"But we took you to stately homes"... a thread for adult children of abusive families

[Pages]

This thread is a follow up to "My mother has cut me out of her life - long sorry" because we reached the end of the thread life.

I originally posted on that thread to say that my mother had blamed me for something that was in fact her fault, called me a liar, got the rest of the family to gang up on me and then blamed me for splitting up the family.

It generated a huge amount of interest from a number of women who, like me, had grown up in an abusive, or "toxic" family environment where we had been the scapegoat or the dustbin for our parents to dump their own unresolved difficulties. My mother, like all our mothers, has refused to apologise for what she has done and many of us have cut ties with our families in order to recover our lost selves and self-esteem.

TMSB

I still nailbite, and have done for years. In exactly the same way you describe. My GP told me it was OCD. Reading this it is a form of self harm. I have chewed my nails, hangnails and cuticles since I was 11 years old.

Any ideas?

My nailbiting is atrocious. I've always bitten them until they bled, still do. Its the one thing that hasn't got better since the split from my parents. I've noticed I do it more before a stressful event or during stressful time, but its always there. I think I have nerve damage that is not going to be repaired TBH.

Anyone chew the inside of their mouth? Or just me?

I also rock myself at times...or jig leg a lot to the point of annoyance...my 'best' friend at school when I was 11 nearly hit me once for it...!

Hi

Been very low this weekend again. Not sure why its always weekends for me? (opposite to you oneplusone)
Nothing from mother since the phonecall with DH, which is good and initially I felt a lot more relaxed not having to jump at the phone.

Thing is I think it is now all starting to dawn on me. he reality that is. Im wavering in my mind between feelings of complete disbelief, by that I mean the shock/disbelief/realisation of actually not having the 'imaginary' family I'd set up for myself for so many years now.
My mind then plays tricks on me, and I start to tell myself 'was it really that bad?', 'was it really abusive after all?'. I think this is me trying to conform to old patterns??? Perhaps trying to slip back into the comfort zone. Planning my escape route from discomfort.

I think Im realising now that my concerns over my lack of emotion for everything that has happened these last two months, was warranted.
(if Im honest) I know I am now teetering on the edge of a huge precipiece of sorrow.
I know that sounds far fetched, but that is the best way to describe it.
I now see just how fearful I am of the emotion that is welling. I am also mindful of the fact Im pg and Pages I think it was you that mentioned self preservation at this point.
At least I am coming to the point where I am able to admit to the sheer fear I have of facing my sorrow . So that's a good thing in itself right?
I haven't heard from middle DB, since 'that phonecall', and Im imagining the worst. I know....paranoia. But I am so used to the gang mentality. My Therapist said why dont you jusy ring middle db and tell him your reasons? I know this would be sensible but my fear of rejection by my family is so sharpened and keen that the thought of picking up the phone right now gives me extreme anxiety.
I know, without a shadow of a doubt, mother 'will' have rang and her story will have only a single element of truth in it. She will have sobbed down the phone at how DH abused her down the phone! And, Im sure will have added, and HE (as in DH) KNOWING my current condition! She sure set that up cleverley didnt she.
I re-read some of the old thread last night and It was the part where your mum pages, sent a letter saying to forgive yourself for feeling bad about your ds's autism, and that it was genetic. (sorry to drag that up)
You stated firstly, he wasnt autistic, and secondly you suddenly saw through this letter, how it was manipulating you to cop out of the whole thing and at the same time absolve your mother of any reponsibility and put the onus back on you.
I realised after reading this how good my mother is at doing the exact same. Everything is staged and designed to pull the attention and empathy back to her.

Im hoping this will help just to get it out. But Im sorry to sound so me me me right now. Oh how I hate that, reminds me of you know who!

Relief then dawning realisation you don't have her chasing you anymore, does she want/love me anymore. What have I done to her...

Those were my thoughts when I finally did it. So you sound on track

Was the abuse that bad? What would make a reasonable lady like yourself cut your own family out of your life? Just for the agro of it when so pg??

Afraid I don't know about the sorrow, missed that bit so far apart from glimpses. Lots of ladies on here know only too well the sorrow so I will leave that bit to them.

Your doing the right thing. The abuse WAS that bad, abused people always underestimate the damage to themselves its more than you imagine most likely.

