He said I don't deserve him and the bottom has fallen out of my world

[holymoly678]

A few weeks ago I made contact with my estranged mother - we haven't spoken in 6 years. I was worried about the impact on my kids and particularly when she is gone.
Yesterday I made the mistake of broaching to my husband maybe I could invite my parents for Christmas dinner. She's not been good to him at all the last 6 years and I appreciate it was a stupid idea to come away with after all this time.
The fall out has been catastrophic. He's been brutally honest about how he feels about me and our relationship and has said that it is over. Lots of examples of how poorly I've treated him, things I've done in the past. He said I haven't cared enough to make any changes to be a better person. He's told me I don't deserve him.

He is right.
He's going to come back to me in a few days to let me know "what happens next".

Do I stay out his way until then? Do I make an exit plan to make it easier?
I don't want to hurt him anymore.

I've said my piece and offered support - the trolls are here now. I'm ducking out before MN deletes the thread TTFN and good luck OP

@Gilda152 no, we don’t need to be unbiased. We’re not a marriage councillor who is advising them both. We’re responding to one woman whose partner has convinced her she’s a terrible person and that he’s a martyr for putting up with her, and who seems quite clearly to be psychologically manipulating and harming her.

He berates her for hours, tells her she’s an awful person for all manner of petty reasons, but had convinced her that ever criticising her or even saying something that might upset him rather than anticipating it and saying silent (!?) makes her awful and undeserving of love.

To try and convince a woman in this situation that her gaslighting abuser might have a point is effectively participating in that abuse. She’s not a bad person, and she certainly doesn’t deserve this treatment because nobody does. Whether or not she’s always behaved perfectly is besides the point. Nobody is perfect anyway, but what’s clear is this man is making her miserable and convincing her to hate herself, and she needs to get out. Again, she is the one who is asking for advice. He’s not posting on this thread.

@EineReiseDurchDieZeit less unfair than leaving her to read uninformed replies telling her that her husband is probably right about her, which is why I did it.

I think some of us just know exactly what it's like to be gaslit into believing we're the bad guys Gilda152. Once that's happened to you from someone who got their hooks in, you spot it in the way others write.

This.

Fair play. I responded based off OPs post and didn't see yours til too late.

Good luck @holymoly678
You'll always find support here if you need it

@holymoly678 I’m really glad that you can see the pattern. Even if you think you’ve somewhat contributed to things becoming the way they are, the situation now is that he’s destroying you mentally and you are not ever going to be happy in this relationship.

Love and strength to you. You can have a happy life if you free yourself from this trap. The amount of work you’ve done on yourself, including stopping drinking, shows that you have it in you.

@EineReiseDurchDieZeit good on you for quickly acknowledging it. The issue is it’s basically OP’s partner talking through her when she self-crits, he really seems to have drilled into her that she’s the entire problem

@EineReiseDurchDieZeit

Fair play. I responded based off OPs post and didn't see yours til too late.

Perhaps you could ask for your post to be withdrawn before OP sees it?

I knew he was going to be a gaslighting abuser from the thread title and looks like I was proved right!

@Gilda152

All of this thread is supportive of the OP.

Most of this thread are surprisingly psychics who know the ins and outs of your relationship better than you do, based on one account of it. It's actually incredibly patronising as if OP is a silly child who can't see what's in front of her eyes.

OP, only you know if you are in a relationship with a truly abusive man. No bunch of complete strangers can tell you that, much as they like to speculate. You have owned up to your own poor behaviour in this and we don't know if he has or he hasn't as that hasn't been truly commented on. You've done amazing work on yourself and I think your best bet is not to let your vision be skewed by people who don't know you or your husband. He may well be abusive and horrible. If he is, the clarity of that will come with his absence. He may be someone who has been supportive of you through extremely difficult and challenging periods of behaviour and he's now on his last thread with the whole situation.

We,none of us know. Let everything cool down and see where the pieces fall on this one.

Not a psychic, but I can still tell that a. you haven't read the whole thread and b. you have little experience of domestic abuse victims and dynamics.

OP please get in touch with Women's Aid. It's not you, it's him

It's actually incredibly patronising as if OP is a silly child who can't see what's in front of her eyes.

Er ... no.

OP, only you know if you are in a relationship with a truly abusive man.

And ... no.

Thousands of women don't know they are in an abusive relationship.
It's one of the most basic hallmarks of coercive control - that the victim is made to believe that she is the villain. That she minimises & self-blames. That it is almost impossible for her to accept how badly she is being treated, because if she makes it her own fault, there's a faint chance at controlling his reactions.

There isn't.

OP gave up drinking & entered long term counselling to "fix" the things he said were 'wrong' with her.
It didn't stop him drinking, & picking fights.
So she started 'de-escalating' i.e. never challenging him, kowtowing to keep the peace.
No longer being able to throw her drinking at her, DH simply chose a new excuse - the contact with her mother.

No matter what OP does, DH will find something to berate.
He harangued her for 6 hours - shouting, criticism & abuse - while drinking all the way through it.

What IS incredibly patronisng, @Gilda152, is handing out damaging 'advice' while demonstrating that the advisor doesn't recognise the signs of an abusive relationship, or the dynamics of why the OP has difficulty in accepting that it is one.

