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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

I wonder if I should stop having shared meals with my husband

113 replies

CloudyMoment · 14/08/2021 11:56

So, after 1.5 marriage we have developed communication problems.
He is generally well intentioned, but quite introverted & shy.

We have managed to have a reasonably good level of communication because he usually 1)listened to me 2) we get each other in some significant ways, 3) I can read him relatively well. But with time I have realised that our conversations have this strange dynamic, where it is either me asking him questions or me telling him things. He very rarely talks on his own, other than convey relevant information. I haven't noticed it before, because he does engage in conversations once I start them. But,
All conversations started to feel like I was doing all the work. and it started to bother me. And then he admitted, that if it were up to him, he just wouldn't talk at all.

We went to couples therapy, and it was decided there that it is probably best that he works through some things individually in therapy.

Since then... things have been mixed. We had a couple of deeper conversation, and went to do things together, so generally I think we are doing relatively well. We still love and like each other.

However, I have become increasingly more upset with how he is at meals. It turns out that he grew up in a culture where you weren't supposed to talk at meals. To me meals are times during the day, or evening to connect -be it over food or our days, or things that we have learned that day. I will invariably start attempt to have a conversation with him, and he will invariably withdraw into silently chomping his food.

He also has a habit of banging cutlery against his teeth all the time.
I keep pointing it out to him "oh you did that think with the fork and teeth again", which then makes him act "all careful" to avoid this happening again. He obviously tenses up. But banging a fork right into his front teeth over and over again is not good for his teeth. I care enough to not want it to happen. I wish he could just treat me saying this as a normal thing, and not something to be tense about? I am not criticising him, I am literally pointing it out, out of care.

Also.. he is not a great cook. Again, he has a very utilitarian approach to food.- I think he eats as fuel. Which I think many people have.

Most of the time he cooks something it is ok. But on occasion it is a bit unpleasant. I still eat it, but I will be a bit more fussy - eg taking parts of the food that I find hard to swallow to the side, etc.

Today it was mushrooms fried together with eggs in a scramble, with left- over veggie sausage from yesterday. I can usually eat the eggs with mushrooms when he normally makes them, that's why I said to make some for me, when he offered. They tend to be fine. But today they were really overdone and gray, and the added gray warm veggie sausage was just too much for me, I had too take it out. He did not say untying about the sausage at the start - if he did I would have told him to cook it separately.

Eggs are something that can be gross if not done well, and unfortunately I am one of these people who feel that way, despite being able to eat most things generally.

This, combined with my husband just slowly and carefully sitting there and tensely eating his food, just made me walk out. Not in anger... just out of finding it all so sad and unpleasant. Like, c'mon... insisting on silently eating a pile of gray food, whilst banging your teeth with a fork over and over again, is like something out of a Franzen novel.

When we aren't eating, we can just hangout in the same space and talk or not talk, and he acts normally and relaxed, but meals have become this tense minefield. I am so tired of sitting in silence, unless I carry the conversation.

I have decided that it is probably best that we just don't eat together.

I will still cook for us, just not eat at the same time, because I really can't stand these silent meals, where he isn't relaxed just kind of acting like a kid in school, eating in front of a teacher.

And.. he is putting me unwittingly in the role of a teacher, but that is probably something for him to unpack in therapy, rather than for me to push for normal meal experience with him.

Is this a bad way to approach it? Like.. am I going to make it worse?
He thinks it is ok that we don't eat together, but I am reluctant to fully follow through with it, because it feels like further drifting apart.
But then- we are fine when we don't eat together, but our mood sours as soon as we sit down and it becomes this semi-formal, quiet occasion.

Urgh. With pervious partners, we enjoyed the food. And we either talked, or watched a film or a series together, it was fun and simple and without this awkwardness.

Here, there seems to be no enjoyment, just this utilitarian chomping down. UGH.

But other than that - my husband is a great partner. I would not want to be with another person, don't get me wrong. He is also apologetic about the way he is.

What do you think? Is giving up on trying to make these occasions more pleasant, and basically withdrawing from these situations, the right way to approach it? It will probably also mean not going to restaurants together, because it is the same thing there as well & instead going for other dates, such as galleries, which are perfectly fine etc.

OP posts:
CoronaPeroni · 14/08/2021 12:37

Oh dear, he must be so tense about food! He puts up with your quirks about eggs but you don't seem to be able to do the same. Why should someone talk at meal times if you are going to spend the rest of the evening together? And surely scrambled eggs will be grey if cooked with mushrooms?

LadyCatStark · 14/08/2021 12:40

Surely there’s a compromise here? Why did it have to be your way of no way? Your constant criticism of his eating is going to make him feel tense and he’ll just shut down further. I can’t stand listening to DS eat but I can’t keep mentioning it as it’ll stress him out and it’s my problem not his. You said you enjoyed watching Tv or a film with previous partners, could you do this with him instead of expecting a conversation? Could you have the conversation at a different time? If someone cooks for you, you just have to make a good effort to eat it and thank them for it, or make your own.

YanTanTethera123 · 14/08/2021 12:40

Poor, poor guy.
He can’t do a thing right, can he? If I were him I would have eaten in a different room to you yonks ago.
Very sad.

