Advice please - handling OH baggage

[SunnyDarren123]

Hi all, first time poster needing advice.

I met a girl (GF) on a dating app 3 months ago. We got on amazingly well, the connection was great: the laughter, the sensitive talks, deep and meaningfuls, talking about our fears and desires. Conversations were so easy.

She told me so much about her father passing away when she was 17.

Eventually we told each other about our past relationships and that's where my uncertainty lies.

This is basically what GF told me....

She had a boyfriend at university (BF1).

In 2014, aged 23, she dated a guy (BF2) for 2 years who was her best friend during university. But it started as an affair Because BF2 was in a relationship which GF knew about. So she was complicit in BF2 cheating. She calls him her first love/greatest love but it didn't work out cos she couldn't commit in the way BF2 wanted to.

BF2 got back with girl he'd cheated on, married her in 2017 and had a child in 2019.

Also in 2019 my GF told BF2 Alle feelings she'd had for him when they first dated and they then had a 6 month affair, after he's become a dad.

Eventually GF breaks off the affair and goes back to dating BF1, her uni boyfriend, for a year. That ended in December.

It's been 2 years but BF2 still contacts GF by email and even calls her mum occasionally!

GF admits she still loves BF2.

And this weekend the uni ex BF1, invited her to see his new flat and she intended to go until other plans got in the way.

SO... With the tendency to go back to ex's; the history of being complicit in affairs; not cutting off contact the ex's.... Should I persist? I really like GF.

All views/warnings welcome. Please be honest.

Thank you for bearing with me during my long post

@MayorGoodwaysChicken

She sounds like a vile person. Any woman who can have an affair with a married man while his wife sits at home with their baby is scum. You fancy her, so you’ve pushed aside in your mind what an unpleasant and immoral person she is. It suits your narrative better for her to be lovely and misunderstood. But that’s just not the truth. She’s a manipulative nasty person who will chew you up and spit you out when she’s done with you. And you’re going into it eyes open, knowing she loves someone else. Good luck is all I can say

Though she says she feels so bad about the affair, she says affairs are always possible. So maybe she doesn't feel bad. Or justifies it internally at least.

I hadn't thought of her being manipulative. Maybe you're right.

@pictish

“GF admits she still loves BF2.”

I couldn’t get beyond this.

Think about why it is that you are prepared to accept this as a backdrop for your relationship. I’d have dropped her like a sack of shit at that little revelation. What, are you supposed to compete?

“She's told me I'm slowly making her forget her ex's....???!?!”

She’s dangling you on a string to make you dance. She has also made it clear this will run to her indulgent time scale.

She can fuck off surely?

You're right, I'm not willing to accept that. I don't know if anyone can complete tbh. She calls him the love of her life.

Is oversharing so bad?

It's likely she is seeking validation or using the information to appear vulnerable: "Using vulnerability is the not the same thing as being vulnerable; it’s the opposite—it’s armour.”

Would you give someone you've only just met, all your money to look after? Oversharing is like that. Giving too much personal information too early on can be a sign that you lack boundaries, and it can be a way to self gratify by curating attention and validation from like minded people. It can also be a way for narcissistic or manipulative people to 'information gather' to use against you at a later date. It's us also a coping mechanism for trauma and all the signs from your op indicate that she has a chaotic approach to relationships which will negatively impact on your own mental health. Whatever the reason, it's a red flag that she needs to work on herself.

@CherryDocsInYrBalls

These are all abusive tactics. Do a quick Google of live bombing, triangulation and future faking. Narcissists thrive online because they can control their mask much better. Block and move on and maybe work on your boundaries. All these phone calls like someone else said, none of it is real until you have met them

I'll Google those things.

But do you think I need to assess my boundaries because I let the phone calls go on so long at an early stage?

We have met each other a number of times. But she mentions her ex's face to face, occasionally.
Like recalling things they did. I've given her flowers a few times which she loved. But one time she mentioned that they were the best flowers she'd received since BF2, but that he knew her favourite florist

@PriestessofPing

“She says she's always been one to NoT express feelings but with me she finds herself telling me how she feels about me.” - That’s supposed to be flattering but to me it screams RED FLAG even more than her admitted issues with cheating and commitment. She’s implying that you can fix her shitty ways. It’s such an immature way to behave. If she wanted to change because she fears this ‘karma’ or she has actually grown and doesn’t want to be a twat anymore - she would do that herself.

