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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

I know it's late but please help if you can

107 replies

LucyCielo · 18/11/2007 00:34

Tonight went out with df (getting married next month). I mentioned something that he thought was a dig at his family and he then pushed me off my chair in the middle of quite a posh bar. Everyone seen this and some kind random man had to help me up. He has since apologised but I am still not sure whether this is something I should put up with. Any advice?

OP posts:
MALO · 18/11/2007 10:43

It is not your fault. Remember that.

He hit YOU - by staying with him you ACCEPT this violence.

QuintessentialShadow · 18/11/2007 11:21

Lucy, please re-read what Lewisfan said.

Also, tell your folks.

My mum had to fly out and actually get my sister and her dd, my sis was not strong enough to do it on her own. My mum was there to oversea her packing, and getting to the airport and on the plane with her safely.

Dont be scared to tell your family, do not be ashamed, it is not your fault. MOBILIZE friends and family and get help and support!

Unfitmother · 18/11/2007 11:25

Whilst I sympathise entirely, an unprovoked attack in public is very worrying.

Pages · 18/11/2007 11:46

How were your comments provoking him? If he gets upset about innocent comments like this (you were just trying to explain why it was sensible to put money aside now, and saying your family obv thought so too), what's he going to be like when you disagree with him about important things like child-rearing methods, etc? He sounds very insecure and I can sympathise because my DH used to be a lot like this at one time before we got married, but with him he would just get silent and stroppy. If he ever pushed me off a chair or hit me across the head I would not have married him, that's for certain.

You have a duty not just to yourself but to your DD to protect her from violence. I would insist he gets counselling and seriously address this issue or walk. If he has done it twice it will happen again, and no doubt escalate.

Pages · 18/11/2007 11:48

Not sure why people think it is worse because it is in public rather than in private... it is completely unacceptable behaviour wherever it occurs.

MALO · 18/11/2007 11:48

Look at it this way....

If someone you didn't know deliberately hit you - what would you do? Ignore it or report it?

Most people would report that person to the Police etc.

Just because he is your future husband doesn't mean he should be excused.

MALO · 18/11/2007 11:49

pages - I was about to add that - whether public or private - unacceptable in both scenarios but I think what people are saying is if he thinks he can get away with hurting someone in public whatever does he think he can get away with in private?

Pages · 18/11/2007 12:01

Take your point, MALO.

Lucy, I think it is easy (and maybe easier for you) to imagine him as a good man with just "one failing" but are you prepared to risk your own happiness and that of your DD to find out if it is just a "flash in the pan". This sort of behaviour almost always escalates, it is unlikely to just "go away". Imagine that the worst happens and a year down the line that one little failing has escalated to become a very big failing, to the point where you are miserable, have no self-esteem left and both you and your DD are cowering and walking on eggshells around him. Or worse, the kind of situation that Lewisfan describes.

You need to take action now, as Attila says, while you still have some self-esteem left. You are NOT a pain, HE is behaving very badly. You do not deserve this treatment - no-one does. You deserve to be treated with love and consideration. You deserve happiness.

Notquitegrownup · 18/11/2007 12:04

Hey Lucy are you still there, Hon? There have been a lot of posts here and a lot of important advice, but it's a lot to take in in one go.

Let us know how you are, and don't feel judged by these posts, Sweetheart. We are concerned about you and your little girl.

Unfitmother · 18/11/2007 13:31

That's what I meant MALO.

NKF · 18/11/2007 13:32

Weird reaction from him. If he didn't like what you were saying, why couldn't he say so?

MALO · 18/11/2007 13:33

yep - and that's how I read it!

madamez · 18/11/2007 14:21

Indeed. ANother way of looking at it, Lucy, is that many men would listen to their wives, girlfriends, fiancees, confessing to having had sex with their best friend or stolen their grandmother's pension and STILL NOT HIT THEM. If this fuckwit is beating you for a mild remark he misunderstood, what will he do if you speak to another man when he's told you not to?

NKF · 18/11/2007 14:28

You should, of course, leave him. That's a given. But then I expect you know that already don't you? You just don't want to believe it right now. Good luck.

QuintessentialShadow · 18/11/2007 17:43

Lucy, how are you doing?

My son is in year 1, there is a little boy in his class. The boys mother is of the abusive type, she will push him, call him a stupid boy, hit him across the head. Then she says "Look what you made me do". She is putting all the responsibility of her actions on him, and in this way take no responsibility for her actions. He makes her do it. That is her excuse. A few weeks ago she rang me and asked me to stop my son from playing with her son, becase my son made her son hit him, and she did not want her son to have a bad record in school. The problem, in her eyes, was not that her son hits mine, but that my son make her boy hit. You cant make somebody hit. The person who hits is responsible for his own actions. Even more so with grown ups.

If you read this story and think it is wrong, then look at how it translates to your relationships. And think about how it can affect your child.

A person who delegates responsibility for own actions to somebody else will never be in the wrong, in his/her own opinion. His actions will always be somebody elses.

Your daugther is only young. But imagine when she is older, going through the terrible twos, throws her plate on the floor.

How do you think your fiancee will react to that? Will the little girl make him hit her with her behaviour?

He abuses you in public, he says it is not his fault, but yours. He does not see anything wrong, as if he did, he would restrain himself when others were watching. This man does not have his limits in place.

You say he has been married before. Do you know his exwife? Was he abusing her too? I bet he was....

I really hope you manage to get help. Good Luck.

