Struggling with break up , want to make it work

[lookingatthepast]

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3898601-Think-it-s-over-Messages-escorts-open-condom-Please-help

Link to previous thread. It is over. He still says he is unsure about whether the relationship is right for him. Children is the main issue and he could stay in a relationship which isn’t right for him and regret it when he’s older. Interspersed with telling me he’s sorry for everything he knows it hurts now but he thinks this is best for us both in the long run and I will meet someone else.

I am absolutely devestated. I cry most days. I have terrible anxiety waking up with a knot in my stomach feeling sick. I keep going over and over everything and I am now grieving the fact I am infertile and can’t have anymore children. I had a hysterectomy 3 years ago. I have children but it’s opened a huge wound that I am still so young and can never have another baby and it’s brought home the fact it may be a huge barrier to me meeting someone else. I loved him and he says he still loves me and cares about me and the children perhaps time and space apart is best but right now this is how he feels and he doesn’t think he will ever change his mind. I miss him so much. I am crying for the future we had talked about a house together and getting married. I am finding it hard to cope and I will be honest I have seriously thought about ending it as it’s the last thing in a huge string of things in my life. Everyone said how happy we seemed together. I just miss him terribly

And no I don’t expect HIS mates to miss me. They are his friends and family and will stand by him and his choices which I would expect. I am saying there will be other people there so I won’t be missed even by him. It’s probably for the best as being demoted from partner to mate who’s popped by is pretty humiliating whatever the reasons and I will just look like some desperate cling on if I am there even if it is because he’s invited me. He will probably make out to his friends he’s invited me to be polite or out of pity or something and they will all be laughing at me behind my back anyway . So it’s best for me I am not there

He did it before when I went and saw him on the anniversary of his mums death back in May. I was going to stay away but he said no it’s absolutely fine you coming over. I wanted to be there to support him and let him know he wasn’t alone as I know he struggles on the date. Only thing was he told his closest friend that he had tried to put me off but i just wouldn’t take no for an answer and keep hanging around. It wasn’t like that at all. He admitted he had been unkind speaking about me like that and that he finds it easier to put on a front as being a lad that admit how he’s feeling to his friends . Another friend he even joked with that he didn’t plan it very well and should have waited until lockdown was over until becoming single.

I just buried the pain of those comments and thought about those conversations of our future and him telling me and writing on Facebook that I had brought light back into his life and made him the happiest he had felt since his mum passed . I buried my pain and just tried harder to make him happy

This is a self esteem issue. Someone disrespects you & your default is to try & be nice to make them happier - people who have a better self esteem level don’t put up with that. He spoke poorly about you to his friends & said he wants to portray a “lad” image - that is a big red warning flag.

Why do you feel this guy is the best you can do? Or that you would not be better of single & focusing on your children? So much mental energy wasted on this bloke who simply isn’t worth it.

From your recent post it sounds clear he didn’t respect you & because you e laid yourself out like a platter for him, he can nibble when he feels like it & doesn’t have to commit to the meal.

He would respect you more & you would respect yourself more if you cut off contact. Your willingness to forgive his indiscretions won’t make him realise you’re the one - it just makes people lose respect for you, because you’re willing to settle for such poor treatment.

There is a saying “men love bitches” - you can’t act nice & expect people to like you because of it. It actually ends up working in reverse.

Ok can you explain why someone wanting to put on the lad front to their mates is a red flag as I don’t actually know.

And yes maybe me being willing to try harder, love harder made him lose respect for me and repulsed him. Made him think me an idiot and not someone he wants to raise a family with. You may well be right. I was born out of an affair myself which may explain why I have such issues around all of this. Being cheated on is my absolute worst nightmare lowest point but when faced with the fact it almost certainly has happened or that he came close to doing it I was so scared of losing someone I love and who said they loved me that I was prepared to bury it and hide my own pain and hope it never happened again . Yes it’s a self esteem issue and yes it’s rooted in childhood . I have the book women who love too much and a lot of it makes sense. It’s how I stop it. How I put those boundaries down and how I become more of a bitch (not in a nasty unpleasant way ) going forward . I guess if I said I always lose in one way or another the people I love then it would make a lot more sense

To me someone leaving means you don’t matter , you aren’t important , you aren’t loved , they don’t care. So you try and do things to make them stay or care or love you. Buy them things to make them happy , try and look after them. Almost mother them I suppose. If I try harder and make them happy and safe and cared for they won’t leave me. If they do leave it’s because there’s something I did wrong , something I said or did which upset them. That I drove them away. That I wasn’t good enough.

That being on my own means I am unloveable and a failure. If I was so great he would be bending over backwards to do what it takes to put right what he did wrong and to make it work.

