Should I tell her they call her the Bunny Boiler?

[IsIgnoranceBliss]

Long story, short - should I tell a friend that others don’t trust her and are calling her a “bunny boiler” because of her behaviour around married men? Or should I keep out of her business?

I’ve name changed for this, in case the people concerned recognise themselves, even though their names and some details have been changed.

There is a woman, Anna, that I used to work with until about a year ago. We were work friends and have kept in contact throughout the lockdown, with weekly phone catch-ups - largely for company during the lockdown, not because we are especially close although I enjoy her company. Anna is early-forties, long-term single but want to meet someone and ideally have a child. She has shared stories with me about her online dating exploits and about various men she has been keen on. She is very keen on a man called Tom, who she said is in an unhappy marriage, but she thinks he will be leaving his wife and has hopes for a relationship with him. I told her that I believe she should wait until he is formally separated before trying to start anything, but it is clear that she has very strong feelings for him and she is trying to get closer to him, which I don’t approve of.

I had a catch-up with another friend, Barbara, who happens to know Anna though a volunteering activity (which is allowed to continue through the pandemic). I mentioned that I was having regular calls with Anna, and Barbara referred to her as “the bunny boiler”. From Barbara’s point of view (and apparently of some of the other women in the group), Anna has had intense obsessions about a few married men in the group, has a tendency to play the “damsel in distress” with men to get their attention and can be too touchy freely with some of them (less so since social distancing came in). To be honest, I have seen Anna behave in a similar way when we worked together and can see how it might look for a single woman to behave the way she does with men - but can also see that it could be viewed as Anna just being friendly. Barbara says that some of the wives exclude Anna from some activities (pre-Covid) as her behaviour makes them uncomfortable and they think she is desperate for a man and seems to even prefer men who are already in relationships.

Tom is in the same volunteer group and Barbara said Anna was embarrassing herself and Tom with her behaviour around him. This included regularly asking Tom out for drinks (outside of lockdown) without his wife, with the excuse of a shared interest in football, confiding in him about her relationship issues, and messaging him a lot. Anna has told me she has done this and doesn’t see a problem with it because they are friends. Barbara believes that Tom is happily married and Anna is just obsessed with him.

Barbara also said that Anna’s behaviour around Tom, the other men she has been infatuated with and generally the men in the group, mean that she is not trusted. Anna is now self-employed in a role where trust is important (something like counselling) so not being seen as trustworthy could affect Anna professionally.

Do I say anything to Anna? It isn’t my business and also I don’t want to hurt her, but I am worried that her personal and professional reputation will be damaged if she’s not careful and feel I should she should know.

Sorry that was long.

• you not yourr - I’m not sure why it went all pirate there.

I wouldn't . To be honest it sounds as though Anna will upset some mans poor wife anyway so she will eventually find out what people think about her and her nickname will become known to her.

@IsIgnoranceBliss

And yes, it has affected her professionally, as people have chosen not to use or recommend her services.

I disagree with the other posters. Based on what you said above, I would approach talking to Anna regarding privacy and keeping her mouth shut. Tell her that people are beginning to think she’s untrustworthy due to her penchant for telling other people’s business and that it’s being perceived as a way for her to falsely ingratiate herself with others. I’d directly advise her to put some mental and physical distance into her personal relationships because it’s starting to affect her business relationships.

This is not intended as a drip feed. I started the thread because I was trying to work out how to best support a friend, so I’m glad I asked and I am grateful for people’s responses. I have autism and struggle with knowing what is appropriate to say/do in these kind of situations and find Mumsnet is useful for asking what largely neurotypical people think about a situation.

But I do feel some people have projected a lot about my perceived intentions that aren’t correct and are rather hurtful, and it makes me feel uncomfortable about asking questions on here again.

@IsIgnoranceBliss I’d also like to say that some of the responses here read as a kind of spiteful response against other women who happen to be single. Married women circling the wagons. I’m married as well but I wouldn’t leave Anna out there to twist in the wind and become the laughing stock/accused jezebel or harlot. That doesn’t feel right to me at all.

And don’t bother replying to *luntness. She’s known to be goady at times with wild suppositions. It’s a fool’s errand.

Jings Thank you - the privacy aspect is a good approach if she asks me about it directly.

I'd mind my own business. They are grown men and are perfectly capable of telling her they're not interested if they're not.

@FoxgloveBee

I'd mind my own business. They are grown men and are perfectly capable of telling her they're not interested if they're not.

It seems that my post wasn’t clear. I’m not interested in the impact on the men, I am concerned about my friend.

And don’t bother replying to luntness. She’s known to be goady at times with wild suppositions*

Says the poster known to personally attack posters,,

Two can play that game. 😂

@IsIgnoranceBliss

Jings Thank you - the privacy aspect is a good approach if she asks me about it directly.

I’d proactively tell her, actually if this affecting her business. For me this wouldn’t be about gossiping or interfering. She’s a single woman during a pandemic. I’m all for people keeping their streams of income alive during this shitty time, if you see what I mean. :) If she decides to take it the wrong way, then you’ve tried.

Interestingly I'm autistic and have the "should I interfere when I see a problem?" issue every so often.

I (like you) would appreciate the steer and would not take it personally. But it seems that most people just do not, they hate it and take it deeply personally, I've found this out to my cost over the years and so I tend to stay quiet now.

So no, don't do anything, and change the topic when other people raise it in future.

I think you should tell her how her behaviour is coming across. Maybe she doesn't realise? What she's said to you about Tom's marriage is a bit concerning - either she's fabricating it or she's becoming too close to a married man. Neither option makes for desirable qualities in a friend.

I knew an Anna.