LucyCielo · 18/11/2007 18:17

Thanks everyone for your messages. I have not had a chance to come back on here today as have been trying to think things through with a clear head. I will have a proper read through the comments tomorrow when I have time to myself. He has apologised again today and offered to attend counselling if I want him to. However he has also reiterated that I provoke him as am always slagging off his family (which I don't believe I do) and that I have in the past hit and scratched him during arguments. This is true and as I mentioned earlier it is not something I am proud of. However, if I had pushed him to the ground in the middle of a busy bar I don't think he would have reacted as calmly as I have. Sorry to ramble.

OP posts:
Hekete · 18/11/2007 20:09

"I am sorry but you made me do it, you know."
Is not an apology.

I hope that you do read everyone's comments and think carefully.

We are trying to save you.

hickorydickory · 18/11/2007 21:00

he hit you, no matter how he dresses it up. If you don't value yourself enough to leave, I hope you value your dd enough. You owe it to her. He'll go to counselling if you want! He is laughing at you, he knows you'll back down as you have before. Let's face it he got away with abusing you in public. This is not the behaviour of a man who loves you, and a month before your big day.
There's no debate about it. You have to do the right thing and leave - it'l be easier to get out now than another 10 years down the line and your self worth's really in the gutter. Come on girl, tell someone what's happening and let then help you get out of there.

MALO · 18/11/2007 21:32

hickory - brilliant and to the point.

Columbia · 19/11/2007 05:09

Lucy I'm glad you came back. His behaviour is not acceptable, counselling will not do anything, therapy and long term at that would perhaps have an effect but do you really want to be lumbered with a man working through his problems and distinctly unready for a grown up relationship? I think you realise that his qualified 'apology' means zilch. You are not proud of your self-defensive actions but he seems fairly accepting of his own appalling behaviour. See the difference?

You are going to feel lost for a while if you leave a relationship, but throwing good money after bad is a big, big mistake. You will sooner or later feel very stupid if you marry such an idiot.

Sory again for sounding harsh. We really are as Hekate says, trying to save you.

seriously.

Columbia · 19/11/2007 05:14

And yes by what he said he is laughing at you.

Would you hit him in that way? In public? Causing humiliation as well as injury?

I don't think so. So why is it Ok for him to do it to you?

He's pretending to be sorry because he sniffs a hint of your starting to see it is shit behaviour. He needs someone he can control. My ex was the same. as soon as I stood up to him and left, he wandered off, he wasn't keen any more, I wasn't being the victim he needed. This man thinks he can push you back into that role. Let him know he can't and you'll see how fast he loses interest. He'll blame you, of course, you need to believe it isn't true, because he will say anything to get you back into prime victim position.
see, he does think you're stupid.

sorry no caps, baby on lap!

Notquitegrownup · 19/11/2007 10:41

I'm glad that you came back too Lucy, and that you are going to take time to read these messages and the important points that they raise.

This has been a real wake up call for you and could be the most important turning point for you in your life and in your daughter's life too. You can look back on posting this message in ten years time and see how it has changed your life completely.

As you are considering these changes I would urge you to get some help for yourself too. You may need some help with anger management, if you have been used to fighting during arguments, and you will certainly need some help with building your self esteem, so that you never fall back into the position of believing that someone has the right to hit or push you because of what you have said or done. Do find a local support group for yourself. Do it for you and for your daughter, so that you make sure that you are happier with yourself, and anyone you let into your life will respect you and love you for who you are, and will respect boundaries that we all have a right to expect from a partner.

Best of luck to you, Hon.

inv1sible · 19/11/2007 10:56

Haven't read all of the threads but when I was younger a bf used to do this. If I said something he didn't like he'd push me (was much bigger and stronger than me) and I'd end up on the floor. He also humiliated me in a pub because I wanted a coke NOT an alcoholic drink! (said I was boring) so he threw a full pint over me.
Things escalated and he wore down my confidence and it went from pushes to little slaps to punches and then to kicking my head in basically. I got out after 10 months of shite!! have found out since a gf of his ended up in hospital
I am not saying this will happen to you and you have been together for a long time, but the signs are there.

AttilaTheMeerkat · 19/11/2007 12:28

"He has apologised again today and offered to attend counselling if I want him to. However he has also reiterated that I provoke him as am always slagging off his family (which I don't believe I do) and that I have in the past hit and scratched him during arguments. This is true and as I mentioned earlier it is not something I am proud of. However, if I had pushed him to the ground in the middle of a busy bar I don't think he would have reacted as calmly as I have. Sorry to ramble".

Lucy

Re your above comment:-

He has really offered you no apology at all as there are conditions attached to it. He should also want to go to counselling for his own self, not because you want him to. He's basically saying to you that he does not think he has a problem (you provoke him being his so called justification). There is NEVER any justification whatsoever for violence and what he has done to you.

I would also fully agree with notquitegrownup's third paragraph.

Please take heed of what other posters as well as myself have said; you are at a crossroads here.

Boredatwork · 19/11/2007 13:50

Lucy,
I am ashamed to say I have hit my dh in the past, and thrown a bottle at him.
He never once in any way threatened me or retaliated.
I just want to reinforce what others have said - in that whatever you may say to him, it is his responsibity to control his own actions. You can not make him do anything. He does it himself.
It is always easy for other people to tell you to leave him, but I think you only need to look at some of the experiences people have had on here to realise that this is not a good place to start a marriage.