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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

unmarried stay @home mum separation advice please

277 replies

fridaysforfuturemum · 29/10/2020 22:31

My partner asked for a separation in January.
We are joint owners of our home and have been living in a toxic atmosphere since then. We have two teenagers at High school. We're not married and I know I have no legal rights on anything but half the house. It was a joint agreement that I leave my job to be a stay@home mum. My partner now says it was my decision and legally he does not have to give me equal share of the savings etc..
I have no money as we just had a joint account. I really want to stay in my home with my kids. (they will stay with me one week, then him the next...)
The solicitors I spoke to were not interested in helping me because they said I was a cohabitee and had no rights. Appeal to his better nature was their top tip!
Can anyone suggest what kind of professional would be able to help me put a financial settlement proposal together that is fair and equal,takes into account what I have contributed to our family over the last 16 years and splits everything 50/50?
I'm saying to him it's about doing the right thing and what's morally right rather than what I'm legally entitled to. I asked him to treat me as if we have been married. We have been together 26 years :(
I've been a trusting fool like so many other women before me...

OP posts:
Ohalrightthen · 31/10/2020 13:24

@IsayIsayBoy

Ohalrightthen

Harsh!

Perhaps, but not unfair, i don't think. An awful lot of people work full time and manage a house and family. Its not a herculean task.
Giningit · 31/10/2020 13:48

I agree @Ohalrightthen. Working and managing a home is pretty normal in many households.

Whitehorsewaves · 31/10/2020 13:59

Matildaonawaltzer

You are right about the act applying to unmarried partners but I think you mean Schedule 1 not schedule A. The main purpose of Schedule 1 is to provide financial provision for the child. It is not to provide financial provision for the resident parent. In this instance the NRP requires the equity to house himself and his children as he could have 50/50 parental split. The needs of the child are what the court would consider not the OP. The children in this case are teenagers and a 50/50 split is a reasonable access schedule in this instance.

If the situation above is in place, the OP will receive no maintenance and would probably be unable to maintain the house financially on her own anyway.

She's got older kids and no way of supporting the house herself. This is probably why her solicitor advised her she didn't have a case under Schedule 1. But we of course can only go on what the OP has said.

ThePerfectRose · 31/10/2020 14:02

So disappointing reading this thread. Imagine coming on Mumsnet, for what must have been a very difficult thing to talk about- asking for some advice. To be subjected to such horrible posts, and probably been made to feel a lot worse.

If you don’t have anything constructive or practical to say then why bother posting.

IsayIsayBoy · 31/10/2020 14:23

@ThePerfectRose

So disappointing reading this thread. Imagine coming on Mumsnet, for what must have been a very difficult thing to talk about- asking for some advice. To be subjected to such horrible posts, and probably been made to feel a lot worse.

If you don’t have anything constructive or practical to say then why bother posting.

I totally agree. Such harsh opinions. Not at all useful. I'm sure with hindsight OP would have made different decisions.
Farahilda · 31/10/2020 14:34

@ThePerfectRose - what advice would you offer the OP instead?

Seenobody · 31/10/2020 14:48

Tbf the op had seen two solicitors who had already told her she had ‘no rights’ so I’m not sure what else mumsnetters could advise.

Lobsterquadrille2 · 31/10/2020 15:30

@ThePerfectRose the OP came to ask whether there were professionals she could consult who would give her a different answer from what she had already received. It would be poor, sugar coated advice to say "yes, you are likely to receive spousal maintenance and/or child maintenance even if custody is 50/50". People have been truthful. I'm sure that everyone sympathises - I certainly do, and maybe I was lucky to be in the position of single parent early on, with only one baby, never received any maintenance so had no choice but to work full time and "run the home". I agree with the PP who said that keeping house is something most people do in the background and fit in around work. Again, truthful and maybe blunt but hardly harsh.

ThePerfectRose · 31/10/2020 15:53

There has been some good advice/ support but if you don’t think some of these responses are harsh then honestly, you can’t be a very nice person in real life.

