Living with narcissistic DH

[SuperbFoolish]

So, I've finally figured it all out and can see my DH for who he is. After years of gas lighting, manipulation, cheating, baiting, love bombing, I've realised what's going on and why I've never been happy with him.

My relatives, everyone, thinks he's a great guy, and he puts on such an act when we're around other people, that they don't have any reason to think otherwise. You've got such a great husband' You're the perfect couple' He's such a wonderful dad' and I've been left feeling mean and selfish inside for ever even thinking badly about him. I've never said a word to anyone.

Of course I want to divorce him, but we have two kids. He is a good, attentive dad who does his fair share of all household stuff and childcare. He reads bedtime stories, builds legos, makes pancakes for breakfast, cleans poo off the floor, mops up sick and all the rest. Can't complain.

But.. He has a nasty streak with the kids too. Overly critical, devalues, doesnt respect their feelings, punishes too harshly.. But because he is so great on the outside no one would ever believe me he's this nasty person. He would get 50% custody, and I can't do that. At least when he's here in the house I can jump in and stop the situation if it goes too far, or talk things through with the kids and console them.

Anyone else Bern in this situation? How do I live with him. Even this past week I've spotted his effort to manipulate me in every single conversation we've had, and I've called him up on them. He hates it. Shouts at me that I'm arrogant, on my high horse, think that I'm better than him..

He's a very clever narcissist. Goes out of his way to help others, shows gratitude, polite, well spoken. But with me he uses my vulnerabilities against me when it suits him, lies, ridicules my interests and devalues them. I'm studying a masters degree and it gets called 'a vanity project'. Outward support. Inward shit..

I've been the child in this scenario if it helps. My M never left for whatever reason.
She now hasn't seen me, my husband or 3 kids in about 5 years. So she lost half of her entire family due to her loyalty to my F (his abuse became intolerable and I had to go NC as a last resort).
I guess that's what you're risking further down the line. Or he alienates them from you...

Sorry you're going through this 💐

Yep. I decided to leave him, I knew I wouldn’t get any support because he was such a “nice husband and wonderful parent” “. He wasn’t, he may have made coffee for me every morning, brought me flowers regularly and played with DS, but he was an abusive bully to DS throughout the day and a selfish guy who only thought about himself and abused me in private.

I decided to follow some wise advice from a friend: You leave, but leave when it suits YOU.

So I spent 3 years preparing my exit, building my financial independence, putting together a “get the hell out of here fund” and left when I was ready and the time was right.

I saw those last three years living with him as a scholarship, where he paid to keep a roof over our heads and put food on the table while I was getting ready to leave. Having this perspective and the goal to leave kept me sane, as I could see the light at the end of the tunnel with every bit of independence I built.

Obviously, with a narcissist, the problems won’t stop even if you split but, as long as you don’t bring their competitive side out and pretend to be boring he will leave you alone enough to rebuild a nice life for yourself and the kids. So yes, continue with your “vanity project”, it is part of a good preparation that will come handy in your new life without him.

The kids will pick up on this and his harsh side will only get worse sadly
Been there 😔

He's not a good dad. Please do the freedom programme

Big sympathies OP, I have a similar situation.

So what’s the solution - leave him and know the kids are fully at his mercy with no buffer 50% of the time? I’m struggling to see the benefit.

Confide in a close family member first. Are you sure he would want 50/50 you would need to state your concerns.

It's worrying you fear your DH could go too far and punishes harshly in what way?

Like @tobedtoMNandfart I've been the child in this situation, and I agree with every word she's posted. Your children won't thank you for staying. You are asking the wrong question 'How do I live with him?' You should be saying 'I'm not going to make my children live with him'...get them out, put them first. My mother put herself and my father first, and now plays the martyr for doing so 'I did it for you kids' (of course it all ended badly, he left her for OW when I was 21).

My mother can't understand now why neither myself or my two brothers have had any children of our own, cannot make the connection that our shit childhood did not inspire us to. My older brother has told his wife that he has no happy memories of our father or our childhood. Do you want that for your children?

Honestly, narcissists are so selfish they won’t want so much time unsupervised with the kids once they find something more interesting to kill the time with, as long as you don’t bring their competitiveness to the fore.

You are not much of a buffer really, it may sound like you are protecting the kids but in reality, staying only teaches them that his behaviour is normal and what they should expect in their own relationships when they grow up. Unbeknown to you, your kids may be wishing you build the courage to leave to spare them of such toxic behaviour.

You should be saying 'I'm not going to make my children live with him'.

