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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Have I ruined things for our son?

118 replies

BrokenArrows · 17/05/2021 14:52

Apologies in advance as this is rather long and not sure if it belongs in Relationships (because my husband is furious with me) Mental Health or Child Mental Health 🥴

Bit of a long story, but I have suffered with my mental health off and on for years. During the first lockdown I came across some information online which made me realise I almost certainly have ADHD. All the struggles I’ve had in my day to day life, the depression, the anxiety, the self doubt and the lack of concentration all finally made sense.

Also during lockdown I was obviously spending much more time with my 9yr son that I normally did when he was at school and I was working FT. There have always been things that concerned me and worried me about my sons behaviour. He enjoys school and learning, but also gets very down on himself saying he’s stupid and he hates himself, and how everyone hates him (he has lots of friends). We went through a period where he would always talk about dying and how our lives would be better if he wasn’t around. He’d get upset with himself about one thing or another and then just say “I’m going to kill myself” This really upset me. I know for certain he had no intention of actually causing any harm to himself because he is also petrified of dying or anything to do with death and gets very anxious when anyone in the house has so much as a sniffle and gets worried they’re going to die. But I hated seeing him say those things. He has moments where he struggles with school work and throws his hands up in the air and wants to quit (I’m sure all kids do this), husband would get angry with him and they’d work on the homework together. Early on in school (years 1-3) the teachers would say he Interrupts the class And he couldn’t sit still. They would really work with him to find ways to learn and cope. We had an educational psychologist come and assess him in year 2 and he said my son was likely just still quite immature (he’s the youngest in the class) and that he was a very smart boy. Fine. Husband was completely relieved and says that those years were the hardest ever for him mentally and says how much stress that all caused him.

There are still things about my sons behaviour that concern me. At Nearly 10 he cannot sit still during a film. He is always getting up for snacks, the toilet, or to fiddle with the remote to see how much time is left. He cannot sit still at the dinner table. He’s constantly getting out and jumping on the sofa or flopping on the floor, jumping up on the counters, rocking on his chair, no matter how much I beg and plead, and eventually yell for him to just sit down. He is constantly making noises. Sometimes he will just all of a sudden make loud siren sounds, sometimes he’ll humm an annoying cartoon theme song, etc. It happens all the damn time. And it gets to the point where my sensors get overloaded and I lose my shit.

Going back to me, I got myself into such a bad state with my mental health a few months ago the prescribed me with antidepressants and therapy. Husband was not on board with the antidepressants and was furious when he found out I started taking them so I stopped. I had an initial call with the talking therapies person and I mentioned the fact I was anxious for my son and recapped the things I said above. They got very concerned about my son saying he wanted to kill himself even though I reassured him he would never do that. They told me that they would need me to call his Dr and explain and seek help for him or they would. This freaked me out so I called the Dr and told them why I was concerned. They referred him to be assessed for ADHD and recommended a few councillors for him to speak to that deal with childhood anxiety. I did not tell my husband any of this because I knew he would flip out at me. I was panicking at the fact that I was told I needed to contact the Dr about him and regretted immediately even mentioning it.

When the form came for me to fill out my husband intercepted it first and got so angry with me saying there’s nothing wrong with our son and that I’m causing life long issues for him now. Long story short I didn’t fill it out because it said if they didn’t hear back they would close his case, and that’s the result my husband wanted.

Well this morning the Dr calls my husband saying they never got the completed form back, and he’s confirmed with them he wants the case closed. But they’ve said they’re going to follow up with his school (private). We have spent the past few weeks looking at private secondary schools for my son and now my husband is livid with me for stirring this up and says I have compromised the chances for my son to be accepted into ons of the private secondary schools we’ve been looking at him getting into. Husband is furious with me.

So my question is kind of two parts: Have I ruined my son’s chances to get into his chosen private secondary school? He had no formal adhd / learning disability diagnosis on his records. He is also very smart and at or near the top of his class for most subjects. (But just because someone has ADHD doesn’t mean they’re stupid. We just process information differently).

And secondly, does my child’s behaviour (the running, jumping, the constant noises, and anxiety and self doubt), sound like that of a normal 9/10yr old? Am I worrying about nothing? I have no idea anymore. My husband is constantly telling me how I’m making issues out of nothing. He doesn’t believe in ADHD either and thinks my own self diagnosis is all in my head and that I’m looking for excuses. I am on the waitlist for a diagnosis. I’m so torn now and I just know I’m going to be made the bad person and be the brut of arguments with my husband because of all of this.

OP posts:
LIZS · 18/05/2021 17:51

@category12

You can't "prove" anything to a man like this. If you get a diagnosis, he will still poo-poo it.

Your problem is living with an abusive man. You would be able to function better without him bullying you, putting you down, yelling at you and making you feel incompetent.

Completely agree.
category12 · 18/05/2021 18:06

Nothing really came out of it other than her agreeing he was kind of controlling. Not really sure what the point of it was, or how they can help me other than to listen I guess

Well, that's a bit of external validation that it's not you? As well as from us lot here?