She’s love bombing you and making you responsible for her ‘behaving’. Of course she’ll be happy to ‘misbehave’ whenever she feels like it because she hasn’t changed has she? She hasn’t broken anything off properly with her affair partner and is still dangling the other uni guy on a string too.

Now she’s got you as well! Funny eh how much you two have in common? How perfect she seems for you. How lovely she comes across to you. Yet she’s perfectly capable of all you describe. Look up love bombing and mirroring.

I’d not go any further with her if i were you.

Your first paragraph... Yes she's often implied I can make her forget/get past her ex's.

I know that's not enough because if I can make her bury those feelings, the ex's could just as easily come back and arouse those feelings one day

Thank you

But one time she mentioned that they were the best flowers she'd received since BF2, but that he knew her favourite florist There was no need to say that. She is looking for excuses to talk about him. Run.

@Rozziie

I have a male friend who always goes for women like this. It's maddening. He's had some lovely, pretty girlfriends who in all honesty were too good for him and who he was lucky to be with, but dumped them because they were 'boring'. They weren't boring, they just weren't the self absorbed narcissists he seems to be obsessed with. They were stable, supportive and kind, but he keeps going for these drama queens and then getting upset and hurt when it all goes spectacularly wrong.

What's really annoying is the way he tries to defend them like you are doing. Their actions and behaviour point to them being horrible people but he always insists they aren't, and I just don't understand. His latest girlfriend is 24 (he's 39!) and started dating him while still with her ex. She's flaky and immature and untrustworthy but he's convinced that they have something special. He literally says this about all of them. He complained about a previous girlfriend using him for money when she lost her job through no fault of her own and couldn't pay the rent for a month or two while she looked for a new one, yet he's happy for this one to move in totally rent-free after 4 months of knowing her because 'I want a nice flat than she can afford so it makes sense'. It's just bizarre the way he lies to himself. It's like in his head, being 'hot' just outweighs absolutely everything else and he overlooks all kinds of terrible flaws.

Do you want to be like this? Pushing 40 and chasing after head-melting young women while all your friends are settling down?

Sadly I can see some of these traits in my past. I'm hoping that now I can see that and can ask for advice like this thread I'm putting a stop to that on my part. I hope :/

Mine have all been women with a lack of a father figure or unstable parents marriages. In this case a father that passed away in her teens. As sad as that is, one person advised that it can still trigger abandonment feelings and linked behaviour

No I don't want to be like you say. I want simple and happy

@SortingItOut

You haven't answered the questions about whether you've actually met...

Can I also ask whether you've been sexting and exchanging photos?

Yes we've met several times. Not so many traditional dates because finding a booking anywhere has been hard. But outdoor dates, picnics, drive thrus etc.

No sexting and no exchanging photos

@category12

When I read your title, I just thought it shouldn't be that you have to handle the other person's baggage. It's for them to manage. If they're unable to have a relationship with you without visiting their past relationships on you, they're not really ready or suitable for you to be in a relationship with.

I didn't really need to read the thread. My opinion remains the same.

We don't need to expect perfection from a relationship, but a new partner shouldn't be attempting to clear the rubbish for the person. It's their stuff to handle.

And that's how I've felt. Like I'm inadvertently clearing her mind of her past. But I don't want to be the guy that sorts her out and then the next guy gets the best of her

Thing is, you can't sort another person's shit out. They have to do it for themselves or it doesn't stick.

@CandyLeBonBon

Sorry op but the early oversharing, the 'I think I'm falling for you' super early and historic relationship drama all spell out disaster. She sounds horribly self absorbed and a little narcissistic so as sad as it feels, you'd be safer walking away and going with your gut on this, chemistry or no chemistry.

I'm trying to figure out if I'm guilty of this too or if shared just because she did.

But I see your point.

@MumofPsuedoAdult

OP if you're feeling gutted now about ending something that hasn't even started, bottle that feeling and times it by ten for how you'll feel when she does the dirty on you too. She's BLATANTLY showing you who she is, believe her!