Crazycrazylady · 31/10/2020 15:57

Op
If I were you. I'd immediately take half of all
Money in any account you have a card for.
As pretty much everyone here has said. You're only legally entitled to half the house. Is their much equity in that at the moment?. It's very unlikely that your ex is going to volunteer anything other than that.
I'd immediately start applying for jobs as you are going to need to start working full time pretty quickly to give yourself an income.

RantyAnty · 31/10/2020 16:35

Take everything that isn't nailed down if you have to.
Do you have a car? Other things you can sell?

It is a shame you can't sue for back wages since your weren't his wife, you were definitely housekeeper and nanny.

As for working and taking care of the house, that would mean he would have been capable of doing both but clearly he didn't.

TitianaTitsling · 31/10/2020 22:36

@RantyAnty

Take everything that isn't nailed down if you have to. Do you have a car? Other things you can sell?

It is a shame you can't sue for back wages since your weren't his wife, you were definitely housekeeper and nanny.

As for working and taking care of the house, that would mean he would have been capable of doing both but clearly he didn't.

If she 'sues for back wages' then the dp should then sue for a financial contribution towards upkeep and running of the house!
Kornflake · 01/11/2020 07:47

@fridaysforfuturemum just want to say that I understand why you made all those choices re your family and deciding to stay at home. The stress of you both working and sharing chores can be enormous with young children in particular, also you do have a right to rear your own children and be with them as opposed to using childcare. This is reason enough.
Not being married has made you vulnerable (the same has happened to me). I really don't think it's unreasonable at all to try to appeal to you partner's better nature and request that he treats you as a married partner after all those years.
Don't let up, keep on at him.
I know what the law states, but he will know that to not treat you as an equal married partner would be screwing you over.
I have requested the same from my partner and want him to give me a proportion of his pension as mine has suffered greatly through working part-time. I'm willing to accept a greater equity of the house we live in as a pension "payment."
Don't let it go just because he doesn't have to "legally" treat you as an equal.
Also, surely eventually the law on this will change with the times at some point. Nothing is stopping you from taking some control back here and writing to your MP or starting a petition for a change in the law for unmarried mothers.
Make sure everyone knows what you're requesting of him and make sure everyone knows if he doesn't give it to you.

millymollymoomoo · 01/11/2020 08:08

We don’t need a change in the law! If people the same rights as being married - get married
By all means appeal to his better nature but you know legally where you stand and that’s the only thing you can rely on

Whitehorsewaves · 01/11/2020 08:24

There doesn't need to be a change in the law, we need to educate people on their lack of rights if they decide to have children and become sahm parents whilst remaining unmarried. Then people can make informed choices.

category12 · 01/11/2020 08:28

Maybe we do need a change in the law.

I think people should be able to choose not to pool resources and not be considered to have legal obligations to each other if they cohabit and have children together - but maybe it should be "opt out", instead of "opt in" (as through marriage or civil partnership). Maybe there should be a cheap legal way of making the choice, so rather than a passive choice and people drifting along on trust & love only to get shat on from a great height, they'll have faced that their partner actively didn't want to make the tie.

Respectabitch · 01/11/2020 08:30

[quote Kornflake]@fridaysforfuturemum just want to say that I understand why you made all those choices re your family and deciding to stay at home. The stress of you both working and sharing chores can be enormous with young children in particular, also you do have a right to rear your own children and be with them as opposed to using childcare. This is reason enough.
Not being married has made you vulnerable (the same has happened to me). I really don't think it's unreasonable at all to try to appeal to you partner's better nature and request that he treats you as a married partner after all those years.
Don't let up, keep on at him.
I know what the law states, but he will know that to not treat you as an equal married partner would be screwing you over.
I have requested the same from my partner and want him to give me a proportion of his pension as mine has suffered greatly through working part-time. I'm willing to accept a greater equity of the house we live in as a pension "payment."
Don't let it go just because he doesn't have to "legally" treat you as an equal.
Also, surely eventually the law on this will change with the times at some point. Nothing is stopping you from taking some control back here and writing to your MP or starting a petition for a change in the law for unmarried mothers.
Make sure everyone knows what you're requesting of him and make sure everyone knows if he doesn't give it to you.[/quote]
So, stalk and harass your ex, basically?

