lived in the middle east for 13 years so I know plenty. The fact that I don't just sycophantically gush over how lovely and cuddly and deeply misunderstood Islam is, and the fact that I am not afraid to be point out hypocrisies and inconsistencies where I see them does mean I do not understand it.

NdujaWannaDance · 28/12/2021 10:21

He was in Tenerife whilst I was having our baby.

Wow.

Not even in Iraq, bending to pressure and expectation from family like a good Muslim son.

Not with his first 'wife' and child.

In Tenerife. On a sunlounger. Perfect.

Elieza · 28/12/2021 10:32

Congratulations on your new bundle of joy Bear Flowers

Sorry the dad is an arse. He’s not followed the rules of Islam at all and has behaved dreadfully. What a vile human being he is.

You are well shot of him. He just seems to think with his dick. I’m sorry you had to go through this. Your baby however is a blessing and you will move past this.

A new surname and house move as soon as you get the money together in due course would be good.

One day your (not so darling) p will realise that he’s missing out and look to get back with you, no doubt citing that you are his wife in the eyes of God (but conveniently forgetting his own transgressions) By which time you want to be well away so he can’t kidnap your baby.

If he wanted to be part of his child’s life he had the option. He chose to think with his dick and fly to Tenerife so he can get lost. Actions have consequences.

CPL593H · 28/12/2021 10:32

You have sadly becoming embroiled with a man who seems entirely unreliable and self interested, so all you can do is protect your baby as best you can. I second getting a passport ASAP and keeping it absolutely secure. If he does reappear and want access or inclusion on the birth certificate, he goes to Court. I would cut him out of your life as completely as possible. He does not love you and he is not your friend.

Although it goes against the grain, I would give serious thought to claiming CM as he might back off if he thinks he won't have to pay. The advice around child abduction is to ensure that you always have up to date photos of the child and keep any you have of the father.

The big positives are that you have family support and are not financially reliant on your former partner. I grew up not knowing my birth father and usually feel a child has a right to know both parents, but that is if things are safe and this situation is not.

gogohm · 28/12/2021 10:40

Change babies surname, then get a British passport in his name. If you have any concerns about abduction then there's steps you can take to try to prevent it, but in reality not every man would be interested in raising a child anyway. Consider whether you want to have any ties to this man? You could move and not claim child support meaning no link

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