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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Will social services take her children away?

105 replies

Breastfeedingworries · 25/08/2021 23:15

Hi okay going to keep this as brief as I can because I need some sleep and rest. It’s been an emotional day. Will try and keep vague as I can without much details as don’t want to give situation away. Promise it isn’t myself or a reverse or whatever.

This is reguarding a new friend of mine I haven’t known long.

She was told she couldn’t see an ex (abusive, both of them to each other but she had been in two previous abusive relationships and I do believe in those cases she was the victim) she has two young children, 2,4 both of their dads were abusive.

Anyway she was told she had to tell them when/if she wanted to get back with ex or see him. (He isn’t the father of either child) She did tell them they were planning to get back together. Social services then said okay they would need to do a review and investigation. She naïvely took what they said as permission to go ahead. So she took her children to stay with him.

Things escalated badly, which ended with her fleeing with the children. (Will try and add more detail here as the thread goes on, just wanting to make sure I’m not too outing)
He’s now actually reported her.
She’s got a meeting tomorrow and me and a friend are going to support her.

I just want to get an idea of what could happen to prepare her for the worst. I really want to be a good friend, frankly I never thought I’d be in this situation to ask. Mumsnet is a wonderful place for advice.

OP posts:
LIZS · 26/08/2021 09:06

Are you sure you are aware of the full story? Children cannot be removed without a court order but if she and children are already under SS supervision and the process is more advanced it could still happen fairly quickly. It sounds as if she is not prioritising her children over her relationship. Is she following any of their boundaries, how is she still in contact for example? Does she have legal representation?

Maskedrevenger · 26/08/2021 09:12

Sorry to say it but your friend needs help from professionals not some hand holding from well meaning bystanders. Having experience in this area I can guarantee that your friend has sugar coated what has gone on before and minimised her responsibility in what has happened also she has not taken action as a result of previous advice from SS this will not help her case. This does not mean that the children will automatically be removed from her, SS do not have the resources to do this in every case and it is usually in the children’s best interest to stay with a parent if at all possible but she needs to start listening to SS.

Bluntness100 · 26/08/2021 09:17

I don’t understand, what has he reported her for snd to whom?

Bluntness100 · 26/08/2021 09:20

She did tell them they were planning to get back together. Social services then said okay they would need to do a review and investigation. She naïvely took what they said as permission to go ahead

Do you actually believe that? From someone who has been through as much with social services on this man do you actually believe that? Has she additional needs? Or do you think she’s lying to you?

CloseYourEyesAndSee · 26/08/2021 09:21

@Bluntness100

She did tell them they were planning to get back together. Social services then said okay they would need to do a review and investigation. She naïvely took what they said as permission to go ahead

Do you actually believe that? From someone who has been through as much with social services on this man do you actually believe that? Has she additional needs? Or do you think she’s lying to you?

Why wouldn't this be true? It sounds totally plausible to me
Mushtullo · 26/08/2021 09:21

@Bluntness100

I don’t understand, what has he reported her for snd to whom?
Yes, is it the abusive ex who reported her? To social services? On the grounds of going to stay with him with the children?
Bluntness100 · 26/08/2021 09:24

Why wouldn't this be true? It sounds totally plausible to me

Is this a serious post? At what point does ok we we will need to investigate and do a review translate to crack on?

It wouldn’t be true because she doesn’t wish to admit she just went ahead.

Confused
Bancha · 26/08/2021 09:30

@Bluntness100

Why wouldn't this be true? It sounds totally plausible to me

Is this a serious post? At what point does ok we we will need to investigate and do a review translate to crack on?

It wouldn’t be true because she doesn’t wish to admit she just went ahead.

Confused

Totally agree. There’s no way it was put to her like that. They will have been very clear and I suspect she went back to the ex hoping that Children’s Services wouldn’t find out.

@Breastfeedingworries It sounds like you might be going to a family meeting or similar today, rather than a court hearing. The children can only be forcibly removed with a court order. If you tell us what the meeting you’re going to is I can probably give you an idea of what to expect.

CloseYourEyesAndSee · 26/08/2021 09:33

@Bluntness100

Why wouldn't this be true? It sounds totally plausible to me

Is this a serious post? At what point does ok we we will need to investigate and do a review translate to crack on?

It wouldn’t be true because she doesn’t wish to admit she just went ahead.

Confused

I misunderstood your post. We agree!
Starlightstarbright1 · 26/08/2021 09:33

Yes children can be removed for failure to protect.

The comments about not been better off in foster care ate missing the point witnessing dv is also damaging.

Best thing this mum should be already doing is focusing on the dc. They need support and stability and chance to revocover.

I would say op... be very careful how involved you are getting involved. This woman has a lot of choas and drama in her life . Be very careful of getting too involved.

There is an awful lot you don't know.

Original poster
Breastfeedingworries · 26/08/2021 09:39

I do believe she thought she could go but I think she wanted to believe that’s what it meant. So obviously had her doubts but went there anyway. I’m astounded she didn’t organise care and see him without the children as that is different story and she wouldn’t be in this mess.

