At what point does ‘mindfulness’ become ‘selfishness’?

[AttaGirrrrl]

I’ve been seeing someone for about four months. He’s lovely. We get on brilliantly when we’re together. Sex is great. We have lots of shared interests and have a lot of fun together. We’ve met some of each other’s friends and family (but not many because of covid) and got on well.

We’re both late thirties. I’ve been married before and have 2DC. He’s had a few 1-2 year relationships, but mostly been single. This is where I think the problems stem from. I am constantly busy, always trying to juggle 12 things at once, usually flying by the seat of my pants in terms of childcare/work/logistics. He works (hard) 9-5 and then has no other commitments. He’s much more ‘mindful’ than me. If he sits down to watch a film, he concentrates on the film, whereas if I’m watching tv alone, I might also be texting friends/ironing/catching up on admin. To be clear, if I’m with him, I concentrate on what we’re doing.

Because of childcare arrangements with exDH, I tend to see OH 2-3 consecutive nights a week, but not in between. We share texts during the week, but if I suggest talking in the evening he is ‘watching a film’ or ‘listening to an audiobook’ or ‘having an early night’, etc. Part of me admires his ability to focus on one thing at a time, but part of me feels quite rejected. ExDH cheated constantly and, while I don’t think OH is lying about what he’s doing, it just feels ‘off’ somehow. Like his priorities are out? Or is it me? Am I being needy?

I’m finding it hard to process what is bothering me, but it definitely is (bothering me) so I’d appreciate any thoughts /experiences.

Thank you!

I think the issue is that he'd rather listen to an audio book than talk to you! Honestly, it doesn't sound like he's that keen really.

Honestly I think you’re being needy. If I saw you three times a week, I wouldn’t want to speak to you on the phone the other days unless there was a particular reason. I’m quite happy to text through a film or podcast (or whatever) but I would value my alone time and not want to have an actual conversation. I had a long distance relationship and we never spoke on the phone, we texted a lot though. Perhaps your trust issues from your ex are niggling and your reading too much into his not wanting to speak to you?

Mindfulness becomes selfishness at no point.

I dont think your problem has anything to do with mindfulness or even selfishness.
I find people looking at their phone during films etc irritating but i would never comment on it because people just do things differently. You're making his desire to focus on an activity sound weird or negative when it isnt at all but its also nothing to do really with whats bothering you.

I hope you sort it out

you feel uncomfortable that he doesnt need to contact you between visits. Thats a perfectly valid thing to worry about so you need to talk to him about it or make peace with it.

if you do talk to him it will probably help both of you more if your are honest about that though rather than dragging in crticisms of how he spends his evenings or his self sufficiency.

That's not mindfulness.

If he's present in the moment while watching a film, why can't he speak to you on the phone before or after? Indeed pressing pause to focus on a 10-15 minute phone call wouldn't contradict mindfulness and being present in the moment.

He's either using it as an excuse or doing something else...

You're not suited

I think you have different thresholds or ideas of time you want to spend actively together.

Neither of you is necessarily wrong but it might just mean you're not very compatible.

I would not want to spend every single evening doing something with DH - it would be too much. I like to have some evenings to do my own thing.

@Nowisthemonthofmaying what a load of garbage. I enjoy reading books should I just drop everything at the drop of a hat to speak to my SO? No. That’s my ‘me’ time.

OP, seeing someone 3 nights a week when you have kids is plenty. Not everyone wants a faced paced life , if he wants his evenings to himself to recharge, that’s his right.

The elephant in the room is his lack of past relationships.

I do not think you are needy. I think you need to be realistic in your expectations.

30 plus years of being yourselves cannot translate into a relationship of perfect harmonious information and knowing where you are within 4 months. Partnerships take a longer investment than that. Don't push things or force things. You could learn a lot from each other. He could slow you down and you could fire him up. Easier I think if he had some rough and tumble, some feathers ruffled, kids, sick and sleepless nights.

But not having held a relationship suggests he might be a FWB asset for you, and a short term one at that.

I agree, I don’t think “mindfulness” is the real issue. He’s choosing not to prioritise speaking to you in the days you’re not spending together. I think you need to have an honest conversation about how that makes you feel - he may not have realised it’s an issue.

That’s not mindfulness, that’s him liking his own company four nights a week which i don’t think is a bad thing. I can easily really like someone but still prefer to listen to an audiobook by myself rather than chatter to them on the phone some nights.

But that's exactly what you need. Someone who isn't needy and happy to fit around your commitments.