My ex husband didn’t fight for me after we split , he chose drink and drugs over me after 16 years and being married. He turned nasty and told everyone awful lies about me after we split up and none of his family speak to me. But me keeping quiet and getting on with things has slowly revealed his true colours to a lot of people .

I suppose I just wanted to feel loved and important to someone that I loved. I genuinely loved this man and still do (although I appreciate in time this will lessen and settle )

According to your other thread he ended the relationship with you back in May nearly theee months ago. Did you get back together or what? I don’t know why you are analysing it and going over and over the same stuff.

He sounds disgusting and even though in your title you say you want it to work, he doesn’t. Whatever you are prepared to do about having children or helping him with the drugs etc, it’s pointless as he doesn’t want to be with you.

In that three months you could have stopped seeing him ‘as a friend’, cut him out of your life, however much your children supposedly love him, and started to move on.

Because someone who is truly in love & proud to be with you will speak well of you to their mates. They won’t denigrate you when yo ur e not around & speak poorly of you behind your back. They will want you around & wont be afraid to show it.

As for everything else, therapy would be wise to work through your deep rooted self esteem issues. You say cheating is your worst nightmare, but we’re willing to drop what this means to you & forgive him in order to keep him. So you were willing to drop all your values in order to be with someone - that means you have no self esteem. Because you don’t matter as much as the other person does - very unhealthy.

You’re exactly right - the nicer your are, the less people tend to respect you. Think about it - if you were not keen on a guy romantically, but he wanted to date you so kept on being “nice” - why would that make you like them more? You can’t behave your way into love, it doesn’t work like that.

Also you say you wanted him to realise his lad life isn’t as good as what you had - but with that mindset you need to be “the bitch” - tell him to get fucked, lose your number, get lost.

He doesn’t feel the loss of You, you’re still there in the background & he knows he can pick you up again anytime he likes....

You haven’t lost everyone you love. You have to your children. These victim like dramatic statements are really counterproductive to your healing. We all face loss of love. I cannot speak for your childhood & it sounds like therapy may be a good option for you, to unpack all of this.

With reference to my dad as I say I was born from an affair my mum was single and my dad was married. I had to search for him over a period of 17 years as she didn’t know his identity she had been seeing four different men all of whom were married and I was the result. Three of them knew I existed and would pop up now and then to visit for an hour here or there but the rest of the time it was just me and her as my siblings were older and had moved out. None of those men stopped to actually find out if I was there’s or not they were all happy to assume I probably was but not rock the boat too much. My actual father died when I was 15 and I never met him. He never knew I existed and never met me. I have a grave I can go and visit after I established his identity 2 years ago (around the same time I was splitting up with and instigating divorce proceedings against my ex husband)

Maybe this important piece of my background will shed light on why I feel the way I do now and why I am the way I am

It does shed light yes! That sounds very hard for a child to experience & can’t imagine what that would have been like. But undoubtedly have an effect on how you perceive relationships & men.

However our past doesn’t always have to be our cross to bear. We can reconcile childhood trauma & move forward, it is possible. This doesn’t have to define your existence. People can change, you are the way you are in this present moment, but that’s not written in stone - it could change.

I suspect what you tell yourself is a bunch of things that aren’t true. Focusing on your father role, when in reality let’s be real, Mum was the town bike & dropped the ball. Letting random blokes come in & confuse you, believing someone was your dad who wasn’t. If you were born to someone else & didn’t know your dad’s identity you may not have turned out believing the things you do.

Yes we tried to give it another go and we had a weekend away two weeks ago . We were away he said he was happy. It was actually his idea to do it not mine. We came home he said what a lovely time we had how much he loved me and how good it had been just to spend some quality time together. Two days later he text me and said he was still unsure whether this relationship was right for him or not and it would be better to talk about it face to face. He said as he had been quiet when we were away at times I should have realised something wasn’t right ! Made me feel like it was my fault. He said he didn’t love me and saw us more as friends. He then retracted that and said he didn’t mean it but thought if he was horrible to me it would make me accept it. As I say I haven’t asked us to try counselling or patch it up or anything this second time. I was blindsided by him ending it again and to be honest I would never be happy or relax as I would always be waiting for him to dump me again. I have said I won’t fight for him and I will just let him go as it’s just making me so sad. And that’s when he apologised for hurting me said he still wants to hang out and stay friends but doesn’t want any blurred boundaries or anything like that. He’s made his mind up and some time apart might do us both some good but right now that’s where he’s at . So I have left it. I haven’t phoned him once myself. He’s called me for a 5 min chat at various times saying he still cares about me and wants to make sure I am ok but that’s not the same as wanting to be in an intimate relationship with me and I do realise that. This is why I have turned here for an outlet to get my feelings out rather than my family rather than pleading with him and while I try and sort out counselling again

Sounds like he was trying on a relationship like a pair of shoes. Acting the role of a boyfriend without really feeling it. Waxing lyrical with words but didn’t feel the meaning behind them.

