Dumped by 16 min rambling voice note

[StartingAgain33]

I'm so angry, mostly with myself, as a big part of me has felt this guy is full of red flags, even from the beginning, but I didn't listen to myself and instead got swayed by friends and even my therapist saying he sounded nice!! I have let this go on for NINE MONTHS. I was going to dump him tomorrow after a couple of weeks of terrible, one sided communication on his part but I wanted to do in person or on the phone so it could be friendly, dignified and equal. However he has got in early and, as ever, not given me a chance to have a voice. I'm not sure I have energy to reply, but I also feel like saying some really nasty things.

Reasons I should have ended this sooner:

• love bombed me at beginning, I felt pushed into being sexual too early and also his declarations were intense and way too soon
• he hadn't had a relationship in over 10 years and said his exes had done / said terrible things to him including insults that he was 'weird' and 'didn't listen to them
• he backtracked four months in and said we needed to put on the breaks as was moving too fast. When I pointed out it was HIM making these statements (he had suggested getting a flat together the previous week and I'd said no!) he gaslit me and said I had led the commitment conversations (I definitely had not, though I did let myself get swept away which I feel stupid about)
• he was generally emotionally unstable, swinging from one mood to the next, I want to be with you for the rest of my life one minute and then saying he's struggling with the idea of ever moving to my part of London the next (not that I'd asked him to!!). Also, the past few weeks he has gone from streams of angry texts about nothing to then voice notes where he acts like everything is normal and he would 'love to see me' that Saturday for his friends birthday?!
• he seemed obsessed with idea I was controlling him. If I had an emotion, and was upset, and explained it in an adult way, this was 'controlling' him and I was drawing him 'into my emotional playground'
• he was very insensitive and terrible at any kind of emotional validation. He was shit when my uncle died for instance, just changed the subject as made him feel unconfy
• apparently I am too emotional and he can't give me what I need, yet he stores up grievances, has big angry outbursts and can't resolve a disagreement without huge statements/ hours and hours of talking at me till I'm so exhausted I can't do anything but sit back and take it (this is unlike me, I'm usually good at being assertive)

Does he have bpd or something?

He made me feel insecure, like I was going mad with all the gaslighting and like I had done something really wrong for him to back off when he was keen on me at first. I know these are classic signs, so why did I stay? I even convinced myself he was autistic to make his behaviour ok (I do actually this he is). He didn't seem very narcissistic as he had poor self esteem. He reeled me in with his self pity and sob stories about his controlling mother and cruel exes (despite the fact he is Cambridge educated, earns £100k+ and is very good looking).

Now ex could probably tell I was going to end things in person today so got in first. The voice note was about how he just 'can't meet my needs' and 'no one he's ever been out with has had so many needs' for 'emotional validation'. It has made me feel like I am 'too much' and like shit, despite knowing he is a knob.

This is the latest in a string of knobs where I am ignoring gut instinct and trying to make things work. I find it hard to tell what is acceptable or not (although this guy massively takes the biscuit - none of my exes were like this and I have always had amicable respectful breakups).

I am starting to panic as I am almost 37 and want kids. So feel I should get back on dating scene, but just don't have the energy and I know I need to take some time out after this. I have frozen 28 eggs at 35 (apparently over 90% chance of a live birth with todays technology) so potentially have a backup plan.

Any advice, and also hand holding, welcome. Please not too much telling off. I am feeling like such an idiot as it is.

I have spent way too much time and energy trying to diagnose men I’ve had failed relationships with. I like a bit of logic in my life I suppose, I like to understand why - but it really is pointless.

The therapist doesn’t sound at all professional. He doesn’t need to be invested in your love life, he needs to be helping you unpick your thoughts and feelings without telling you he thinks you met a good guy. That’s not what he’s there for. You seem to rely to heavily on his approval and see him almost as a friend, he shouldn’t have allowed that to happen for a start.
Find a new therapist and block the ex. No point in not blocking him so that you can see if he sends any more messages that you can ignore. I think you are maybe hoping he will or you would have blocked him already. Just block now, permanently. He will likely be much more irked that you didn’t reply, since he is almost certainly waiting for you to do so.

@Zzzexhaustedzzz I agree, I like challenges and puzzles in life in general which suits me well in work but not relationships!

I'm definitely not getting excited at the idea of my therapist fancying me. I'm just curious as to why my description would imply that. If I felt he fancied me, I would be out of there pronto. The reason I've built trust with him is because I believe he has my best interest at heart, and blurring those boundaries even in his head would be very creepy.

I do agree though that maybe I need to not work with a family man. It's maybe too much when I'm in the situation I am in and a female might be better.

I have blocked ex btw. I genuinely don't want to ever hear his voice again or be subjected to one of his stupid texts. I was feeling physically sick yesterday at the thought of having to talk to him today but I was willing to so that things would end on a decent note. But he beat me to it which was kind of him!

Yeh, I think that'd be a good move.

It'd also be very good practice for you to take control of a relationship; this is a professional one, so it might be easier but it won't be ''easy'' to end it i bet. As mentioned above, anxiously attached people can find it difficult to end a relationship and to end the arrangement with their therapist.