I don’t think we have the whole story and I’ve got a good idea things will be said today we didn’t know. I’ve spoke to her this Morning and she sounds calmer so will see how it goes.

From her side it sounds like she acted in self defence of the children, and left to keep them safe. (He didnt harm the children) they both had a physical fight, his mum was present and attacked her first, and she punched his mum, he then strangled her. Then she fled. She should of called the police but didn’t as she knew her part and was worried she’d get in trouble. So he’s reported his side I think to cover himself. (Please remove this thread after 24 hours as now very outing)

OP posts:
CloseYourEyesAndSee · 26/08/2021 09:40

Mumsnet won't remove this thread unless you report it and ask for it to be removed.

Original poster
Breastfeedingworries · 26/08/2021 09:41

I will after today, but the meeting is later.

OP posts:
insidenumber5 · 26/08/2021 09:51

She will have been told over and over again by the children's social worker not to be with this man (and same thing x 2 previously). The SW will have said something like 'I cannot prevent you from having a relationship with or contact with this man, but if you do, I am duty bound to act accordingly' and your new mate has skipped off into his arms. Bet you see a different side to her in the CP conference today.

TeachesOfPeaches · 26/08/2021 09:53

One of the main reasons children are removed from their mothers is the mother refusing or unable to leave a violent or abusive boyfriend/husband.

DumplingsAndStew · 26/08/2021 09:54

@Breastfeedingworries

I’m astounded she didn’t organise care and see him without the children as that is different story and she wouldn’t be in this mess.

I'm not sure that's true, tbh, as that would still be demonstrative of incredibly bad decision making. She needs/needed to cut this person out of her life, as well as her children's.

CutePanda · 26/08/2021 09:58

From reading your updates, I do not think your friend is as innocent as you believe her to be. When she talks about her situation, she is leaving out all the parts that incriminate her.

youvegottenminuteslynn · 26/08/2021 10:00

It doesnt sound like it's in the best interests of the kids to be with either of their parents.

Violence, poor judgement and prioritising their relationship / seeing each other over their children.

I'm unsure why you've decided by default to support a woman you barely know and assume she is a good mum when all evidence points to the contrary.

TooMuchPaper · 26/08/2021 10:01

Ali Jade Maguire was 2 years old when she died in Northern Ireland earlier this month. She, along with her 1 year old brother, was on the child protection register, because her mother was in a relationship with an abusive man (not the children's father). He was to have no access whatsoever to the children. They were left alone with him.
He has been charged with murdering her, her mother has been charged with perverting the course of justice and causing the death of a child by an unlawful act.

Your friend's children need to be kept safe. If your friend can't do that, then someone else will have to.

Hoppinggreen · 26/08/2021 10:04

@CutePanda

From reading your updates, I do not think your friend is as innocent as you believe her to be. When she talks about her situation, she is leaving out all the parts that incriminate her.
Yes, if these are the edited highlights I imagine the truth is far worse. You need to prepare yourself OP to learn things about your friend you will probably not like and think about how you will deal with that
MsTSwift · 26/08/2021 10:07

A young mother in our community got out of a DV relationship people rallied round then she took her child to stay with a new “boyfriend” who murdered them both. So you did the right thing reporting.

Pinkbonbon · 26/08/2021 10:07

I have a feeling she will get a final warning for this. If it's the first time its happened...many women go back to their abusers continuously. And taking her kids away now might make her feel she has nothing to lose. I hope that theyll give her one last chance. But I think if she fucks up again, they would be better off in care.

I also worry that she hasn't even done the freedom programme yet. It's a shame the kids couldn't be put somewhere else temporarily based on conditions like that I these circumstances.

Refreshpage · 26/08/2021 10:10

@Embracelife

2 yrs old znd 4 yr old need stable home She cannot provide that if she takes them to stay with abusive ex She needs to see that Kids may be better off elsewhere
This.

Poor kids living with a parent that makes poor choices that put them in danger. They need someone to look out for them both, they are so young. Imagine if nothing was done and the violent boyfriend that she took them to move in with hurt them or worse - who's fault then - social services/the police for not acting. They act and get condemned - they cannot win.

It a parent cannot or choses not to keep their children safe them someone else needs to step in

Sunshine4you · 26/08/2021 10:12

Sounds like they are both abusive.

Refreshpage · 26/08/2021 10:13

@TooMuchPaper

Ali Jade Maguire was 2 years old when she died in Northern Ireland earlier this month. She, along with her 1 year old brother, was on the child protection register, because her mother was in a relationship with an abusive man (not the children's father). He was to have no access whatsoever to the children. They were left alone with him. He has been charged with murdering her, her mother has been charged with perverting the course of justice and causing the death of a child by an unlawful act.

Your friend's children need to be kept safe. If your friend can't do that, then someone else will have to.

This is exactly the reason why children need removing from parents who fail to understand the need to keep safe above wanting to be with an abusive boyfriend!

Yes she is vulnerable, but she is an adult and also completely unable to put her children above her own needs.