It good you tried again - now you know he is full of crap & can’t be trusted.

I’m sure there was lots great about your relationship & that’s why he has strung you along all this time. But make no mistake you have the power to cut this cord.

I daresay if you got herself back into the dating pool & met someone who appreciates you, you would like them & forget about this bloke. Not that I think dating straight away is necessarily a great idea, but that someone else out there could easily take your mind off him & make you see he wasn’t al that great to begin with.

My mum clearly had her own issues so to call her that is most unkind. She’s paid the price. She ended up alone and is still on her own to this day. Whatever it is she was looking for she never did find and she is now in terrible health and will most likely die with no one there but me (my siblings don’t speak to her ) so again growing up even them (and they are all male) due to their issues with her again I paid the price. I grew up and spent years wondering where they were if the remembered their little sis if they missed me hoping they would come back for me. I have contact with them now but the fact is they could have done more. They didn’t even bother with burthday or Christmas cards to their little sister. And they were grown men with homes and careers of their own and we stayed living in the same house throughout it’s not like we moved around. All I ever wanted growing up was the day they would come back and we would all sit round the table and be together again like when I was very little. That their love for me would mean they didn’t go away again. See a pattern

@vikingwife yes someone did say to me first time round get online and just get a few nice comments to boost my ego without actually dating . I don’t want to date I am not in the right place and I don’t want to be with someone else ! I just don’t want it

Yes maybe he was. Maybe he actually doesn’t know what the fuck he wants. He likes the family but but wants the lad life. Maybe I represented familiarity to him in some way. I am only 2 years older than him but I am an old mid 30s and he’s a very young early 30s . Maybe the family life and me being sensible and looking after him maybe it reminded him of what he doesn’t have at home anymore . He’s said it’s not the same at home since he moved back now his mums passed
He also said a few time’s being with my kids reminded him of growing up with his siblings. Maybe it filled a hole or a void for him. Maybe also spending time with my family and being around kids has made him think more about wanting his own and compounded those feelings. Maybe I should take it as a compliment that what I have here is what he wants for himself one day.

I will still wonder why I wasn’t enough and what drew him to calling sex workers. . Maybe it’s better I don’t know and don’t hurt myself further

And finally to answer a comment earlier he didn’t hide me away or only want me around when it suited. I was at weddings , family events of his as he was with me. Our lives were intertwined. He came here for Christmas. He father brought me a gift as did his grandmother and vice versa. New Year’s Eve myself and my children all went to his brothers with him by invite to see in the new year.

I don’t mean to be mean to your mum, it was a poor joke apologies.

You say your siblings have no relationship with your mother, but then say all you wanted growing up was for them to come back & show you they love you & be a family - it sounds like this was an unrealistic dream. It was never going to happen & it has nothing to do with you personally. The age gap being so big is significant too.... yes they could have done more, but perhaps they didn’t realise the importance you placed on them returning to play happy families? When they don’t feel like playing happy families with your mum?

Do you think all the threads here from women who have been cheated on were not enough for their partners? I’m sure you wouldn’t be this hard on someone else experiencing infidelity as you are on yourself. Cheaters will cheat, they are perpetually never happy or content. They do it because they can, for the thrill.

And all those events like weddings, Xmas, New Years - all family celebrations where a partner is often expected, or time to be playing happy families.

Especially as you say a lot of his mates have been starting to settle down & have family. Prime time to grab a partner, especially for the wonder season. Summer is a key time people want to be single, then snuggle in with a partner to keep warm during winter.

It still doesn’t detract from him telling his mates he didn’t want you around but you didn’t get the message.

@vikingwife oh no it doesn’t. We were together from dec 2018 until two weeks ago . So 20 months all in. Interesting Two of his friends who have just had kids got together just after us and even he said it was all far too rushed and quick. When we had talked about buying a place together he didn’t want to do that for 2-3 years as he felt it is an enormous committment and not one to be rushed into. All his other friends were together years before marrying then buying and then having their kids afterwards!

So In actual fact now he’s going to find it quite tricky to be going out week in week out with his mates now he’s single and living the lad life as they are all paired off and parents or about to be imminently. He’s actually now one of the only single ones

Sorry to say - He’s got tinder, he will be fine.

Again, this overthinking about his psyche suggests you feel you know him better than he knows himself. He will know why he is the way he is & why he does what he does just as you do.

As a childfree person You’re going to have a hard time of it convincing me that a single guy at age 30 is worse off because he has chosen to not commit to a single parent at this stage of life. 30 is still considered young, he likely does want a family in an abstract sort of “someday” way.