I think it comes across that you are annoyed that he has other interests and things he wants to do outside of his relationship with you. You say in your post he has no other commitments outside of working 9-5. But he might have another things he may well want to do with his time. I'm assuming he has family members and friends he might also want to spend time with etc?

Do you have any contact on the days you don’t see him, does he just not want to chat on the phone?

I agree this is nothing to do with mindfulness, I’m not sure why you’re framing it like this. And I don’t think he’s selfish. You just want different things.

And there’s no evidence at all his other relationships didn’t last longer because he was selfish.

He needs his own space and values this. He has had a different life and different experiences to you. His different priorities don't mean he is selfish, and if you feel this way, maybe you are not suited. IMO not feeling like speaking to someone because you are doing something else is not ever selfish, unless that person is their child who wants something like food or attention!

You're a phone addict. He isn't.

This is what relationships were like before messaging. You didn't go pestering the person on the days you weren't meeting. You both got in with your lives, with maybe the occasional phone call which you wouldn't make while you were watching a film.

Thank you all. Your very mixed responses highlight what I’m so confused about!

Is he just not that into me? (Yet he talks all the time about our future, sends me links on rightmove to houses he’s considering, has introduced me to his mum, etc) Or is it my trust issues? Is it that he is ‘present’ (much better word than my ‘mindfulness’ attempt, thanks) and I’m jealous that he’s able to do that? Is it because we’re just not compatible? (Not asking for answers to all this btw! Just my thought processes)

I’m pretty relieved that there hasn’t just been a massive ‘he’s cheating’ pile on, so the fact that I partly expected that might also reflect ‘trust issues’ on my part.

You’re all absolutely right that I need to talk to him about it. He’d definitely listen and be respectful if I did that, but how do I word it without sounding needy? (I really don’t think I am btw. I’m also comfortable in my own space and appreciate time to myself. I don’t resent him spending time with other people or without me; it’s just this weird niggle about priorities or compatibility)

@premium77 but she didn't say 'at the drop of a hat' she said she just suggested speaking in the evening? No reason they couldn't arrange to have a chat after he'd finished watching the film or whatever he was doing, but he obviously doesn't want to.

OP you may just be a bit mismatched but at 4 months I don't think wanting to have a phone call sometimes on a day you're not seeing him is an unrealistic expectation. Maybe you should just talk to him about it and tell him how it makes you feel?

^ just reread that and realised how very needy I sound

You're a phone addict. He isn't

This might be we’ll be true

Hmm, being honest I just hate phone calls. Love having company in input flesh but feel I run out of things to say on the phone and just want to get on with something. I'm always in the middle of something, like watching a film, so the phonecall is cutting into it and I privately just want to get off the phone so I can carry on with it. I'm like this with my DP who I love with all my heart, so I don't see any malice in what your DP is like.

This is not mindfulness, and you sound really needy and demanding.

He doesn’t have kids so is used to spending time outside work reading etc. You have kids so are always “on the go”, even outside work. Give the guy a break and respect his need for downtime.

Is he already watching/doing something when you suggest it or do you suggest speaking tomorrow or something?

Have you asked him or has he said whether he likes chatting on the phone? Does he groan about having to phone his mum, or do it quite happily? He might just not really be into phone chats.

I think if he shoots you down every time you suggest talking in the evening then that is a problem - because it should be obvious to him (by your repeated suggesting) that you would like that, and for some reason he is not willing to do it. Even if he is someone who doesn't particularly need/want to speak in between the times you see each other he ought to be happy to speak, say, once just because YOU would like it. This is just a very simple example of the many (small, not serious) compromises that need to be made on both sides for a relationship to be happy and successful.

How far in advance are you suggesting chatting? If you're doing it in the afternoons/earlier in the evening then it might be more understandable that he doesn't want to change his plans/what he's doing at that moment (although it doesn't bode particularly well for his hypothetical involvement in family life, if that's the eventual plan). If he's leaving your house on a Sunday evening and you're suggesting a chat any time before he comes back again on Friday and he can't find it in himself to squeeze you in at all then that's more problematic.

Either way I would just open up a conversation about it, say that you would really like to have a chat with him once in between his visits and how would he feel about that? If he can't give you twenty minutes of his time I'd be concerned he may not be willing to work with you on other issues that you will inevitably encounter should your relationship progress (and I don't mean "bad" issues, just the regular complications/clashes/disagreements that will inevitably arise in a relationship of any considerable length).

I would also consider carefully his expectations of your relationship going forwards. If you move in together it is not going to be realistic for him to expect "alone time" that often/much.