Can't think of anymore to say, got to go out now. You have my hugs though. Your doing great, and if in doubt, just remember your last labour...that is one justifiable reason in itself to keep your mother from you at this time. Let alone the rest of the abuse.

allyxxxxxxxxxx

Oh Smithfield, you don't sound "me me me" at all. You sound the opposite, like someone who is caring about everyone else except for themselves.
WHen I was pregnant I felt as though my baby gave me "power" to be strong because of the desire to protect it from all the shit in the world. I'm sure you feel the same. Try to draw on all your inner resources right now. Its a shitty time to have to do this and battle with your memories and family when you'Re pregnant. But then our mothers do tend to pounce at happy milestones in our lives, so this situation was not to be avoided. In fact, it was anticipated all along.
Forget right now what people think of you. YEs, yes, you're the "evil, inconsiderate, selfish daughter, with a selfsish husband." Who cares. Let them think what they like. WE know the truth. You know the truth. DOn't spend energy getting people to believe you. I don't think now is the right time to call your brother TBH. She will make him believe her side of the story, and you shouldn'T spend energy persuading him.

Just stick to your guns- no contact. She's upping the pressure, but you can handle it. The alternative is that you meet her, and she sends you into labour like she bloody did last time. So just stay away, keep focused. Do some meditation, some swimming, go for a drive. Take each day at a time and it will pass, and these feelings will pass, and this awful time will pass and in a year you will look back at this time and wonder why on earth you were so upset over the antics of a shrivelled old woman, and you will be amazed that you were so upset over this, and you will realise how absolutely right you were to keep your mother and your family away from you at the end of your pregnancy.
you'Re going to come out the other end such a stronger person.

Because (and this was the real kicker for me), no matter what you do, and how much you try to please her, she will never be pleased i.e she will never love you properly.

I spend my entire childhood looking after my mother and father, being their shoulder to cry on, their rock to lean on, all the while being screamed at and smacked and hit on a weekly basis and they repaid me for my kindness by trying to sabotage my wedding!!!
THat was finally when the penny dropped. They didn't love me, never would.

Hi PurpleOne, Sakura, Ally90,
About nail biting...

JUST STOP IT!

Hi, smithfield, sorry you have had a low weekend. If it's any consolation I had a very low Sunday. Saturday i just felt completely numb which was a bit weird. Think i was just very tired as haven't been sleeping well at all (not surprisingly).

What you describe about being on the edge of a precipice of sorrow and the fear of having to face 'your truth' is very familiar to me. Only i went headlong down the precipice without stopping to think, only because a lot of what i've been through has happened spontaneously and i've worked it out 'backwards' once i discovered all the books mentioned on this thread.

I can fully understand your fear of feeling your sorrow as when i went over the precipice i remember sobbing and sobbing as if my heart was breaking. Luckily at the time DH was there and tbh neither of us knew what was happening really but he just held me and comforted me without saying anything and eventually i got through the pain and came out the other side.

I don't really know what to say to you as, you have rightly pointed out you are heavily pregnant and feeling these overwhelming emotions whilst pregnant is not something i have had experience of.

But, on the positive side, although feeling my sorrow was agony, once i got through it i felt a lot happier and stronger. Alice Miller says 'feeling' your childhood pain is the only way to overcome it and now when i feel my pain i accept it as a positive thing and know that i am on the way to recovery.

For my part, I felt very sad on Sunday as DH could i think tell i was having an emotional day without me saying anything to him and he was such a sweetheart towards me. On the one hand it was lovely, but on the other it made me very sad to think that I am 37 years old and this is the first time in my life that i have felt really loved, cared for and nurtured. DH has always been lovely towards me but i haven't been able to 'feel' his love until now i think, partly as i was numb and partly because all my childhood emotions prevented me from feeling anything else.

From what you have said you are making progress and it for me has definately been a case of 2 steps forward and 1 step back. Just trust in your feelings and if your DH is around perhaps he can support you if your feelings surface and overwhelm you. x

Hi. Hope you're feeling better smithfield. I'm not . In fact I'm feeling worse. I just feel really down and depressed. Like some other people have been saying i just feel so tired of all this. I want to switch my brain and mind off. I want to go back to ignorant bliss (i know it wasn't really) but before all this happened i was relatively happy but with a 'fly in the ointment' as it were, the 'fly' being my family. I know the reality is there were many other things wrong as well and my whole life, including myself was just a house of cards, but I have honestly never felt so down or emotional or had such bad health problems for so long, it's really all getting me down and i hate the way it affects my family life. ie when i feel down i just can't seem to get past it and the weekend just goes by without me really engaging with the children and i know they are missing out. Sorry for moaning and also for just talking about 'me' (i know how you feel smithfield) recently, i really feel like i have had enough and i just can't put on a brave face and carry on day after day anymore.