Never thought of that, that She is showing me who she is

@SortingItOut

Oversharing is bad, its a sign of lack of boundaries.

Women are encouraged to not overshare when dating as you can be putting yourself in a vulnerable position.

Also it could be a sign that she is trying to make you jealous as she has all these men who want her and you're lucky to have her - possibly narcissistic.

I never knew that, about the whole lack of boundaries concept. It just felt an easy conversation and things flowed. Now you mention it, Other than the BF's there's a uni friend who she says often suggests they should have got together. But she was never interested.

'I hadn't thought of her being manipulative'

Well, start, because I've rarely come across such an obviously manipulative woman. Maybe because she's young. She'll get better at it, no doubt.

'There's a uni friend who she says often suggests they should have got together'

But of course! Tell me - has she ever encountered a man who didn't want her? Jesus Mary and Joseph.

@Skysblue

So you met a really hot girl and seemed to have loads in common and started falling for her.

Then she told you she is still in love with someone else and is a cheater. So now you are sad and wish you could go back to when you thought this could be love.

But you can’t change her. If you stay with her she will eventually cheat on you with BF2. And your knowledge that you can’t trust her will poison the relationship.

I’d just like to point out how very weird it is that she told you all this. She’s trying to make you compete for her attention/affection. If she was serious about moving on from her past she wouldn’t be telling you she loves someone else.

I needed to hear this summary. I do wish we could go back a few conversations. And I know BF2 is keeping tabs by emailing her - which itself is weird rather than not calling or messaging, but work emails can't be found by his wife.

Another revelation like that, Darren, and I'll start to think you're not on the up and up . . .

@Babyiskickingmyribs

Have you told her you don’t want to know this level of detail about her exes? Not in a ´this is a forbidden topic’ kind of way but more in a ´this is not a helpful convo to have with me as your current bf’ kind of way. She might stop or reduce the comparisons. I had a tendency to compare bfs and exes when I was younger. It was partly to do with wanting to know what sexual health risks I was taking with a new partner and partly to do with slowly getting over my first ever teenage bf who I fell for hard. I stopped because it was irrelevant to my partner and he just didn’t want to hear about it and I could respect that. I also had to accept that I wasn’t going to get the level of detail about his exes that I thought I wanted (I really didn’t care from a relationship/drama/comparison point of view, it was more about the sexual health risks stuff).

No I've not asked her to tone it down.

And sex was not on the cards any time soon so that wasn't an issue.

@fizzywaterplease

But one time she mentioned that they were the best flowers she'd received since BF2, but that he knew her favourite florist There was no need to say that. She is looking for excuses to talk about him. Run.

Yeah that comment took the air out of the moment.

There is the option that you become BF3 and she gets over BF2.

Then she dumps you as its all too safe and meets potential 4 and says to him, BF3 was the love of my life but you are helping me get over him.....

I have no idea what is going on in her head but rest assured its not good.

@LobotomisedIceSkatingFan

'I hadn't thought of her being manipulative'

Well, start, because I've rarely come across such an obviously manipulative woman. Maybe because she's young. She'll get better at it, no doubt.

Noted.

And her male friends... If they don't outright say that they want/wanted to be with her at some point in their life, many are always asking to meet for brunch lunch coffee dinner walks etc etc

But some women have lots of male friends... So I thought. With her it's always a bit different.

Her closest guy mate has never introduced her to his own long term gf. When they meet he makes an excuse for not bringing his gf out

I'm almost scared. She walks among us, guys. Who is this woman?

It sounds like she has a desperate need for validation and is engaging in triangulation which is designed to keep you working hard to please her and keep your energy, time and attention focused on feeding her ego.

Sounds like she’s having a great time playing you all off against each other, she should crack on.

You on the other hand need to decide if you’re happy to be second best.

@Wherearemymarbles

There is the option that you become BF3 and she gets over BF2.

Then she dumps you as its all too safe and meets potential 4 and says to him, BF3 was the love of my life but you are helping me get over him.....

I have no idea what is going on in her head but rest assured its not good.

I Def do not want to be one in a chain.