In answer to your question, 'what in my description would imply he fancied me' you responded to ravenmum's post where she suggested that; you said that that was interesting. There had been a lot of posts but that comment was something that you responded to.

So the idea of the therapist fancying you (or not) or approving of you (or not) is taking up space in your head and it shouldn't be because that's getting in the way of what you can get out of therapy.

Good move blocking him!

sixteen minutes of drivel wasn't enough for him!?

@PearlNextDoor I agree I need to take control of this relationship. Weirdly I was planning on talking to him this week about the fact I haven't been finding our conversations useful for a little while. Do you think it's worth airing the thoughts and concerns I have around my perceptions of his subjectivity / feeling he is a bit too matey and has too many opinions? I feel just ending without discussing would be harder on me and would prefer it happened naturally, but maybe that's me being anxious and wanting to people please again

If my therapist actually fancied me it would be the nail in the coffin for trust in men for me. I think that's why it grabbed my attention about the other comments.

Omg this is making me so cross (about him) reading this because I had one that did exactly the same. Right down to the gaslighting when I said something he’d said or done had hurt me, he twisted it into “you’re calling me a terrible person and making me feel shit about myself”. I’m almost a year out of mine and I can see the guy for what he is - he hates himself, he’s ah abject failure at life and has a perpetual victim complex that nothing is his fault. He also had a horrible ex and nasty friends who deserted him (not quite the reality). He was a dead weight who brought everyone down, and I’m well rid - so are you. I totally relate to the feeling of wanting to have the upper hand but it really isn’t worth it. As hard as it is, you’ve got to block and move on - I didn’t, and did get sucked back into more bullshit before finally cutting things off and I regret not making the break earlier.

No! I think that's really great.

I think it's going to require some bravery to have the conversation so that's really good for you. I know my therapist is good for me but I'll still find it a difficult conversation when the time comes.

I think your focus should be on how it makes you feel throughout the whole process. Do I feel that this requires bravery. Am I feeling awkward. Am I too attuned to the therapist's response here. Was I able to sit with the discomfort of this difficult conversation??

If he is anything other than supportive to your decision to find a new therapist right now, I would question his professionalism.

Also, you said upthread that you were already questioning whether you really do need to have children to be happy.

Maybe it will all still work out in a conventional last minute baby kind of way, but I think it'd be really good for your sense of yourself right now to buttress up those fledgling ideas about how rewarding life can still be without children.

Vulnerable narcissist, google it and see if you think it fits.

For goodness sake, block him because he will be back for sure. If you want kids, could you consider doing IVF by yourself? Would be a lot less painful than breeding with this monstrosity of a person, that's for sure.

And your therapist sounds like a waste of oxygen, to be honest - you're paying money for that crap, FGS ditch that nonsense!

@PearlNextDoor yes definitely. I liked someone's suggestion of reading Elizabeth Gilbert's Big Magic. In the mad flurry of meeting unsuitable men and also having my energy drained by situations that need 'fixing' (at work, in relationships etc), I feel like I've basically lost myself in my 30s and forgotten the things that make me me. Which ironically is making it hard to make good choices with men as I'm using them to fill a void. Interestingly I never imagined my boyfriend on the scene when it came to living in this house - sounds cheesy but I felt ready to 'blossom' and find my own little community for the first time locally as I now own somewhere and can invest

@tedmullins dead weight is the right word. I dont think I ever would have stayed so long were it not for the fact in the pandemic I was limited to only seeing one person and I am not close to family, other friends wirh bubbled with partners etc. I'm not ashamed to say that it was nicer for the most part to have his company- he wasn't all bad at all and there was a sense of comfort there most of the time - but these flashes of weirdness would not have been so well tolerated were I able to, you know, see any other humans at all! Then by the time lockdown lifted I was so invested I felt I needed to give it a go in 'real life' where we could have dates etc in case my boredom was just boredom with life (again therapist suggested this!!)

Oh it's so important to fall back in love with yourself. You're absolutely on the right track with this realisation.

I know that feeling of time running out, it makes you press pause on everything else and prioritise potential in some randomer, but you have to prioritise you, your time, your spark, your flow, whatever it's called, until something comes along and makes you think, ok, maybe i could spend a little less time ............ rollerskating backwards figures of eight and making figures out of plasticine :-p

I recommended that book because i had always thought I can't really set aside time for creative or artisitic pursuits because i'm not excellent at art. But nobody ever thinks, well, I'm not excellent at office administration so I will down tools and resign.

That scarcity mindset is a bugger.

I'm still trying to find a tribe and I think I will. It's hard right now but I believe I will.

Yes the lockdown has made everything harder.

[quote StartingAgain33]@nonmaquilee yes he always did this! I was excited as I got a position as a trustee for a charity and he completely ignored this and said 'I need to be getting a trustee position'

And I couldn't share anything stressful without him taking over. Zero ability to listen.[/quote]
God, he sounds so scarily similar 😬😬 initial not R???

