Please help me help Dh with his awful mum

[Sparklydiplodocus]

Brief backstory: he has a very very strained relationship with her. She can’t get on with anybody- friends, neighbours, everyone. She picks fights with them all. She is also very self centred and manipulative. When he moved out of home in his mid 20s she bawled to him and said how can you leave me. When we moved 45 mins away for better schools she bawled again and said how can you leave me.

She makes his life a misery. She is blocked on his phone but she batters him with emails constantly. Every day. We rarely see her but she is constantly asking to see us.

So then Xmas came up. None of us want to suffer her presence and her narky little comments. So he said we wouldn’t go to her for Xmas day. She is now barraging him with emails saying how could you be so cruel, bringing up his deceased father saying what would he think of you, etc etc. Dh was up til the early hours upset.

He is adamant that if he tries to go NC she will just show up at our door. I’ve wondered if she would attempt suicide- which she did when a previous partner left her.

Please help me help him cope with it and deal with her. He is so upset today.

Buy him the book toxic parents
Book him some therapy

What PP says

And direct all her emails to a special folder that you can check for him and he doesn't have to look at.

Doe she live alone. Will she be alone over Christmas,? Are you going to see her at any point over Christmas?

Yes she lives alone. She is alone because she is nasty to everyone. No we won’t be seeing her after her tirade.

My late mil was like this she was angry,bitter and spiteful but she was also lonely could be as nice as pie. How we managed it was we would have set times to visit ignore the bile and say its time to go see you next time. Realistically what does your husband want to do ? Will she be on her own Christmas day could he go see her for an hour or something. Its bloody hard though your poor husband

I think she's the type of person that will behave how she's going to behave and it actually doesn't matter what your DH does and doesn't do.

If you'd have invited her, there'd have been a long list of things you were doing wrong. So you'd still have all this shit.

You have 2 options. Grey rock. Ignore, ignore, ignore.

Or you (DH) tackles it. Mum, you're so bloody difficult. The more you behave like this, the less I want to see you. The trouble with this option is that you've opened yourself up to a dialogue with someone who can't be rational. And you'll go round and round and round.

I'd tell DH that it's up to him and you'll support him no matter what, but that you hate seeing him be treated like this and you give him permission to refuse to be treated like this. Because sometimes, people need that permission.

@Mufasa1118

Doe she live alone. Will she be alone over Christmas,? Are you going to see her at any point over Christmas?

It’s tough shit if she is. Nobody owes toxic relatives anything; they make their own bed.

Just adding to the excellent suggestions already here, remember he can’t change her. There is nothing he (or anyone) can say or do to change her. Thinking she will change, or be different this time’ is wishful thinking The only thing your DH can change is the way he thinks about it, and the amount of access he gives her.

He may not see this, and may need therapy and to educate himself about her behaviour and his responses. So I would recommend:

• Toxic Parents book
• therapy
• someone else checks the email account
• no direct contact, until he feels stronger and able to put boundaries in place (or put her behaviour in perspective, so it bothers him less. He may never get to this point, and it won’t be a failure if he doesn’t.

First two are absolutely essential

What LifeAdvice wrote here.

It is vitally important that the two of you present a united front.
Its not your fault she is like this and neither of you have made her this way (her own family of origin have done that).

Block her sending emails to both his and your e-mail accounts. If she turns up at your door do not let her in. If she continues to try and harass you re contact then I would seek legal advice.

Re therapy encourage him to find a BACP registered therapist that he can work with. He absolutely needs to properly address the fear, obligation and guilt he has re his mother; after all she installed those buttons in him.

If she sends cards and or "gifts" do not send these back but dispose of them. Such disordered of thinking people want a response and sending these back is a response i.e the reward because she knows she has you then. Do not acknowledge anything she sends you via the post or electronically. Radio silence from the two of you has to be maintained.

Also encourage him to look at the "Out of the FOG" website.

Divert her emails from him to you.

Delete

Block elsewhere

Sorted

However he really needs some therapy to work through his inability to deal with her

I don't know. My elderly mother is difficult and annoying.
But I still wouldn't leave her alone on Christmas day.

You have to balance your thoughts of:
She's annoying,

With

"She is elderly , alone , her husband as died"

Elderly people are annoying precisely because they are lonely. And they are afraid of being alone.

We will all be old one day. How will we feel if we are old and alone on Xmas day.

What you have said she has done so far - doesn't seem so bad to me - she seems merely lonely and annoying.

However, If there are things that you haven't said here, if she has done terrible things to your partner, and badly abused him when he was a child, something like that, then I agree, he doesn't have to see her at all

Has your dh ever told her how her comments and behavior makes him feel and why he hasn't wanted to see her? Has she had an opportunity to try to be better? If this is all lost on her than i advise the below....

My final advice to your dh is to write her a letter going no contact and containing everything she has done to hurt him, including that turning up on the doorstep will not be tolerated and you won't be answering the door in an attempt to not disturb rhe peace. .If it is written down she cannot ignore it and it will be there for her to reference.

www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0765703319?linkCode=osi&psc=1&ascsubtag=ecSEP32rm7ybwkxhgncsk&th=1&tag=mumsnetforu03-21

OP, this is an investment at £40-odd quid, but a potential life changer.
MiL's uncontrolled angry outbursts, inability to get along with anyone, & fear of abandonment point to Borderline Personality Disorder.

