What to do when parent you are NC with, reaches out?

[Shefliesonherownwings]

I've posted about this a couple of times before but I need some more advice on this as my dad has been in touch and I don't know what to do next.

I'll try to be brief. I'm an only child and since I was a teen and could form my own opinions, dad and I have clashed. I find him to be controlling, suffocating, selfish, narcissitic, volatile, I could go on. I don't like the way he treats my mum or speaks to her and when I stand up to him/disagree it causes a major argument. We disagree on almost anything of any depth as I consider him racist, sexist, homophobic and so on. We have had numerous arguments and a couple of phases of not speaking but I always end up caving and going back for an easy life. However I used to dread having to see or speak to him because of how he is. He would say we've been very close, i would say we had a surface relationship only.

Last November I lost my DD to stillbirth. DH and I were and still are devestated. My dad acted appallingly, I think grief thief is the right phrase. At a time when everyone else was trying to make things better for us and support us, all he did was make things worse. He upset me hugely the day before DDs funeral and when I later told him how upset I was, he told me that all I ever do is blame him for everything. I didn't reply. A month or so later I received a very long email basically telling me how ungrateful I am, how I've made him ill, nearly caused him and my mum to split up and outlining all he's ever done for me. I didn't respond so we have been NC since December.

I've still been regularly speaking and seeing my mum but we barely mention him. I've told her I feel I am done with him as he's gone too far and I think she understands but she will never leave him, she's lived this way for 40 years. I don't want to lose her but it is hard navigating a relationship when she continued to dtay with him.

Today he sent me an email. He actually for once acknowledged he'd upset me and behaved badly and offered up a sort of apology without actually saying sorry. He said he was mostly to blame. He talked about how hard losing his grandchild was and he didn't know how to deal with it. He tells me he sent the first email by mistake, he was just putting some thoughts down and it was an accident. Much of the email is about how hard he has found things, how hard his life has been and so on. He says he doesn't expect a response but hopes I'll think a little kindlier of him now.

I should also say I am currently 31 weeks pregnant. Obviously this pregnancy has been and still is hugely nerve wracking and my anxiety is sky high. I know he knows I am pregnant, my mum told him when I had my 12 week scan. He has never acknowledged the pregnancy and still hasn't in this latest email.

I don't really know what to do and whether to respond. Part of me wants to reply and tell him all the things I am angry and hurt about and to tell him to stuff his apology and me, me, me crap and leave us alone. I have so many actual dreams at night where I lay into him and say all the things I've kept bottled up for so long. I would love to tell him how I really feel but would it achieve anything?

If we were to ever have any sort of relationship again it would never be the same as before. Dealing with just my mum has definitely been better for me but i know it's hard on her. DH is also very upset with him and wants nothing to do with him. He wouldn't allow dad in the house and thinks we should just continue to live life without him, we have more important things to think about. I agree but there is still a tiny part of me that feels bad and guilty and staying NC especially when this baby is here, even though life is better without him in it. There's still the question of how my mum would be able to visit and spend time with the baby and not him.

Sorry this was so long but I'm all over the place with it. Just wondering what others have done, if anything, in response to a NC parent reaching out? Any thoughts?

@monkeyonthetable
Great post😊more power to you✊

What Attila said. Print it out, put it on your refrigerator.
You said that receiving this email has put your head in a spin. So, it's a "No". You are spending time, energy, angst, stress over it. This can go two ways:
Ignore it...And spend a few days/weeks recovering/detoxing from reading a letter from him. Then heave a huge sigh of relief that you maintained your just boundary (and know with metaphysical certitude that next time it will be ok to not read an email from him).
Or
Respond...Even a response saying "no"... Will put you back on his radar and the drip drip erosion campaign is game on to wear you down with all the shame, diminishment, belittling, degrading, minimizing, gaslighting, insulting behavior that he has been storing up to unleash onto you. The dread of any contact will suck the joy out of your life-especially the joy that a baby can bring (sorry for you loss, and best wishes). This will undoubtedly take considerably more than a few days/weeks to recover/detox from. Who has time for that?