Wow, I was totally with you until you said 'does he have bpd or something?' Maybe don't project a serious mental illness onto him - people with bpd suffer far more than people around them - maybe he's just a dick? Now you also sound like a dick. There's enough stigma without people like you saying shit like that.

Yes, you were a bit of an idiot not to leave when you noticed all the red flags at the beginning, but it's done now. Ignore, block, move on. Get a new therapist.

@pearlnextdoor I'm sure you will. I feel like we find and lose tribes throughout life now as we all go through different stages etc, I hope your next one comes along soon!
@Gooseberrypies apologies, I realise that came across badly. I had googled things he did to me and bpd came up, and it was comforting to know there might be a reasonable explanation beyond him being a dick if that makes sense. I know I'm slagging him off here but I also do feel quite concerned for him as a person and like I dont want to demonise him in my head as he wasn't all bad. But I shouldn't have done an armchair diagnosis, or asked the question at least - its not like anyone would be able to know

Hi Op,

I'm sorry you're going through another heartbreak. I remember dating after my divorce aged 36 (and have written on many threads here about this), it was utterly soul destroying and the panic, anxiety and stress (mainly over missing out on motherhood) was paralysing; in hindsight I never should have been dating in that state, but the hope kept me hanging in there (and the life script that I have absorbed from growing up and those around me).

Well done on getting your eggs frozen! That was a very sensible thing to have done!! I know that probably at the time you thought of it as a last resort, but do you feel you're getting to a stage where maybe solo parenting is a real possibility?

I'm currently pregnant (16 weeks) via IVF and sperm donor aged 39 (also have some insurance embryos in the freezer) and feel so fortunate. I'd had a two year relationship fail aged 38. I couldn't take anymore dating and looking for a partner under that level of stress. I now feel that once I settle in to motherhood and find my feet, I'd like to try dating again but without the pressure of starting a family! It wasn't my original 'life script', but I wasn't prepared to waste any more of my time and possibly lose out completely on motherhood, or choose an unsuitable partner.

Good luck with your decision.

[quote StartingAgain33]@pearlnextdoor I'm sure you will. I feel like we find and lose tribes throughout life now as we all go through different stages etc, I hope your next one comes along soon!
@Gooseberrypies apologies, I realise that came across badly. I had googled things he did to me and bpd came up, and it was comforting to know there might be a reasonable explanation beyond him being a dick if that makes sense. I know I'm slagging him off here but I also do feel quite concerned for him as a person and like I dont want to demonise him in my head as he wasn't all bad. But I shouldn't have done an armchair diagnosis, or asked the question at least - its not like anyone would be able to know[/quote]
I have something very similar to BPD but as I said above, I still suffered in a relationship with a numpty like this. I don’t think he had a personality disorder - just self hatred and a victim complex.

On a wider point though, I have behaved like a dick in other relationships before and while my BPD might be the reason it isn’t an excuse! I was still a dick. Having a MH issue doesn’t mean you stop knowing right from wrong (unless perhaps you’re in a psychotic delusional episode). So whether he has a personality disorder or not is neither here nor there, even if he did it wouldn’t excuse his behaviour it would just mean he wasn’t managing his condition and was therefore treating you badly.

If your therapist suggested that this was a good relationship then I would suspect either he was a fucking idiot or he was a narcissist too. Narcissists in general often encourage you to keep shitty people who belittle you and bring you down in your life. And take their side when they do something to hurt you. It furthers their plan to make you out to be mental/the bad guy. Ditch the therapist.

Congrats on being free of the asshole!
But definately take me-time before dating again. You can see yourself how much shit you tolerated from this guy. You need to be sure you can spot his kind again and leave asap if another one comes along. So until you've done a shit load of reading and worked on your self appreciation, you should avoid dating.

You also should probably take kids out of the equation as it makes you vulnerable to putting up with too much shit. If you want kids then maybe go it alone with a doner. If you only want to do it with a partner then it has to be completely irrelevant for at least...18months after meeting someone. To give you time to know they arent totally flipping mental and are father material. And yes, that reduces the time you have but that's just tough,because you have to choose your own self respect and love yourself first over the idea of kids. Arguably, so that they get a good mother who can teach them how to love themselves too.

@StartingAgain33 I am sorry you have had to endure such a idiot, please don't reply. I am guessing this is what he wants and you don't need to listen to him droning on

@StartingAgain33. I think you have time, given that you have taken the very sensible action of having some eggs frozen. I had DD at that age, but at that point having eggs frozen was something I hadn't thought about, and it was a long time ago, so... I think I'm saying don't do what I did and rush into having a child with an unsuitable father. You don't need to.
As a trained counsellor, I am a little concerned that your therapist is suggesting that your attachment style is the 'issue' rather than the very odd push you/pull me style of your ex. I think often with women, the default option is to 'blame' the woman, instead of the wanky man who is the problem...
Keep him blocked OP. You will have taken the power back, and not have more hassle than you need.

Can I suggest that maybe you have a look at Shark Theory, if you are not familiar with it? I read it online, in about 5 mins, and it made a lot of sense about why I had so many loser/unsuitable men in my past. Good luck