You could speak to Women's Aid/local domestic abuse services and get some support. They won't try to make you do anything you're not ready to do.

You could also try the Freedom Programme. There's an online one.

Hen2018 · 18/05/2021 18:09

A counsellor can’t help you, as such. I’d try Women’s Aid (as well). You can email if that is easier.

Good luck, OP.

youvegottenminuteslynn · 18/05/2021 18:23

He's bullying you and your child.

You have a choice but they don't.

Every single day spent with a parent bullying you crushes your self esteem a little bit more.

Your plan needs to be how to get independent and get out, not how to prove him wrong. He'll never be wrong in his eyes even if you spent the next 50 years consistently being right.

Don't make your children live with a bully for one minute longer than you have to.

You're married and will get some support for the kids if you divorce as well as help from the system should you need it while you get back on your feet and independent.

Having less money and more self esteem is better for kids than having 'stuff' and being shouted at, ironically for having low self esteem.

He's very afraid of actually dying. He often gets very down on himself saying 'he sucks' and 'he's no good at things'. Husband then yells at him and gets angry because he's always saying negative things about himself.

I couldn't bear to even look at a man who yelled at any child this way, let alone my child. You need to find your anger and let it power you to get your plan together behind the scenes.

He is not a good dad. Can you see that now?

GroggyLegs · 18/05/2021 18:43

I'm sorry you're having what sounds like an awful evening.

It sounds very overwhelming. Noise, crying, breaking points...

Life doesn't have to be this way.
I know the talking today was hard, but please try again.

BrokenArrows · 18/05/2021 21:52

Thank you all for your advice. I feel like a total weak failure. All you women are so strong to just be able to get up and leave from a situation like this. I just cannot do it. I have been with him for 25 years. He's all I know, and he wasn't always like this. I just feel like if I could get help and make things easier for him by actually being able to function he'd be better. I know that's probably wishful thinking, but I feel like it's worth a shot?

I don't know if there's a way to make him realise his behavior has gotten out of hand and that he causes me so much stress and anxiety, because in his eyes it's me doing all of that to him. I have tried to mention to him that he is being unreasonable and mean, and that he shouldn't be yelling at the kids, but again it all gets thrown back in my face. He genuinely wants to be the best dad and feels that he is the best dad, so if I even suggest that perhaps he should change his ways, or even things like the ADHD with our son he takes huge offense to that and I think takes it very personally like he's a failure at parenting because he puts so much effort into our son. It would also be so so hard for my son especially if my husband and I separated. I know that my husband would fight for full custody of the kids and play it up that I wasn't fit to take care of them and couldn't support them financially. Husband has very strong views on divorced couples as well, and always criticises couples who we know that have got divorced. I really worry that if we were to end up like that that he would say terrible comments about me to the kids that would result in poisoning their minds against me. He does it already in one form or another with snide underhanded comments in front of the kids about me being on my phone, not listening, etc. Now my son says the same thing to me :-( And he would use his money as leverage to win the kids over as well.

Ugh I'm so confused now Confused

OP posts:
BrokenArrows · 18/05/2021 21:55

@category12

Nothing really came out of it other than her agreeing he was kind of controlling. Not really sure what the point of it was, or how they can help me other than to listen I guess

Well, that's a bit of external validation that it's not you? As well as from us lot here?

You could speak to Women's Aid/local domestic abuse services and get some support. They won't try to make you do anything you're not ready to do.

You could also try the Freedom Programme. There's an online one.

Thank you. And yes it was. Apologies, I didn't mean to trivialise the fact that everyone on here has been so supportive. I guess I'm just frustrated the councilor I was speaking to can't just help to snap their fingers and make all my problems disappear or offer me some kind of magic solution. Confused
OP posts:
MiniTheMinx · 18/05/2021 21:58

OP look up egotistic personality with low self esteem, this describes your husband.

The egotist has to control everything around him, and everyone. He has to be the centre of everything. He needs validation and all attention on him. His problems and his triumphs trump everyone else's. He knows more, can do more and he is best placed to make decisions (in his mind) because he knows what is best for everyone. No one is good enough, because they need to be better because he sees you as an extension to his fragile ego. He wants you to shine so that he can take responsibility for it, and yet puts you down to make himself feel better. These personalities do not change, they are controlling and coercive and they suck all your self esteem to bolster up their own fragile self esteem. That is why he compares himself to others, pushes you to do more whilst telling you that you are useless and not trying hard enough. he won't accept his son needs help, or worse (in his mind) a diagnosis because he believes this will reflect badly on him.