It’s normal to wait several years before committing to moving in, even with no children involved. Your lives are incompatible - you want commitment & he can’t give it.

Then all I can say is I wish he had never tried us on for size for almost 2 years when a man of that age can’t be expected to take on that role. He should never have got involved

So it’s fair to say even if I could have had kids and if in fact I had them with him he would still be seeking the buzz of encounters with sex workers or randoms and using flimsy excuses as some sort of justification

With the party thing he's throwing and invited it to you, why not tell him the real reason for not going? Why invent an excuse about a work commitment?

Tell him thanks for caring but the best thing he can do for you is allow you to move on. You're not the type who can move to being mates. I'm not sure anyone is, tbh.

But once you've said that, that you're drawing a line under the time you two had together now, block his number. Put yourself in control of looking after yourself. So much of your life seems to have been waiting for others to make your life right. Secure. Warm. Now is your chance to make a complete unit for your DC. You and them together: that's enough, isn't it? Help them to let go of this guy, otherwise they're just repeating the cycle: they'll be stuck where you were at that age, feeling let down by a man who shouldn't feel an essential part of their lives. Help them let go of him by putting him firmly in your past, for their sakes.

I am not even shocked that you are still in contact with him and hanging on to the hope that he will change his mind.

You really, really, really need to consider getting some therapy to help you deal with all of this instead of desperately clinging onto this terrible relationship. You don’t seem to have any awareness right now (or anymore) of how much damage this relationship has caused you and your DC emotionally and mentally, and how by not letting go and moving on you are continuing to allow the damage to control your thoughts and actions. It’s like an emotional self harm, you need to break free and see him for the true type of person he is and how you have had a lucky escape from a life lived like this.

It should have been over in May, not 2 weeks ago. Please do not continue to have contact with him anymore. I cannot imagine how much headspace this person is stealing from you, it is so intense the way you talk about him and detail every little thing and incident just on here, in real life it is probably consuming you. Please try to take a step back and see how much this is consuming you and how unhealthy it is. It’s actually stealing time away from your DC. Normal heartbreak is feeling sad but not feeling obsessed by it

The sex workers / cheating had nothing to do with you being able to have kids or not. You could have moved in together & had a baby & he’d still be untrustworthy.

I’m not saying someone of his age can’t be expected to settle down- but it’s hardly a surprise that a 30 yr old self confessed “lad” is stalling on committing to you & your children. You admit he seemed to have a double life & does drugs when you’re not around. I’m assuming it’s coke & he goes out partying. You don’t like drugs & he didn’t do them around you, but that is being wilfully ignorant & refusing to see what you don’t want to.

Like snoop dog said you can’t make a ho a housewife - you can’t make a lad into a live in lover.

You were fighting a losing battle working so hard to convince this bloke to stop his parting ways & settle down. What kind of impact would it have had on your kids if he did move in & came back home shitfaced with a bunch of the boys ? Not good...

I did have relationships with several dads - now I would be very cautious before considering dating a parent, sometimes you do like a person & have to date the to experience what it’s like, not every relationship needs to end in moving in/marriage - if you learn from it, then it’s arguably worthwhile.

I agree with poster who says do not invent an excuse to not turn up to his birthday - tell him that you need to take a step back & being “friends” is not feasible for you.

Yes I totally get it’s not normal healthy or right and as I say I am trying to get some sessions with the counsellor I used to see. If I can’t then I will find someone else to see and get the ball rolling. The nights are the worst as I wake up constantly and struggle to sleep so I end up going over it all and then posting here as I like I say I have no one I can really talk to about it all. I accept that and I hold my hands up . I am really trying my best and to be honest this situation is probably just the final nail in the coffin of a huge host of things spanning back to birth pretty much.

I do also have other things going for me. I keep a nice home , I am good at my job and wish to do well and progress within my profession. Academically I am a high achiever. I love my children and as they haven’t seen him in ages I have simply said due to both our work hours and lockdown we haven’t seen much of each other and have decided to stay friends and we still chat on the phone. Because of my own upbringing I didn’t want them to ever feel someone had just walked out on them
I may have got it wrong I may have done the right thing in what I said as a parent it’s a judgement call to make and this felt the best thing to say to them so they wouldn’t be upset or distressed

And yes @vikingwife I am not perfect in fact at the moment my mental state is pretty appalling I hold my hands up. However he is one bunch of fucked up . Telling people he wants the family life now we have split up. Reality is when he had the chance of something which resembled it he was too selfish and immature to know what to do with it and what a good woman looked like . Quite possibly he picked me as he thought I would be good for him and help him calm down but when faced with it he can’t / doesn’t want to