Not that a 'diagnosis' that a random laywoman isn't qualified to offer is any help in itself ... but my own mother suffers from it (& oh boy, so does everyone in her orbit!).

If you buy this book for DH, & read it with him, you will both get some insight into the condition - including recognition that there is nothing you can do to alter her behaviour - & some techniques for dealing with it.

There is also a great deal of comfort to be had from the book.
The author is rave-reviewed by her peers, & the writing style is clear, helpful, & compassionate to the children of Borderlines.

It's bloody hard, & fwiw, I am now NC with my mother.
You & DH have to do what's best for your own mental health.

Has he ever sat her down and tried to tell her why he feels so reluctant to spend time with her? Has she been given the chance to change? Is she aware that she's alone because she's alienated everybody or does she have zero awareness?

Elderly people are annoying precisely because they are lonely.

Oh read the OP properly @Mufasa1118
THIS elderly person is lonely because she's annoying.

She doesn't have a single friend or helpful neighbour because she has alienated every one of them by picking fights with them. She makes her son's life a misery ... but you are now guilt-tripping OP saying this woman shouldn't be left alone for xmas.

So basically, the DH has to sacrifice his MH because a nasty old woman's feelings are more important than his wellbeing? I don't think you have ever lived with a Cluster-B personality disorder. It is hell.

Maybe YOU could have the MiL to stay if your sanctimony stretches that far this xmas?

@ChargingBuck but I know a lot of elderly people who are exactly the same. This behaviour comes from being-
Lonely
Failing health
Feeling scared being alone.

Elderly people are physically weak and scared. And they lash out in their fear.

I don't know anyone who really enjoys going to visit their elderly relatives, but they do it from care.

Shouldn't we give more compassion to the elderly, because they are weaker than ourselves?

Elderly people are annoying precisely because they are lonely

Not necessarily. Unpleasant younger people grow into unpleasant older people. Some people are lonely because of circumstances, some are lonely because they’re pretty awful and have driven everyone away.

I don't know anyone who really enjoys going to visit their elderly relatives, but they do it from care.

I enjoy going to see my mum in her mid 70s, but that’s because she refuses to be drawn into an ‘elderly person’ mindset.

I just don't think anything that she has done is so bad. Op said In her post that this woman has done these things-

1. When her son moved out in his twenties, his mother cried and said how can you leave me

I know so many mothers who have cried when their child left, even yes, when their child was in their twenties.

She said her partner has told his mother that he will not got go to see her for Christmas. His mother sent him an email saying "how can you be so cruel". She was upset about him not coming to see her at Xmas. She is entitled to be upset about this, she could have expressed it in a nicer way. But she is allowed to be upset about it

These things are not that bad in the grand scheme of things. A

@dismantledking ah that is nice. I am glad for you

[quote Mufasa1118]@ChargingBuck but I know a lot of elderly people who are exactly the same. This behaviour comes from being-
Lonely
Failing health
Feeling scared being alone.

Elderly people are physically weak and scared. And they lash out in their fear.

I don't know anyone who really enjoys going to visit their elderly relatives, but they do it from care.

Shouldn't we give more compassion to the elderly, because they are weaker than ourselves?[/quote]
You don't "know a lot of elderly people who are exactly the same" @Mufasa1118

If you did, you would recognise the symptoms of a serious Cluster-B personality disorder when you read them.

The elderly people you know are responding to circumstances.
This woman was unpleasant before she became elderly.
She is a nightmare who makes her son's life a misery, & has alienated every single person who knows her.

Giving her "more compassion" will only open the DH up to more abuse.

@ChargingBuck I do know a lot of elderly people like that. My own elderly mother can be a nightmare. She is angry all the time. I often come away from her house completely exhausted.

But I still go and care for her, because I know she had a terrible childhood herself, I know she raised me for 18 years, I know she is in pain all the time, and I know she is scared and lives alone.

No one is good or bad. A lot of people who we see as "bad" were abused themselves as children. I just could not leave my mother alone when I know that she is so physically weak now that she cant do a lot for herself.

I also have friends who struggle with their elderly parents. It is not easy to go and see them but we all still have compassion for them, as we know they are struggling

I just see the other side of this. I know a lot of women who stop their husband from him seeing his mother.
OP has said that they rarely see the elderly woman. She just wants contact with her son! Of course she is going to send her son emails if you never, ever see her.

[quote Mufasa1118]@ChargingBuck I do know a lot of elderly people like that. My own elderly mother can be a nightmare. She is angry all the time. I often come away from her house completely exhausted.

But I still go and care for her, because I know she had a terrible childhood herself, I know she raised me for 18 years, I know she is in pain all the time, and I know she is scared and lives alone.

No one is good or bad. A lot of people who we see as "bad" were abused themselves as children. I just could not leave my mother alone when I know that she is so physically weak now that she cant do a lot for herself.

I also have friends who struggle with their elderly parents. It is not easy to go and see them but we all still have compassion for them, as we know they are struggling[/quote]
But where do u draw line, do u still have contact with abusive parents because they r hurting.... no u shouldnt just put up with abuse because they nay have been abused themselves.

Also a lot of people do bad things doest mean we should allow it just because we dont want to hurt their feelings. And apparently everyone is not good or bad 🤷🏼‍♀️