Good luck with that. It'll get you a restraining order to add to the house equity, but it won't get you anything else, because literally all he has to say is "no". The OP's ex's pension and savings are his, legally speaking. It's that simple. If you want to be treated legally like you are married, there is a simple and cheap solution: marriage. If you opt not to get married, it's on you not to make financially suicidal decisions in your situation as unmarried partner. Dragging everyone you know into the dispute won't get you money and the moral high ground, it'll make you look bonkers.

vanillandhoney · 01/11/2020 08:31

Also, surely eventually the law on this will change with the times at some point. Nothing is stopping you from taking some control back here and writing to your MP or starting a petition for a change in the law for unmarried mothers.

There doesn't need to be a change in the law at all Hmm

If people want the rights of being married, then they can get married. But people should also be totally free to live as an unmarried couple if that's what they would prefer to do. The government has no business interfering in non-married relationships.

If you choose not to involve the law in your relationship by signing a contract, then you don't get to try and claim the benefits of said contract when your relationship goes wrong!

meditrina · 01/11/2020 08:37

I think people should be free to decide they do not want to be married or in a CP

I do not think people should be forced into marriage because of where they have chosen to live for a while.

But yes, I very much agree that there needs to be better education on this. I would make it a topic to be covered in SRE in all state schools.

(MN used to have a good page on the differences between marriage/CP and cohabitation, but it seems to have vanished)

SeasonFinale · 01/11/2020 08:41

@Saggyoldsofa

I didn't mean, use them as weapons. When they are adults it will be patently obvious to them that mum didnt get a fair share....in my experience older adults do care about such things as it makes them think less of their father (personal experience here.....). I'm suggesting she points that out to him, not threatens to tell the kids how how unreasonable daddy dearest is being right now. Also it is totally reasonable of her to point out to the ex that shafting her is actually shafting his own children, because she wont be able to fund their needs ( if that is the case).
Or it will become patently obvious that she shafted herself by not getting married and deciding not to protect herself financially
Frdd · 01/11/2020 08:46

Unfortunately op the solicitor is right.

Many many mothers have to work full time and have kids and do all the house jobs.

Why didn’t you go out to work once they were at secondary school and able to come home and b3 left for an hour or two?

ukgift2016 · 01/11/2020 08:48

OP, many women work full/part time and are still able to maintain the family home.

Nothing wrong with being a SAHM BUT only if you are married and you have protection. You have no protection as a married person and it appears little work experience/qualifications. This all could have been avoided.

I hope other ladies in this situation read this thread. This can happen to any of us. Never trust a man 100%

CayrolBaaaskin · 01/11/2020 08:48

I do think that people should be able to choose whether or not they want the legal obligations and consequences of marriage. I don’t see an issue with a system including a capital award of child maintenance though to cover where one parent has been taking care of children instead of paid work. Child maintenance is far too low and doesn’t reflect the costs of raising a child.

If the kids are in secondary though, I would say that both parents could work. I mean that as a general comment, not to be harsh to op. What’s done is done and best thing is to try to move on from it the best you can.

category12 · 01/11/2020 08:49

I think people should be free to decide they do not want to be married or in a CP
I do not think people should be forced into marriage because of where they have chosen to live for a while.

I agree, but I think there could be ways of doing this while allowing a form of common-law marriage to exist? Eg. say it became common-law marriage with attached claims on each other after cohabiting for 5 years. But if you decide to jointly sign some kind of official waiver, that would override this. Potentially you could extend it to people who would like to marry, but don't because of the legal/financial implications.

Princessposie · 01/11/2020 08:51

I’m so sorry you’re in this position OP, I’ve got friends in similar positions but they don’t think their relationship will ever end, so aren’t worried.