Finding my partner's affection with our daughter, uncomfortable.

[no675]

Hello,

Basicially, my issues is. And I believe it is 'my issue'. My wonderful partner and dad to our daughter who is six years old is affectionate with her. No more or no less than any other healthy, loving father.

He kisses her, tickles her and holds her.

However, I find this extremely uncortable to warch and every fibre in my body is wanting to say 'stop'.

I feel it is wrong, but my logical brain knows it is not.

I was wondering if anyone could relate or had any advice?

P.S I am more than hundred percent sure there is nothing untoward going on. It is purely me overreacting. He is like I said. Wonderful and he just loves his daughter. However, I have problem with the way he shows it, I feel he shoudlnt kiss, cuddle and tickle. I am wondering why I have such issues, whether others have and what I can I do about them.

Thank you,

N

Are these feelings new? If so you may just be recognising that she's getting too old for the tickling, and it's making you hypersensitive to his interactions with her.

I'd have a casual conversation with him about how she's getting older and you need to be teaching her about body autonomy so best that he stops the tickling.

My friend's husband is very affectionate with his grown up daughter. Several people have commented on it in a negative manner and it makes me uncomfortable in that it could be misconstrued. I know he is a fantastic son, husband, father and friend to many but others don't know him. My friend is just as tactile but as she's female it is deemed acceptable.

I’m on the fence on this. I know a man like that, very affectionate touchy geeky with his DD, it was normal but someway it felt “off”.

I thought it was me who was wrong to feel that way until the day we started talking about OLD and he said that for him his 8 year old DD was his partner and soulmate he just needed woman to fulfil the sexual part.

Over the next years when the girl became a teen, I thought he got worse, he treats her like his girlfriend, lots of borderline appropriate touching and is massively jealous of boys in a way he shouldn’t be.

Trust your instincts, they do not necessarily have to be wrong.

Feels not geeky

I had this in reverse OP. When my DS was about 9 he would often sit next to me, snuggle up, and play with my hair while we watched TV, and his DF would shout, "get away from your mum" it was like he thought it was wrong to show affection. This was nearly 20 years ago but the memory of his reaction to this is very clear.

Tickling is fun for the tickler and horrible for the ticklee. Some consider it abuse.

Oh for crying out loud!

When people say tickling is abuse it's because sex offenders will often use things like tickling as a way of touching the child in a joking manner.

Also if someone is tickling you & don't stop when you ask them to that is unwanted touching.

So tickling can be fun BUT it also can be a tactic used by abusers to touch you in an unwanted way.

So the people who scoff just don't understand .

Where has the op gone?

Physical affection can be absolutely wonderful and such a lovely part of a parent child relationship, it’s good to affirm a connection with your child. There’s something going on here, either you have serious issues around this or something is very very wrong. As others have said therapy around this issue could help you unpack why you are feeling so concerned. Tickling can be loads of fun for both parent and child, unfortunately it can be a very strong tool in any abusers Arsenal. My abuser used to love to tickle in front of people so he could abuse me in front of other adults who would ooh and aah and laugh along and I had to play my part in that. For those who are calling people idiots for thinking tickling is abusive, it really really can be and it can be terrifying to a child who is being abused to be so helpless and everyone affirming the abuse. Be practical are there opportunities for DH to abuse your child? If you are 100% sure that this isn’t happening then please look at your reaction to this and find out why you feel this way and how to deal with it in the right way for you and your family.

@gutful

When people say tickling is abuse it's because sex offenders will often use things like tickling as a way of touching the child in a joking manner.

Also if someone is tickling you & don't stop when you ask them to that is unwanted touching.

So tickling can be fun BUT it also can be a tactic used by abusers to touch you in an unwanted way.

So the people who scoff just don't understand .

Its not just sex offenders who tickle mercilessly, but also those who enjoy abusing boundaries/ causing suffering.

As a kid I had a male relative who used to tickle me so hard it hurt. He'd be saying "tickle, tickle" and laughing, but I was asking him to stop because it hurt so much. He didn't listen. I told a parent but I got told off for saying awful things about a grown up that I should have respected. It was never tickly and always painful. I'm still trying to make sense of it.

The best thing is talk to your daughter and listen to her feelings OP.

We both kiss, cuddle and tickle our 6 year old which she loves. Now I come to think of it most if not all the physical contact is instigated by her which is how we feel assured she wants it (and we are happy to oblige).

When our eldest was little it was the same. He'd ask for hugs, kisses and tickle fights. He's nearly 16 now and hugs are very rare (I think we had a brief hug on Christmas day!) I can't remember when the hugs and kisses petered out but it was definitely as a result of him not being so keen so we must have picked up those cues. I recall he stopped hugging and kissing his dad first. They are still very close though.

I hated being tickled as a child and I would never have tickled my children if they expressed a dislike for it. It just happened that they both found it hilarious.

What I'm trying to say is that hugging and kissing your child is absolutely fine as long as it's what the child wants rather than what the parent wants. Bodily autonomy is a very important thing to respect, always.

I think tickling is something that is only enjoyable when the people doing and being tickled are respectful of boundaries and in tune with each other’s signals.