Oneplusone, I got tired of it all at one point, mainly at my mother continuing trying to provoke a response. Just wanted to lay down and sleep and forget it all, except I had insomnia thinking of it all at night...

Not quite the same situation as yours, but I do understand the being 'so tired'. I think I just worked through it in the end. More than anything I think I was tired of thinking about it all of the time. Tired of worrying what my mother would do next, and how would I react/feel.

Possibly a distraction would be good for you, a break of some kind? Something to completely take your mind off your mother and see there is another side of life where you actually can be happy and have fun. I know, mad isn't it (said in Dougal from father ted way...). Just a few hours of shopping/rollercoaster rides/art gallery (possibly too quiet... )

Hope something is possible for you. Oh and I also found reading next to impossible unless it was an abuse book which wasn't really distracting or relaxing...

You will get through the other side. There is a reason for your depression...and you are feeling things so that is all good. Healing takes time...hope that's not too twee...

xxx

oneplusone, hope things are okay with you there. Keep posting. Same to you- when you get through this, things are going to be so much better...Things do get worse before they get better, and it honestly sounds like you are hitting bottom now, which means very soon, you will wake up one day and the cloud will have passed.
Also, its winter now, and cloudy weather is really hard on mental health, I think. Your children aren't missing out. THis is the best thing you could do for them. At least you are feeling these emotions now. allys right- there is a reason for your depression.

I had a good cry/sob late yesterday and felt much better for it. Took me the most part of the day to get there, I seem really quite determined to hold it in it seems. Its like Im afraid to start crying in case I dont stop.

Ally- I cant relate to the why isn't she chasing me yet (too much of a relief after her recent onslaught), but Im sure it will come. But yes I have frequent bouts of 'what have I done to her!'. Glad to hear I am on track
Thanks for the hugs and kind words, they are much appreciated.
I wondered if you did much crying through your teens/twenties? I know I did and am hoping that will stand me in good stead now. As in, maybe Ive already let go emotionally of some of the things from my childhood.
You are right with regard to ds' birth though. And I do hold on to that. I have to.
I think I was so exhausted and sapped of energy directly afterwards (aren't we all), I went numb, mild PND followed and it is only now that I realise just how bloody angry I was (still am) about it.
I need to hold on to that anger now.

Sakura- You are too kind. Thankyou. I dont see it as me thinking of others, but as being needy, oversenitive.....etc. Guess I am prone, as many of us are on here, to mentally berating myself. Doing my mothers work.
I know nothing I do will ever be enough for her, but think I have only realised it in recent times. I just have to break through the many mechanisms that were put in place over the years that have stopped me acting on that knowledge. Main mecahnisms being 'fear of rejection', and 'self doubt.'...to name but a few.
I think most recently my ploy to stay connected to my mother has been 'if I can just get her to see how she hurts me/others'.....But of course that will never ever work. Our mothers are never ever wrong, they can only be right and they will defend that position to the very end. That's the sad part, they are so intent on being right they are willing to lose us.

Oneplusone-You ask if it's any consolation? Well yes and know. No because I hate to think anyone is feeling this bad. And yes because I think I am reaching the point you are at and so I know you can relate to what Im going through now and what will probably continue for some time.
I think I have held back because my realisation has been different to yours. I have always been 'aware' of both of my parents abuse for some time. My realisation has been that I have to give up all hope that they will suddenly change. I have to give up my willingness to believe 'THIS TIME' they will be different. I have to move away from the electric fence.
There was a great analogy in the book Im reading about as a child drinking from a well. How you enjoy the experience of drawing from the well, and drinking the water from it.
Until one day you draw the water and it makes you ill. The water is contaminated. However you never quite get past the old memory of the well and the happyness it once brought you. So you may try a different bucket to draw the water, or try drinking the water from a favourite cup.
You try so many things determined to recapture just a glimpse of the happyness you once felt and refusing to believe the water, no matter what we do.... remains contaminated.
That is pretty much my story. I have to deal with the fact the well is contaminated, and grieve for the lose of a belief, hope, dream that I have held for far to long.
I think it is harder for you in a way, because I think you were oblivious to what your mother had put you through as a child!
But we are both still grieving an image we both had of our past that simply doesnt exist.
Im sure this will take time and as the others say it will be a difficult journey. But we are both strong,we CAN get through it. And as the others say we will be even stronger as a result.
Im looking forward to being able to post on here in a years time and reflect on the changes in both of us. Hugs.