I tried talking to her and gently explaining how other people viewed it but she was convinced that the connection was genuine; she believed that other people were jealous and narrow minded; she believed that she could love him better than his wife who didnt deserve him.andndeserved everything she got...

Our friendship finally ended when a married man predictably made a play for me and she insisted he was a lovely man and I should go for it.

We argued with men taking the position of he wasnt a lovely man and her taking the position of I'd never be happy if i didn't allow myself to be and she could tell he truly loved me.

Honestly, it was ridiculous.

You can try, but i doubt it'll work!

[quote Bluntness100]I mean how in all that is holy can Anna be seen as untrustworthy because of her and Tom. Other than to you Barbara and the other wives.

It is so mean girls from school. The pair of you need to grow up, it’s all “Barbara said”. Like “Barbara” is some form of oracle. And you’re desperate to get in there and tell Anna. In true mean girl style.

It’s not going to impact her professionally and you know it. It’s no ones business what state Tom’s marriage is in, and the two of you shouldn’t be sitting gossiping. You also shouldn’t be having calls with Anna and pretending to be trust worthy and then running back to Barbara the oracle with all the gossip, then running back to Anna and saying what was said gleefully.

Single woman. Always a threat.right?[/quote]
Well, you don't know Anna either. There are lots of Anna's around. Just as there are lots of Tom's (married men professing to other women that they're in unhappy relationships just to get attention).

Whilst I agree OP should stay well out of this. In reality, it's not nice when you realise a friend is actively chasing after married men (as Anna has admitted to OP in her desire for Tom) so it's hardly OP tarnishing all single women is it?

And it very much could affect Anna's career if Tom's wife catches on to what's going on and reports her. She's taken a professional role in a field that is reliant on being trustworthy and honourable. If she's known to be a women who chases married men, that could very well tarnish her career.

I don't think OP should say anything regarding what Barbara said. But I do think next time Anna talks about Tom OP would be within her rights to let Anna know that it's immoral what she's doing and disrespectful of the other marriage. Yes, Tom should (and hopefully does) reject her, but it's still not a good move flirting with another woman's husband. I know id be very pissed off if someone was trying to have an affair with my husband whether he acted on it or not!

@zzizzer

Interestingly I'm autistic and have the "should I interfere when I see a problem?" issue every so often.

I (like you) would appreciate the steer and would not take it personally. But it seems that most people just do not, they hate it and take it deeply personally, I've found this out to my cost over the years and so I tend to stay quiet now.

So no, don't do anything, and change the topic when other people raise it in future.

I really appreciate you posting this.

I struggle because other people share opinions and information about themselves and others as a way of deepening friendships, and I don’t understand the grey area between being interested in people and gossiping. I can see why you tend to stay quiet and I have done that many times, but it does feel so socially isolating.

Don’t you think Tom has any responsibility? Don’t you think if he shut Anna down she would stop? Don’t you think Tom has possibly told Anna he’s unhappily married?

I agree with you OP that Anna isn’t doing herself any favours. Do you think she knows that lots of the things she does are breaking social conventions ? Or is it that she knows but doesn't care?

I have two Aspie teenagers so I understand where you are coming from on this - that you’re not sure how NT people would see this situation.

I suspect you have some sympathy for Anna in case she really doesn’t know that she’s breaking unwritten social rules.

Best advice I can give is this: I knew someone like this, it's kind of fine until it's not - this particular lady then became interested in my husband (who BTW wasn't interested at all). Best thing I ever did was cutting her dead, she was so desperate for another child and a descent relationship she basically just ploughed through "friends" in the hunt for a man. When DH turned her down she then tried to destroy our relationship....beware.

Sometimes the less said the better, and this is one of those times.

I'd stay well out of it, and try to steer clear of any conversations with others. Otherwise, some day somebody else might tell her that you have been spreading gossip about her.

@Bluntness100

Don’t you think Tom has any responsibility? Don’t you think if he shut Anna down she would stop? Don’t you think Tom has possibly told Anna he’s unhappily married?

It’s not about Tom. It’s about Anna and her personal and professional reputation and whether it is appropriate to tell her what people are saying about her.

I thought that was clear from the first post, but I recognise that it is not clear to every reader.

@IM0GEN

I agree with you OP that Anna isn’t doing herself any favours. Do you think she knows that lots of the things she does are breaking social conventions ? Or is it that she knows but doesn't care?

I have two Aspie teenagers so I understand where you are coming from on this - that you’re not sure how NT people would see this situation.

I suspect you have some sympathy for Anna in case she really doesn’t know that she’s breaking unwritten social rules.

I do have sympathy for Anna. And I do see it as her breaking social conventions. I don’t know if she realises or not. I’ll be honest, I do struggle with people breaking “rules”. I would want to be told, but this thread has shown me that others would not want to be told even if their behaviour was likely to result in them getting hurt.

Has anything good come out of second-hand gossip, ever?

I wouldn't say anything unless she asks you. I don't think she'd appreciate being told? She knows what she is doing I think.

Though honestly, I don't think I could have a close friendship with someone like 'Anna'. Not really because of the married men, but because of the attention seeking behaviour. I would find that very draining.

This is not for you to be concerned about. Anna is not going to get very far with all her men exploits, and others will act accordingly around her. as in all the women will dislike her,or take notice of her, and the men will do whatever, depending on their viewpoints. Anna will lose all her friends eventually,if she is keeps this behaviour up.

Perhaps you could try if Anna brings up Tom again saying that you think she's worth more than that, a lovely chap all of her own...and then change the subject. I wouldn't tell her about the things Barbara said, you've only her word for it and whilst I can see you're trying to look out for her best interests I can't see how you can do that without it looking like gossip or judgement.