We have a book called the tickle book. Both my children love it and like the being tickled part of it. I only ever do very short tickled, when they ask and if I see any signs of them wanting it to stop I either stop or stop and ask if they want it to stop. In fact most of the time we’re doing tickling games. Is me stopping and saying shall I stop.

I’m very sensitive to tickling because my dad and my brother both tickled me beyond my boundaries when I was little and I hated it! Also my dad is generally not respectful of physics boundaries, though not in a sexual way more in terms of being too rough with everything he does to everyone.

I agree it can be abusive.

There’s that old saying there’s no smoke without fire. I hope you get to the bottom of it.

Tickling CAN be borderline abusive. I also think it can be one of the earliest most basic ways small children learn about consent/body autonomy. Small child says "tickle me mummy" they are tickled "aaargh stop" mother stops. "do it again" "are you sure" etc etc etc? All of which happens years before you would even start having conversations around consent or even be thinking about it. Which is why it can be so damaging (I think) when parents/other adults push tickling too far even if they don't mean any harm. I don't think there is anything wrong with tickling itself so long as the child is being listened to.

OP has vanished ?

It sounds like a normal daughter and father loving relationship.
My husband dotes on our daughter, kisses and cuddles her, he doesn’t tickle her though!
She has a close relationship with him, which is lovely.
My mother had a father who was very cold and never cuddled or kissed her, (he also made it clear to her growing up, he was disappointed she was a girl, she was his 4th daughter and he desperately wanted a son.)
They’ve never had a good relationship and she went no contact when she was in her 20’s, he has now passed away.

Thanks everyone. Such a lot of responses - wow! Lots to think about.

Sorry, I have had a mad day so only had a chance to sit down now.

For those who mentioned therapy - yes I am in theray and I mentioned it in the last session - she thinks I am repressing sexual abuse which I dont have memory so very alarming.... ?!?!

In terms, of jelousy, it is nothing to do with that. I don't feel the least bit jealous, my logical / thinking mind has no qualms and knows it healthy and normal. And I wouldn't want my own issues to destroy their relationship, so I bottle it up and they're none the wiser.

Mu gut instict is that nothing is wrong, so I don't think he has / will cross then lines an my female intution is warning me.

I think I am just paranoid and the 'feeling' is due to some weird skewed perception.

Anyway - thanks again for all the responses.

It's good you're in therapy OP. Are they allowed to say that? Do you mind me asking is it Psychotherapy / Counselling or another type of therapy? Only I probably need to have therapy and I'm trying to work out which kind.
If your gut instinct is that nothing's wrong, that's great. TBH if your daughter was being sexually abused there would probably be indications like the ones listed here: www.nhs.uk/live-well/healthy-body/spotting-signs-of-child-sexual-abuse/

But why do you say he's wonderful when your other posts that a pp linked say he's not?

@justilou1

I feel that although this may not be the same thing at all, I should mention that I used to ask not to be taken to a relatives house because he used to hold me down and tickle me every time I was there. He was only a couple of years older than I was, and I was the only girl. Everyone dismissed this and said he did it because he liked me so much. When I was fourteen, he and his friends drugged me at a party and violently raped me. There was no point reporting this to family members because it would never have been believed of the golden child.

So sorry @justilou1 . That's such an awful betrayal! :( I actually had a similar experience with the tickling. I told my parent expecting help, but was called wicked and a troublemaker for mentioning it. I have flashbacks to other things but the male relative (tickler) died while I was still quite young. I remember it hurting a lot and not feeling tickly at all, asking him to stop and him carrying on.

Do you still have to see this person? I hope you don't. Families can be so tricky, especially narc ones.

No worries, I'm an adult, (48) and have nothing to do with any of these people anymore. I am also hypervigilant with my kids. (They know their boundaries!) Yes - my family were very much Narcs. Your issues may very much have been helplessness - physically and emotionally. You may not have been sexually abused, but the feelings of violation are still similar on a developing child and should not be dismissed as far as developmental issues (especially emotional intimacy, etc.)

@justilou1
I'm so glad you don't have to have anything to do with them anymore. I'm pretty sure there was some sexual abuse, though not actual rape unless I've blocked it out. I do remember being told off for acting out sexual acts and being told I was dirty from an early age (about 3 or 4) but I don't remember how I got the knowledge, though I have suspicions.

I’m guessing that this is where your feelings are coming from then... even if they were just projected at you by adults. When the world opens up you should try and find someone who specialises in EMDR therapy. It’s a great way to help resolve the dark corner stuff quickly.

Having read your other thread, it sounds to me like you have the ick with DP. Serious ick. So I wonder if you’re projecting your own ‘cringe’ onto your DD. Despite having a high sex drive you do not fancy him at all, and describe sex as ‘unbearable’. Yet you’re forcing yourself to do exercises to reignite a desire which just isn’t there.

Be very careful with a therapist who suggests you are suppressing sexual abuse, that’s how false memory syndrome starts. They should be very circumspect touching on that subject.

I’m wondering if these exercises are actually leaving you feeling violated. Why not stop trying to force yourself to have sex with him.