Thank you ally, sakura and smithfield for your kind, supportive and understanding posts. I have recieved so much acceptance, kindness and understanding on this thread, more than i have ever received in real life from anyone including DH. I cannot thank you all enough for your time and concern, even though we have never met i somehow feel closer to you than to people i know i real life. I actually hope that one day we can all meet up, i feel we have such a huge thing in common with each other, whatever other differences we have in our lives I think we would all get on wonderfully.

This morning i had a bit of an 'explosion' at DH. I have been bottling up a lot of stuff about his behaviour towards me and also MIL's behavior towards me and it all came out during a phone call this morning. He has hurt me very badly over the years and i honestly beleive that it is because at some instinctive/primeval level he could also sense i was an easy target or he did not value me just like my parents didn't and i have 'realised' that both DH and MIL have been using me to 'act out' their own childhood issues in exactly the same way my own parents used me. Only it's very complicated as DH is also very caring and kind towards me as well (but then so were my parents sometimes) so i think this 'realisation' has been brewing for a while. I think now that was what was causing the depression perhaps as i feel so much better now i have let some of my feelings out during my 'explosion' this morning.

DH wants to talk this evening but he is HOPELESS at listening and in total and utter denial about the toxicity of his mum so i'm not sure if our talk will achieve anything.

Ok, have to go, but thanks once again for your support, i felt bad about my 'down' post yesterday, as if i would drag you all down with me which of course i would never want to do. x

Thank you ally, sakura and smithfield for your kind, supportive and understanding posts. I have recieved so much acceptance, kindness and understanding on this thread, more than i have ever received in real life from anyone including DH. I cannot thank you all enough for your time and concern, even though we have never met i somehow feel closer to you than to people i know i real life. I actually hope that one day we can all meet up, i feel we have such a huge thing in common with each other, whatever other differences we have in our lives I think we would all get on wonderfully.

This morning i had a bit of an 'explosion' at DH. I have been bottling up a lot of stuff about his behaviour towards me and also MIL's behavior towards me and it all came out during a phone call this morning. He has hurt me very badly over the years and i honestly beleive that it is because at some instinctive/primeval level he could also sense i was an easy target or he did not value me just like my parents didn't and i have 'realised' that both DH and MIL have been using me to 'act out' their own childhood issues in exactly the same way my own parents used me. Only it's very complicated as DH is also very caring and kind towards me as well (but then so were my parents sometimes) so i think this 'realisation' has been brewing for a while. I think now that was what was causing the depression perhaps as i feel so much better now i have let some of my feelings out during my 'explosion' this morning.

DH wants to talk this evening but he is HOPELESS at listening and in total and utter denial about the toxicity of his mum so i'm not sure if our talk will achieve anything.

Ok, have to go, but thanks once again for your support, i felt bad about my 'down' post yesterday, as if i would drag you all down with me which of course i would never want to do. x

We all have down days oneplusone, and its a really positive thing you can recognise you are depressed, AND post here to get your feelings validated. So you are taking a big step forward recognising you actually have feelings you want to share.

I do empathise with you having an unsupportive dh. I know at times my dh can be brilliant, but at the same time very emotionally distant. But I do wonder if I'm trying to make him into my surrogate mother (someone else said this on the thread, Pages?) which obviously he never can be. But I think yours is a different kettle of fish in that he does not understand why you have done this?? And he continues the same pattern with his mother which is a bit of a double whammy for you. Perhaps, concentrate on his good bits for now, and validate your feelings on here until you feel stronger to tackle the subject with him again? Glad you had an emotional outburst though, better out than in

Got so much catching up to do but just popped on to say hi everyone and hope you are all okay.

I'm about 3 pages behind and have only just read the last couple of posts but wanted to say Oneplusone that I have a freind who suffers from depression and she rang me this week to say exactly what you said, about being an easy target. She said she thinks people see her weakness and at work she has noticed that if one person treats her with disrespect others join in. She also has had enough and is starting to stand up for herself. I think this is what happened to me within my family, my weakness was certainly used against me, and I never got angry or upset for fear of losing them all. It feels very weak and pathetic to me now, not at all how I feel now about myself.