Roonilwazlib1 · 14/08/2021 12:41

The hitting his teeth with his fork would wind me up as it really gets to me when people do that.

Other than that I have to say I think you're being too picky and a bit mean about all the expected chat at meal times? Can you eat while watching tv or listening to the radio or something if you need some noise?

The general communication problems and lack of change after therapy are a bit concerning but it sounds like you're a bit quick to criticise him tbh - what compromises have you made following therapy?

mynameisbrian · 14/08/2021 12:41

I feel sorry for your DH, you sit their getting frustrated that he wont talk when you eat, despite knowing when he grew up that was his norm. You then criticise him for hitting his teeth with a fork like your his mother. You have turned eating into a stressful situation for him. He is likely hitting his teeth more out of anxiety. I would suggest you leave him alone to eat and maybe reflect on what you could do to meet him in the middle rather than expect him to do all the changing.

Sparkletastic · 14/08/2021 12:42

I'd say you do the cooking and he then does an equal chore eg all the clearing up. Could you listen to an audiobook together at mealtimes? Loud enough to drown out the teeth clanging (wtf is that about btw? Has he got massive teeth??)

Bluntness100 · 14/08/2021 12:42

It feels like you can’t accept him for who he is, and want him to change to be someone different. He’s tense becayse you’re sitting judging him when he eats, even down to how he eats, how he uses his cutlery, it must be so hard for him.

He is who he is, it’s you who is unhappy with this person and want to change him that’s caused this issue.

SixesAndEights · 14/08/2021 12:53

Have you apologised for trying to turn mealtimes into a social event?

Why is he in the wrong for wanting to eat his food and not chatter?

I feel sorry for him. Just because he doesn't approach mealtimes the way you do, he must be the one in the wrong.

I like to eat quietly too. Mealtimes for me are a boring necessity. There are lots of more interesting things I want to be doing, so extending meals by talking just prolongs the agony.

Eating out with friends is different obviously! That's very much a social occasion with food included.

Krook · 14/08/2021 12:58

I think if you want to make it work you have to accept that for you, as a couple, mealtimes are not a social event. Where do you eat? Could you put a tv there so you could make it a time to watch an episode of a box-set while you eat, for example? Would break the silence and give you something to talk about.

Goodthings · 14/08/2021 13:10

I feel for him too.

Are you sure he’s absolutely wonderful apart from at mealtimes? It sounds awful and I can’t believe it’s just when you sit together to eat.

mrsm43s · 14/08/2021 13:12

Poor guy. Of course he is sitting there tense eating his dinner in silence. He's probably afraid to do anything because you're constantly criticising him.

Lorw · 14/08/2021 13:16

I like being quiet when I eat unless I am going out, me and DH just sit in front of the tv and eat together just tend to be in silence watching something then talk after we’ve eaten, watching or listening to something may ease his anxiety also, he probably had anxiety around meal times anyways and you’re making him worse, he isn’t wrong for not wanting to chatter so you shouldn’t make him feel like he is just because he’s not singing to your tune as it were.

Hopingforabagofbuttons · 14/08/2021 13:40

If someone kept criticising me and pushing around the food I had cooked I would be quiet too. Poor bugger sounds like he can’t do anything right. You sound very controlling

CordeliasPencil · 14/08/2021 13:44

To be honest I think you're the one who sounds hyper critical and unkind. I'd be miserable if I were your partner.

Onelifeonly · 14/08/2021 13:50

Sorry but I cannot reconcile you loving him but criticising and complaining about him in such minute detail over an everyday and essential activity. Do you really love him??

My DH and I can talk for England when together but we usually eat at home while watching tv, unless it's a special occasion. Constant 'conversation' can be hard work after a busy day at work. Maybe this would work better for you.

We take turns to cook but we know what each other likes so there's never a case of us giving each other something we don't want to eat. Can't you talk to him about your preferences?

DifferentHair · 14/08/2021 13:59

That sounds very bleak.

You're nitpicking him. I wouldn't want to eat a meal with someone who was constantly trying to 'fix' me.

You make him sound like he's a child you're raising, not an equal.

Even things like him bring less talkative than you- you recognise that he's introverted but you also seem to think he should change this to suit you, rather than consider whether you should adapt to him. If his culture and personality means he's more comfortable eating without a lot of chit chat, then why isn't that an option? You could play some music if you hate the silence. Or do this sometimes/ some meals and have more occasion- type meals at certain times. Like Wednesday and Sunday are 'family' dinner where you put your phones away and chat but other days are more quiet and relaxed.

Walking off from a meal he cooked because it's too 'sad' isn't kind.

I think you should go back to couples counseling and ask what you can do to make his life nicer rather than focusing solely on what you think he should do for you

ikeepseeingit · 14/08/2021 14:06

Can you both eat in front of the TV? That would mean you won’t hear him ‘chomping’ and he won’t feel a pressure to talk. If he doesn’t want to do that I would suggest you eat in front of the TV for some noise, and he can sit and eat his meal in silence somewhere else. Me and my partner often don’t talk much while eating (we’re busy!) but talking after we’ve finished at the table is very normal. Is that something that you do? Also are either of you out during the day so you have news to come home with. I find that on they days were both wfh there’s not much to talk about. Perhaps that is making it more of a struggle?