But that’s just it, she doesn’t want the kids to live with him, but if she goes, they’ll still be living with him half the time, only without her to shield them from his elaborate excesses.

I was in a long abusive marriage. It is one thing realising it and another getting the confidence to end it.

My exh wanted lots of contact with the kids. He sees them 12-15 hours a week max spread over three days. No nights.

I put it off thinking kids were too young, how would they cope on their own with him.

I wish I did it sooner than I did.

The divorce was tough and things are still tough now as he tries to control me through the kids.

I have been watching some good you tube videos by Lisa A Romano recently to try to understand why I cant seem to fully break free. They might be helpful to you.

Get some free legal advice and try to confide in a friend. You can ring Womens Aid for support too. As another poster suggested there is the Freedom Programme I havent been able to do this because of timings but keep it bookmarked.

Make sure you have an official contact arrangement. I havent and its a nightmare.

And, take one day at a time. It is a long journey, I am still on it nearly four years down the line. You need to stay strong and dig deep. Dont try to think too far ahead all the time focus on the day in front of you. Be kind to yourself. Things fall into place one at a time.

Sending a 🤗

@Totallydefeated There's no guarantee he's going to want them with him 50% of the time. 50% of being with their father is still better than 100% of enduring the fallout from their parents living a lie and pretending ...children pick up on the reality of the relationship between their parents young...I knew by the time I was about 7 that my parents didn't love each other.

@Totallydefeated

You should be saying 'I'm not going to make my children live with him'.

But that’s just it, she doesn’t want the kids to live with him, but if she goes, they’ll still be living with him half the time, only without her to shield them from his elaborate excesses.

You cannot shield anyone from a narcissist.

You can however provide them with a safe place to retreat to for half the time or more. And be a good role model - show that people should not tolerate abuse in a partner, by leaving.

@GrandmasCat

Honestly, narcissists are so selfish they won’t want so much time unsupervised with the kids once they find something more interesting to kill the time with, as long as you don’t bring their competitiveness to the fore.

You are not much of a buffer really, it may sound like you are protecting the kids but in reality, staying only teaches them that his behaviour is normal and what they should expect in their own relationships when they grow up. Unbeknown to you, your kids may be wishing you build the courage to leave to spare them of such toxic behaviour.

This^ Also when the kids get older they can make their own decisions about visiting. By then he will have lost interest. Get out and show them what a good life feels like instead of a life waiting for the explosion to come.

I left my exH nearly 2 years ago. I left because he had affairs (yes, plural!) but now I realise he is a narcissist. He also didn't treat our eldest very well at all, just like you've mentioned, he didn't respect his feelings, overly punished, shouted etc. If I'm totally honest, I should have left him long before for the sake of my son. I remember one night (when still together) googling whether he was emotionally abusing him... I'm so ashamed I thought that and but stayed.
Anyway, when he left he said he wanted 50/50... He didn't ever manage this. He would text me to come and get our son early and just to message me saying the most vile things about him. Our son, is the sweetest, gentlest most empathetic child I know.
He knows sees them EOW and this works okay. He's still unbelievably selfish but he shouts less and the kids only have to deal with it for 2 days and then they come home and know that they are loved, listened to and that I will always put them first. My son often comments that life at home is a lot more peaceful now it's just us 3 and he never want to live as a 4 again... Other people (including my MIL) have commented that he is a different child since his dad left... He's so happy and much more confident.
We also have a younger daughter who he treats better but... I would not have wanted her raised in a home, thinking that how her dad treats people is what to expect from men.
I hope that helps OP xx

Thank you for the replies. Means a lot to be able to see how other people have handled something like this before.

He would definitely want 50/50 with the kids. He's such a great dad on the outside, and I do believe he genuinely cares for them. It's just that his caring doesn't include deep feelings and putting away your own emotions in favour of your child's. It's difficult to explain..

Like he punishes our 9yr old ds for having a tantrum and shouting.. by shouting! And ds asks me why am I not allowed to shout but dad is.. Just one example of many..

I'm just writing all this stuff down so that I don't forget.. Right now I need to go to the University to work on an assignment, and the car tyre needs changing. Its flat. The plan was him to do it this morning, and then I'm off.
The weather is really bad, so he's not doing it. I understand and enquired when does he think he can get it done. He says I must do it myself. Its not that difficult.
I'm beyond frustrated again because today is my only day off and the time ive allocated for this project. He's found a way to get at me, and loving it.
Now he's just gone out for a coffee. He's been at home with ill children all week, and I get it he wants a moment, but it's not just 'I need a moment' It's 'I'll make you pay for whatever I'm feeling right now'

Next week he's going for a long work trip, and he knows I need to finish this assignment before he goes. Not sure how now.. I'm trying not to get worked up because that's his prize. Witholding something I desperately need. Mind games..