I don't for a second believe that the nasty email earlier in the year was sent by accident. Firstly he sent it to both my personal and work email so I'm not sure how you manage to accidentally put in 2 different emails and accidentally press send. Secondly, my mum told me he had sent it to me and it wasn't very nice and she was sorry I jad to receive it. No mention of this being a mistake or an error then. It was only afterwards that I suspect he suddenly felt he had gone too far but probably because he knew it made him look bad not because he felt bad about sending it. I've had similar emails in the past so I'm certain he meant to send it.

The more I think about it the more angry I am that he's contacted me and still made it all about him and how hard his life has been and how hard he's found losing a grandchild. Never once asking how I am, how the baby is, how are we feeling... or realising that it has been a million times harder for DH and I.

No idea if my mum knows he's sent it, she's not mentioned it and we text daily. I'll speak to her this weekend sometime so I'll see if she brings it up. If she knows about it, she will very likely ask if I've got and if I'm going to reply.

Maintain NC. You need no extra stress now or when you have a small child.
You don't like this man and you don't owe him your time now at this point with so much else on your plate. Don't give this your precious head space.

He sounds horrible BTW.

He can't tolerate you being the focus of attention, something tragic and traumatic happened in your life and instead of being sympathetic to your suffering he is jealous because it means you are the (rightful) focus of attention
That's why he has to make it all about him, he feels he should always be the most important and significant person.

he can't even admit that he sent the email on purpose, he insults you by pretending it was an accident when you both know it wasn't

I have so many actual dreams at night where I lay into him and say all the things I've kept bottled up for so long. I would love to tell him how I really feel but would it achieve anything?

Write it all down and send it to him. It might make you feel better - and it doesn't matter if it doesn't, because it can't make things any worse.

But having done that, see it as the absolute end of the matter. Stay NC, and never, ever speak to him or have any contact with him again.

It upsets you when he pops up again like this, so I think it would be best for you to make the NC totally final - then you can put him truly in the past and stop worrying about what comes next.

monkeyonthetable speaks a lot of sense.

I know that for me, if I have a text or missed call on my phone from my dad I am better off mentally when I deal with it straight away, even if it is just to say “I’m busy at the moment, I’ll text you in a couple of days”. You do also need to set appropriate boundaries with your mum. When my dad phones me and I don’t return the call, my mum used to text me to chase me up on it as she was worried about my dad being ‘upset’! I’ve now told her very firmly now to do this any more, and she has kept to it. Low contact is possible, but only if you feel that you are confident enough to be able to say No.

That's what I'm worried about with LC. That things will slip back into the old patterns. It's still so hard for me to stand up to him and say no. I spent so many years walking on eggshells, keeping quiet or pandering to him and feeling terrified when we did clash because he is so volatile. He scares me still.

Even if I tried LC I doubt he would go along with it. Previously if I didn't phone once a week, see them every 3/4 weeks I got a load of abuse. I'd be guilt tripped and emotionally blackmailed. I used to dread the contact. I know that nothing except contact on his terms would work. If I said I'll speak to you next month or I'm never coming to your house I'd get the same backlash. I've tried to walk away from the hate talk or say i don't want to talk about that, we don't agree so lets not discuss it but he still goes on about it. He just does not listen, he does what he wants, when he wants and everyone else better fall in line basically.

My in laws on the other hand are the most lovely, kind, supportive people and DH is very close with not just them and his sisters but the whole extended family. They're fab. This is another source of contention with my dad, he's super jealous of anything we do with the in laws, i basically can't mention them without him being all passive aggressive. But the fact of the matter is, they're nice, easy people and I enjoy spending time with them. With him it is such hard work. Sigh.

I am sorry to hear about your DD. I lost a DS at 22 weeks and it is devastating and life changing. I am sorry you have to walk this path.

I also have a very similar father. I first cut contact at 16 and was then dragged back in at 18. Cut contact again. And the final time we had contact was when I had my first DC. I had an almost visceral response to him being around her, I found myself ensuring he was always supervised. I became increasingly anxious and used to have something like panic attacks when he used to visit. The last straw for us was when he refused to keep his aggressive dog away from DD when she was 14 months old and when he shouted at me that the dog was far more important to him than either me or DD could ever be. He frightened DD and DH and I walked out immediately and I have only seen him at my DB’s funeral since (when he refused to acknowledge me).