Got a load of photos in the post this morning btw, from my mother. All of me, older brother, her and my dad. Her holding me in every photo (all of them were of me as a baby). Presumably to prompt a sentimental response from me, remind me how loved I was. As a baby that is. Funny how I have never seen a single photo of me being held or even touched beyond about the age of 18 months. Whereas with my family (as in my OWN family) just about every photo with us all in it has us with our arms round each other .

I don't mean I think my friend is weak or pathetic, just ME. Wish I had stuck up for myself sooner. But then again, even now, I still do find it hard when someone is off with me not to draw the conclusion that it is my fault. It's hard to break out of isn't it?

Hi PAges, I was wondering how you were, but I guessed you were okay. People who don't post for a while tend to be doing okay!!

Oneplusone, I think its really interesting what you wrote about people sensing they can take advantage of you at a primeaval level. I have to say that when I read your post about your DH and MIL, I could really relate to it. Same as yours, my DH can be kind and generous, but I do think that when I met him, I was in a really bad way. Since the marriage I've become stronger and to be fair, he has adapted to the new me quite well. MIL went for the jugular after I had DD. She just revealed herself to be a bully, a nasty, snidey, sadistic bully, and she raised DH , so DH is of course quite controlling, but I recognise it now and tell him and I don'T think he's "bad", like MIL.

SO after leaving my childhood home, I went on to attract bullies. It was pArtly me, I suppose, because bullies were all I had experienced in my life, so it didn't cross my mind that they even were bullies. But this thread helped me stand up to MIL, which was much easier than standing up to my mother!!
I like to think MIL had a shock that I stood up to her. I was ready to leave my husband and just go. Some survival instinct kicked in. But deep down, know that she just thinks "Ooh, what an unreasonable person my son married", but hey ho, who cares- I'M not the one who lives my life by being sadistic- she is. And I do believe in karma.

Pages, you should send some photos back of you with your children all hugging at an OLDER age (not just as babies). I wonder if she'll get the hidden message. I'm sure she will. These people are experts on hidden messages and ulteriour motives.

Message withdrawn

Message withdrawn

Just need to share, and need a hug as well.

My mother is extremely abusive, both emotionally and until I was 21 physically. I live in Asia now, and today, again she found a way to hurt me. I am self employed (it's the one f the few things in my life that I love) and she has been writing to my employees behind my back and making them feel sorry for her. I am extrememly angry and very upset. I just found this out this mrning only becuse one of my employees forwarded her emails to me.

The woman kicked me in the stomach when I was 20 and then told me she did it "because she didn't want me to leave." I have had a crackd rib and fingers broken by this bitch. I can't stand her, yet she pretends as if I'm the one doing something wrong. She knows I don't talk to my eldest sister and she winds me up saying "Oh have you spoken to her lately?" M sister btw no longer speaks to any of us. When I told my mother to stop asking me, she said, well you know you love her. Actually, I feel the same way toward my eldest sister as i do toward the rest of my family , total indifference.

I have a very god friend. My mother used to tell her things about me to make me look bad. My bitch of a mother is jealous of the relationship I have with my friend and likes to rub the feww arguements we have had in my face.

I am having a rough time coping at the moment. I don't want her in m ife anymore, but she won't stop interfering and hurting me. I was suicidal at one point and to be honest, if I didn't have my job or this one lovely friend, I don't think I could cope.

I hopei didn't offend anyone with the swearing, this is a very painful subject for me and I have trouble talking about it.

sabaidii- Your mother sounds mentally disturbed. Someone who kicks their own child in the stomach....because they 'DON'T' want them to leave???

Firstly you need to congratulate yourself for at least getting away from her physically, because I for one know how challenging that is in itself.

You sound like you now need to extricate yourself emotionally and mentally.
Im just wondering if there is anything you can do leagally to prevent her from approaching your clients. Is what she doing libelous? Im not sure of the legal system in Asia? Is your mother in the uk? Is what she is writing balatant defamation? or is she like many of our mothers far more subtle?

It sounds like you have verbal contact with her atm, I think you need to stop this as this is giving her an opportunity to continue hurting and disrespecting you. Do you think you would be able to cut her out altogether? Hug to you.