@Vanishun

Have requested

Does he see your mother as part of your own problems? Is so, he might see bringing her back into your life as sabotaging your progress. He may also feel annoyed that he has supported you this far and you are now turning to someone else who isn't good for you.None of this is about you not breing deserving of someone to love you, but it may be an indicator it shouldn't be him. Supporting someone with addiction is tough and can bring out some difficult feelings, one of which can be the need to control the person to stop them slipping back. Another can be a deep resentment that can be brought out by small annoyances. This is obviously not healthy for either person, but sometimes the feeling is so ingrained there's no resolve other than to move on

I don't think it's the op that has the addiction problem. It's not her having 6 hour drunken rants

He's gas lighting you. 6 hours of ranting just because you mentioned asking your mum to Christmas dinner. He's trying to wear you down even more than he already has

I have my own suspicions but I can also see that this is a difficult situation to read from the thread. So I'll say this. OP, you've made amazing progress with giving up drinking and addressing your own flaws. You are a strong person. Sometimes being strong means that strength is something you seem to be often called up on harness for the benefit of others, e.g. your mother or your husband. It's also ok to not always think first of how you're going to make things right with them, or for them, but to think about whether your life and choices make YOU happy. If not, maybe it's time to change them. I am in no doubt you can cope with that and with being alone if needs be. You might find yourself coping better than your husband. Step back and think about your own needs and dreams here. You will be ok.

@EveryFlightBeginsWithAFall

I don't think it's the op that has the addiction problem. It's not her having 6 hour drunken rants

He's gas lighting you. 6 hours of ranting just because you mentioned asking your mum to Christmas dinner. He's trying to wear you down even more than he already has

Did the op say he had rented at her for 6 hours??

OP, your husband is abusive. (Sadly, it's very common for people with abusive parents to form relationships with abusers as adults, so if your mother is abusive it is perhaps not a surprise.)

He is not going to turn around one day and say, "There's nothing wrong with you, it's not all your fault, I'm an abuser." He is going to continue to blame you for everything, not because it's true, but because it's convenient for him to do so.

Ring Women's Aid. (It doesn't matter if he's not physically violent.) They will help you sort all this out in your head and make a plan to leave him.

Hi OP

We just wanted to get in touch, as when these threads are flagged - we like to add a link to our domestic violence webguide.

It includes many, many useful links, and we know that Mumsnet can be a very supportive place, but we would always advise seeking real-life support, too.

He's not a bully. I think what he wants from me I am incapable of. He wants 100% harmony, agreement, tolerance. For me not to say the things that then create the drama, to read his cues and know its the wrong thing to say. I'm not capable.

Nobody is responsible for regulating someone else's moods.

If he wants an experience where a woman isn't an equal with as much right to an opinion as him, even if it's not the same as his, he should get a sex doll instead of bullying real women.

@holymoly678

Unless I am missing something obvious, what purpose would it serve for him to be bullying and abusive in this way? What could he possibly gain?

Compliance.

@IknowwhatIneed

For me not to say the things that then create the drama, to read his cues and know its the wrong thing to say. I'm not capable.

That’s ridiculous- how much of yourself would you need to give away to not speak, for there never to be drama?

So basically you are to walk on eggshells whenever you're around him and are responsible for carrying the emotional load of your relationship.

That's some bullshit right there. I recently divorced my abusive husband for many of the same behaviors your H is showing. Except in my case, my mother is dead but I wasn't allowed to even say the words" my mother" around him or else he'd rage at me for hours and bring it up every chance he get.

My exH was indeed a bully, also.

I want to ask you - you have made changes in your life AND you are in therapy. What has HE done to help make your marriage stronger???

I will never forget when I was facetiming my then husband after a therapy session, and he said he doesn't see any progress because I was still triggering him by "acting out." And by acting out, what I mean is bursting into tears because he retracted an apology from the day before. I wasn't allowed to express my valid emotions because it would trigger him. He started at me impassively while I was crying, and said through clenched teeth, "I WANT TO SEE SOME PROGRESS!"

What gives your H the right to rage at you? Especially for hours? And after drinking?

Also, there is no such thing as 100% harmony, agreement and tolerance. Unless one of you is controlling and the other is 100% submissive. That's not a relationship. That's him wanting power and authority of you.

Asking about inviting your mum to Xmas day lunch is not a reason to throw a grenade like he has done. He could have just said “I don’t think it’s a good idea”. You are being abused. You’ve been bullied by your mother and you are being bullied by your husband. You quite clearly have Stockholm syndrome and are probably hysterically bonding after each of these fall outs. You are human and not perfect. You are buying his narrative of your relationship. You are letting him constantly devalue you. Please stop. He’s not the only man in the world and you can survive without him. You’ve asked why he does this. He does it because he can. Because you chase him. Because you have been punishing yourself for years. You are what’s called “narcissistic supply”. You need weekly therapy with somebody who knows about co dependency and narc supply. He is not behaving like an adult or kindly or maturely. This relationship is dysfunctional and you shouldn’t be with anyone until you’ve had at least a year of intensive therapy for boundary setting.
Do not communicate with him again. Go see a solicitor and file for divorce. The only way for you to heal is to take back some power. If you let him decide he will forgive you and move back you will live your life in this DARVO cycle.

@dramalessllama that’s horrific. Did you split with him? How is your life now?