KingdomScrolls · 14/08/2021 14:08

One of the reasons I do most of the cooking is that DH is a good is fuel person, he can cook things that are edible but to me not very enjoyable, he does enjoy the food I cook, he has other household responsibilities to balance things. We do talk at dinner but both have very stressful jobs in the same field so talk can wander in that direction, we have the radio on R4 or a podcast sometimes especially in the mornings, it means no pressure to talk and if you want to sometimes conversation or questions arise from the topic being discussed on the radio. I feel for your husband, he was raised in a culture where you don't talk at meals, that's a big shift, you don't like the way he eats, you don't like the food he makes it feels very one sided. If you're happy to cook for both of you, do that and put something on the radio that interests you both you also might not hear the cutlery hitting his teeth as much either

updownroundandround · 14/08/2021 14:08

OP, you seem to be totally preoccupied with what you see as 'normal conversation' during mealtimes, and are totally ignoring what your H sees as 'normal' during mealtimes ? Hmm

Also, the bit about you 'pointing out' when he hits his teeth with his fork does not sound as though it's done for his benefit at all. It comes across as it annoys you, so you keep telling him, every, single, time...........you're infantilizing him ffs !

The part about you not being 'fussy' about your food, but then banging on and on about how you think eggs should be cooked ? You come across as a very fussy eater I'm afraid..........
And who says that how you like your eggs/meals cooked is the only way to enjoy that food anyway ? Confused

It really sounds as though you feel your H ''needs to change'' to fit in with what you like/think etc, because you've said bugger all about you needing to ''work on yourself'' through therapy.....Hmm

Perhaps you should book yourself some therapy to work on your 'need' for everything to be done ''your way'' and your lack of compromising or accepting that things can be done a different way ?

Meantime, I'd suggest you talk to your H, saying you recognize that mealtimes have become unpleasant for you both, and suggest that you both stop making them such an ordeal by watching TV while you eat for a couple of months, to give you both a break from the tension.

tiredmama2020 · 14/08/2021 14:13

@CloudyMoment I think you should really stop criticising the way he eats and what he cooks. There’s plenty of shitty men out there that wouldn’t try and make a meal at all.

I grew up in a house where mealtimes were horrifically uncomfortable. My dad would watch me eat my meal and huff/sigh and have a go at me for the the way I was cutting food or chewing, or using my cutlery, or if the fork accidentally touched the plate or my teeth.
It gave me quite a complex about eating around other people that took me quite a lot of effort as a young adult to try and break because I desperately wanted to be able to enjoy social meals with friends.

Don’t turn it into a bigger issue than it needs to be - eat separately if it makes your relationship better 🤷🏻‍♀️

pinkyredrose · 14/08/2021 14:14

He sounds awful. What are his good points?

BluebellsGreenbells · 14/08/2021 14:16

Underneath we are all like animals, we eat to survive and we like to feel free to eat.

Critiquing someone at the meal table is rude and prevents them enjoying their food, kids are bad eaters and get food everywhere, floor, table, hair up their noses! But you let them eat and deal with the aftermath.

He must dread every dinner time.

that said, you don’t sound particularly suited. I wonder how you interact with friendship groups and social occasions?

Maunderingdrunkenly · 14/08/2021 14:20

People are enjoying the chance to jump on the OP but surely the fundamental point is they are in incompatible, and should break up. This will only get worse surely?

OP you can have a husband that has similar opinions on food and mealtimes and enjoys them as a regular easy point of connection and conversation, as society has the world over for 100s of years. It’s not odd to want it. It just doesn’t have to be with this person.

Food/dinnertimes is a big deal for me as I firmly believe food is one of the great pleasures in life, and so easy to make and eat good food! I agree that this sounds horribly sad (to me) and you would do better finding someone else than forcing a round peg into a square hole.

MilduraS · 14/08/2021 14:25

I have to agree with @updownroundandround This all sounds like a You problem. If you hit your teeth with a fork you can feel it. If you're pointing it out it's not out of concern that he hasn't realised, it's to tell him how annoying you find it. It's all about how you like things and what you think is appropriate.

Personally I hate conversation at the dinner table and eating with people more generally. I like to enjoy my food. it's difficult to do that when I'm asked a question and have to quickly chew and swallow my mouthful of food while the other person watches waiting for an answer.

beigebrownblue · 14/08/2021 14:33

@IveGotASongThatllGetOnYNerves

I'd stop trying and just eat separately. It is only food. It isn't important. Why force conversation over a meal when you can eat comfortably and chat in the living room where you are both comfortable? A lot of people make such a huge deal out of meals and it is unnecessary.
Yes I would go with this. i've heard people insist on family meals together, around a table, but in actual fact it doesn't work for everyone and if it has been forced (as in my case when I was younger I'm not keen on it)

I live with teen DD and we never sit round table together unless away from home.

We both eat well though and meet up in the kitchen for a chat etc whilst cooking.

And when I really need that eating at a table thing i take myself out and enjoy it.