If you are anxious now it will be worse when your DC is born. You need to focus on you, your baby and your DH. Everything else is noise. your father will damage this time for you and will not change. Just because this is emotional abuse does not mean it is not abuse. Don’t put yourself at risk by exposing yourself to his narcissism and toxicity.

I hope you enjoy your DC when they arrive and good luck for the remainder of your pregnancy.

OP, cut him off and cut him dead
dont let him stain your life any further

I went NC with my father 30 years ago, when I was 21. I was emotionally blackmailed to do so by my mother when he left her for another woman.

About 10 years ago he sent me a DM through Facebook - I read the first sentence, ignored the rest and blocked him. Even though my mother was wrong to do what she did, he was a pretty crap father (he never wanted kids in the first place) and had worked abroad full time for the previous 10 years before he left.

I just cannot be doing with family drama. My mother's family were large and it was just constant nonsense of people falling out with each other. I'm also in LC with my mother, and deliberately live on the other side of the world from her.

OP,
Exactly how much pain do you have to go through before you will even consider yourself?

You had a shit childhood.
Your father sounds like an absolute horror of a man.
Your mother has enabled him.

You lose your beautiful daughter, a grief that is so heartbreaking.

He sends you the most vicious self serving of emails, to you, his daughter, grappling with horrendous shock and grief.🤷‍♀️
What sane person does this?

Now months later he wants to be forgiven, and thought kindly of, with a poor me half arsed email....🙄

Exactly when are you going to think of yourself?

He is a sorry, nasty excuse of a man.
Your mother isn't much better.

Your husband is right.
Stay the hell away from him.

Hopefully you are going to have a wonderful birth, and a new baby soon.

Why in God's name would you contemplate allowing this poisonous man back into your life, soiling and destroying this wonderful time with your new baby?

You know what he's like.
Why would you put HIS needs above what's best for your longed for child?

Are you seriously going to try and convince yourself that having this horror of a man, who causes you so much stress in your life, as you deal with being a new Mum...is going to be good for your new child? Really🤦‍♀️

You need to think of what's best for your new baby.
Having this horror of a man around, causing upset with his selfish ways, is NOT what's best for your baby.

Do not reply to the email.
Do not engage at all.
Do not consider him and what he wants.
Do not discuss him with your mother.

No child needs the pig of a man that he is, as a grandfather.

As a mother I wouldn't allow a man like that within a 100 yards of my precious children.

He has been, and is, an appalling father.

He does NOT get to be a grandfather, causing you and your husband stress, by having to be in his presence.

If I was your husband, I would be so pissed off at you contemplating bringing him back into your lives, at such a special time, to inevitably spoil it.

Ignore the email and him COMPLETELY.

@noirchatsdeux

I went NC with my father 30 years ago, when I was 21. I was emotionally blackmailed to do so by my mother when he left her for another woman.

About 10 years ago he sent me a DM through Facebook - I read the first sentence, ignored the rest and blocked him. Even though my mother was wrong to do what she did, he was a pretty crap father (he never wanted kids in the first place) and had worked abroad full time for the previous 10 years before he left.

I just cannot be doing with family drama. My mother's family were large and it was just constant nonsense of people falling out with each other. I'm also in LC with my mother, and deliberately live on the other side of the world from her.

Wise call.

I have never met anyone who has loads of drama in their family and loves it.

Most find it stressful and exhausting whenever there is any drama and try to avoid it any way they can.

OP, a good long stretch of time without him polluting your headspace will allow some of the FOG to clear
you will start to see things in a proper perspective, make some sense out of the fear and confusion.
THAT is why he wont let you be, he knows (or understands at some level) that he has to keep up the constant pressure so that you cant have your own undisturbed thoughts, he knows that unless he can bend and twist everything you will begin to see through him

You poor thing .... I’m so sorry for your loss . Right now he doesn’t have to be your concern if you don’t want him to be.

Narcissists do this. They behave one way -they throw their toys out the pram when they don’t get their own way - sometimes they attempt contrition and yet again make it all about them.....

I appreciate in his head he might think he’s doing the right thing by sending you this email however he is making his thoughts your problem.
They do not have to be your problem.
You do not need to decide what to do right now.
I do not need to respond.
You do not need to decide how you feel about this.