Agree with PPs. It won't be easy to break up with him, he may beg, cry, try to turn the kids and others against you, etc. It would be tough but worth it once you're out the other side. And you have one thing going for you: Your knowledge about his affairs gives you some leverage. Does anyone else know about his infidelity? If not, he will be very worried you may not keep his dirty secrets any longer, and be more likely to reign in any nastiness. This has worked in my case so far! I've got screenshots and solid proof of years of infidelity, creepiness and worse. I'm not suggesting you blackmail your H, just subtly making him aware it's in his own interest to keep things civil. Obviously be very careful and report him immediately if he ever becomes threatening as a result. I'd recommend you
-contact Womans Aid, Refuge or similar for advice and to be allocated an IDVA

• make sure you have a paper trail of his emotional abuse and its impact on you (diary, speak to your GP if the situation is affecting your me atal health, etc). This could help you in the future if you need to apply for an occupation or non mol order.
• try to collect hard evidence of his abuse and infidity if possible.
• if he is a true narc and been unfaithful in the past,. I'd bet my bottom dollar he is still at it. Could you find out? Ideally in a legal way so he can't turn any illegal snooping against you later. Make sure you take photos of anything that you could use as leverage later.

This is just what I'd do / have done myself, so obviously ignore any advice that wouldn't work for you. Keep safe, and good luck. You can do this.

@grumpy21 Thank you! You're right. No one knows about his infidelities. It was prostitutes and I have no other proof other than his confession, but it's definitely something I have against him. He wouldn't want anyone to know, as he portrays such an impeccable image of himself. We live in a small town now, and he even refused to go to couples therapy in case the word would get out somehow..

He's going away soon for 3 weeks. Kids are already saying Dad don't go.. We love you etc.. He's capable of having a caring, close relationship with them. It's so confusing.

The other night we had a good talk where he seemed to come to a conclusion that he needed therapy and wants to find out reasons for his behaviour. He got close to me like that. We held hands, and hugged. The next day I was in such a bad mood, got into a disagreement at work, shouted at the kids, and then I got it. Its because I let him back in and he enjoys seeing me unhinged. He gets off on trouble. He just sat there with a smirk when I was having a go at the kids, like he orchestrated it.
Not happening again. Keeping my healthy distance. But now he's trying with this car tyre thing.. Seeing if I get upset..

This is my ex husband. He's managed to blindside his family and I'm the nasty one, but actually so many people told me after we split that he was Narcissistic and tolerated him, because of me. You will be surprised what people actually see.

Tell people. These guys thrive on you shielding them. You’re effectively being his PR and backing up his superdad image by not telling people. It’s embarrassing that he won’t change the tyre, but embarrassing for him not you. Speak up. Ask a neighbour if they know what to do. Ask friends / family. Stop covering for him. Oh, and leave him.

Could you try to change the tyre yourself? I had to recently and was surprised how easy it was. The instructions should be in the car manual. Imagine how satisfying it will be to tell him later that you a managed without him.

I didn't change the tyre, but on my way to uni now via public transport. Its a hassle as I have a big heavy bag full of books and a laptop and it was a walk to get to the station in bad weather, but Im feeling good because I didn't fall for the manipulation, stayed neutral and made a plan. All good. He inconvenienced me on purpose, but I don't care.
The sad thing is that I don't really have other close relationships apart from him. My parents are both dysfunctional, and my mother actually convinced me to get back together with him when we broke up before kids. She's never been interested in my emotional life, and my dad is an alcoholic. Siblings are distant, friends superficial. It's quite clear to see why I've been an easy target for a narcissist..

It's just that his caring doesn't include deep feelings and putting away your own emotions in favour of your child's. I completely understand this. My husband does this too, exactly as you describe.

There are some clever posts on this thread, and especially the PP who used the years between realising and leaving as a scholarship. Clever woman.

I've spent the last six months realising the marriage is a lie, that it has actually been dead for years and years. I cannot believe I've put up with what I have. I am struggling with this bit, knowing I'll have to leave while trying to understand the dynamic in the house and stay on the right side of it. I've been wishing he'd just hit me, so it could be black and white.

@SuperbFoolish I read a book called Women Who Love Too Much and it was exactly about why women get into relationships like the ones it seems we're both in. In the book she says that most of the women she worked with like this were the children of alcoholics. My dad was too. I found it very interesting, and sad.