MiniTheMinx · 18/05/2021 22:06

I know that my husband would fight for full custody of the kids and play it up that I wasn't fit to take care of them and couldn't support them financially. Husband has very strong views on divorced couples as well, and always criticises couples who we know that have got divorced. I really worry that if we were to end up like that that he would say terrible comments about me to the kids that would result in poisoning their minds against me. He does it already in one form or another with snide underhanded comments in front of the kids about me being on my phone, not listening, etc. Now my son says the same thing to me :-( And he would use his money as leverage to win the kids over as well

Your husband is a nasty piece of work, even more reason to leave him. If you really believe that he is capable of all the above, you really can't keep turning yourself inside out to please him, because you never will, and the more broken he makes you, the more justified he will feel in breaking you some more. He will break you some more because he will believe that he is the victim of your incompetence and the want sympathy from others.

Hen2018 · 18/05/2021 22:16

I wish I had been able to “up and leave”! It took me 4 years... I only left for my children. By that point I thought I deserved everything I got.

I can’t remember if anyone has already posted this:

www.womensaid.org.uk/information-support/what-is-domestic-abuse/

Miasicarisatia · 18/05/2021 22:18

I don't know if there's a way to make him realise his behavior has gotten out of hand and that he causes me so much stress and anxiety
He's not interested in what you think, He is not interested in your suffering or pain he only wants obedience and deference from you. It's his way or no way, make a plan to leave and you can have a better life.

BrokenArrows · 18/05/2021 22:20

@MiniTheMinx

OP look up egotistic personality with low self esteem, this describes your husband.

The egotist has to control everything around him, and everyone. He has to be the centre of everything. He needs validation and all attention on him. His problems and his triumphs trump everyone else's. He knows more, can do more and he is best placed to make decisions (in his mind) because he knows what is best for everyone. No one is good enough, because they need to be better because he sees you as an extension to his fragile ego. He wants you to shine so that he can take responsibility for it, and yet puts you down to make himself feel better. These personalities do not change, they are controlling and coercive and they suck all your self esteem to bolster up their own fragile self esteem. That is why he compares himself to others, pushes you to do more whilst telling you that you are useless and not trying hard enough. he won't accept his son needs help, or worse (in his mind) a diagnosis because he believes this will reflect badly on him.

Yes, this does sound like him. I had done a bit of research before and thought perhaps he had some kind of narcissistic disorder, but he doesn't put me down like most narcs would by saying I'm ugly, etc I thought perhaps he might be what I have seen referred to as a covert narcissistic and also came across something else that suggested people who experienced medical trauma could turn into narcissists, but he has been this way for quite some time, but it has been made worse by the medical condition and also the introduction of our second child - I think just due to more stress and responsibilities of having two vs one.
OP posts:
LIZS · 18/05/2021 22:23

I don't know if there's a way to make him realise his behavior has gotten out of hand and that he causes me so much stress and anxiety, because in his eyes it's me doing all of that to him.

He will never "realise" it because he does not want to. All the tine he can belittle, bully and abuse you he is empowered. The fact he chooses to tell you it is all your fault is gaslighting, part of his controlling behaviour. He has undermined your self confidence to such an extent you feel there is no other choice. Allow others to help you find a way out - take medication, be involved in childcare, find put your rights. One step at a time.

category12 · 18/05/2021 22:31

He's already belittling you and poisoning the children against you.

Currently you and the dc are exposed to his emotional abuse 24/7. If you split up, you would be able to provide an emotionally safe home for them, a haven, and a counterpoint to what he's teaching them.

At the moment you're just teaching them that mum is to be denigrated and bullied and can't protect them. And your son is talking about suicide at 10.

There's not really such a thing as "full custody" - you both have parental rights and responsibility and in a divorce, you would get a settlement that allows you to support and house your children. The starting point would be a 50/50 division of assets (property, pensions, savings etc) but the split would probably be more in your favour as he has a massive salary.

Miasicarisatia · 18/05/2021 22:35

The reason he doesn't want you on medication is because he doesn't want you to be better or stronger, he wants you weak ill and easy to control

MiniTheMinx · 18/05/2021 22:36

If this is your DH, it quite likely predates the medical scare. Its often down to childhood trauma. The more recent medical scare could have effected him very badly. Its often down to the person having experience some early trauma where they felt they lacked control. When a similar threatening situation occurs they feel the same sense of losing control. They believe that everything will be fine if only they were in control.

Therapy? its unlikely to work simply because this type of personality will never agree to therapy because in their mind there is nothing wrong with them. They are always right, to admit otherwise is to disintegrate and they fear losing control.

MiniTheMinx · 18/05/2021 22:42

I don't think he is necessarily a full blown narcisist. But I believe you have described someone who has suffered some sort of trauma. However the behaviours, beliefs and attitudes are probably intractable, and people like him have a huge capacity to harm others. Please get some advice from women's aid and a solicitor. You deserve a better life than this.

MinesAPintOfTea · 18/05/2021 22:43

Blocking appropriate medical treatment for a child is neglect. The reason the doctors want to speak to the school is to try to support your child, irrespective of you or husband’s views.

If both of you block treatment and lie about it, you are both being neglectful. I’m saying this because you need to realise how serious this is, and what you stand to lose if you just go along with him.

It’s tough when you have been controlled for so long, but just keep seeking support, and keep a paper trail of the efforts you have made.

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