This time in your life is absolutely categorically not about him..... just because someone says something / does something or act in a certain way - does not mean it requires a response from you....

We can’t tell you what to do my love. We can’t tell you what’s right for your mum and your relationship. And we can’t tell you what’s right for your family. All I can say is you do not need to shoulder the burden of having to deal with this if you don’t want to

I’m truly sorry again about your DD

Do not respond in any way. Delete it so you can't read it again. Block his email address.

Refuse to have any conversation with your mother that even mentions your father.

You are far too forgiving of your mum choosing him over you, again and again and again.

Look, she chose to sacrifice you so she could have a quiet life with him. Standing up for you would have meant ending it with him and she chose to sacrifice the child for the man, that's her choice. Sympathy is not what she deserves.

Remember, she will use her grandchild as a human shield just like she used you. Your dad will start on your child too. How much damage will they both have to do before you physically stop giving them access?

Get angry. At both of them. You have to be if you stand any chance of protecting your own child. Making excuses for her is no good. That's what she does for him. Don't follow her behaviour. Don't make excuses for her. As a parent, safeguarding comes first. That means blocking your dad and recognising just how dangerous your mum is.

OP, I think you have answered your own question in your last post. Stick to your NC, enjoy your pregnancy, ignore him and enjoy life xx

@Heffalooomia - thank you!

I am so sorry that you have lost your beautiful baby and for the unnecessary and exceptional emotional violence that was then inflicted by both your DPs.

Both of your DPs are monsters.

They have abused and neglected you as a child which has left you with significant emotional injuries and deficits. This alone would likely take a lifetime of recovery and healing from.

They both behaved disgustingly to you as an adult.

Their behaviour (both of them - silence is compliance wrt your DM and she is also manipulative doing his bidding) at the time of the loss of your baby is just as low as anyone in life can actually go.

There is no coming back from this.

All of this together has left you absolutely battered. They both need blocking, deleting and NC.

Your new little baby needs an attuned, focused, relaxed, gentle, happy, positive Mum. You have so many deep emotional wounds to negotiate and manage already and this will drain your finite emotional strength. You need every bit of it to be the best mother you can be to you baby. Conserve and prioritise it for your new little family - you have none spare for these two.

Even in the womb your baby needs positive hormones - not cortisol and adrenaline flooding their body.

You do not need your last trimester and your early days of motherhood polluted by this thug. Your mind does not need to be hyper vigilant worried about what he will do and say next - and you know it will be vile.

I also think that you should respect your DHs wishes in his deep grief. Your DFs Narc controlling urges and your DMs enabling manipulations do not trump your DHs broken heart.

This is one of the worst things I have read on MN in the 20 years I have been reading and posting.

Maintain NC, by sending that email he has already wormed his way into your thoughts with his toxic presence.

Completely agree with @Sssloou regarding your DM. She is complicit in the abuse you have suffered as well.
She could have protected you from him but she chose not to. She allows him to still be present in all your lives, after everything he's done.

I would continue as NC but with BOTH of them.

I know it probably sounds crazy to be thinking about any sort of relationship going forward. I am definitely still caught up in the FOG. I also cannot shake that desire to be a nice, normal, happy, supportive family but rationally I think I know that will never happen with the sort of person he is.

I'm actually pretty pissed off that he has reached out now. My anxiety is through the roof currently with this pregnancy and this isn't helping. Maybe I am being harsh but it smacks of him just thinking I want to email so I'm going to. No thought as to how I am doing or if hearing from him will cause me stress or anxiety. Yet again doing what he wants, when he wants.

I realise I haven't said it yet but I want to thank everyone for their condolences and kind words. I very much appreciate them. DH is taking me out for ice cream now to take my mind off everything.

I'm with Attila, and when people who haven't had to go NC with parents comment, please bear in mind that they will not have had the experiences you have had.

It's not like NC is a step a child takes lightly, FFS!

He hasn't changed, and please don't think one letter means he has.

Only allow future contact if you feel strong enough to deal with the man you know he is. Not the man he is now pretending to be.

And since the only way to deal with a man like him is to have very firm boundaries, which he will inevitably try to trample, chances are you would very soon be NC again anyway.