Mum has heavy bleed, due to anxiety of us visiting?

[Lickmylegs0]

Mum is very stressed, anxious - and suffers from IBS, which has flared up in the past couple of weeks. We were due to visit today, but DM phoned to say she had a heavy bleed this morning - and she thinks it’s due to her anxiety over us visiting today. I feel awful that I’ve caused her this much upset. She still wants us to go, but I just don’t know what to do! I don’t want to cause her to bleed. If I say no - she’ll also be upset.

Good lord Op, I'm sorry, but do you really believe that you have caused your mum to bleed?

You should be telling her that you will leave her to rest & to let you know how she gets on at the Drs.

I’m just angry that the anxiety of our visit - when we do our very best to placate her - has caused a ‘heavy bleed’.

It hasn't.

I have IBS and don't have "heavy bleeds" with it. If her IBS does cause heavy bleeds this needs investigating. If you visitung her causes anxiety I would just stay at home.

@TatianaBis

DM is obviously an anxious soul, the control mechanisms are to try to control her anxiety and environment. If she wants to see you nonetheless, I’d just go along with it.

But do make sure she gets further testing.

Sorry but I think that this is not fair to the OP as it places the DM in a 'aww' victim with no locus of control role, therefore op and family need to go along with her behaviour.

Omg op have you written about your mam before ? Maybe last year ? That's the thing with a controlling parent they make your life he'll because you constantly worry about them and feel guilty . I'm kind of in the same position with my mother but I can see where she got it from and that was my Nan . I have spent so many nights crying and can't sleep because I'm constantly worrying about her. You really have to put your foot down now . What ever you do is never going to be the right decision with people like this . I would just reply we won't be coming around because I don't want to make you any more anxious than you are . If you feel less anxious and want to see me just let me know but say your going to get on with your day . You need to distance yourself now . Unfortunately she will never change . But just try and make your life easier op ❤️ you can't please everyone xxx

Regardless if anything else if she actually had a 'heavy bleed' I'd be very concerned about bowel cancer or IBD / chrons.

That's if she didn't make it up...

a) Heavy bleeds need urgent investigation as it can be a sign of something far more serious than IBS.

b) I can believe in anxiety making somebody ill: my mother, who is far from controlling, can be quite unwell from the stress of an impending visit from even the most beloved person. The difference is, she would never ever tell them. I only know because I've been there when it's been other visitors expected and even then she never blames it on the visit but tries to cover up. Your mother wants you to know and feel guilty.

Does she often bleed with IBS ? just asking because I don't think IBS would cause bleeding. I'm pleased to hear she is being checked out. I don't think stress would cause a bleed so don't feel guilty in the slightest.

What is generally meant is simply that the individual is narcissistic. Many people are. Whatever. The effect on me is the same and it's a way to describe a pattern of behaviour. I specifically said she had NPD traits not that she had a personality disorder because as I said, i can't diagnose that.

She needs a doctor for the bleeding, quite aside from the anxiety. No matter what kind of bleed it is.

What would happen if you said that the detail about the heavy bleed has sent you/DP/DD into an anxiety spiral and so, for the good of their mental health, you won't visit after all? Bet there'd be an almighty tantrum. Are other people allowed to be anxious, out of interest?

Are other people allowed to be anxious, out of interest? Good question, I'd bet they aren't. In my experience with my mother, no.

As far as I know (and I have Crohns myself), while stress could lead to a stomach-ache or an episode of diarrhoea, it's very unlikely that it could cause actual bleeding, and this does need to be checked out medically. I am glad that your mother is having a blood test.

In any case, none of this is your fault, and you should not feel guilty about it. Is she always like this (it sounds as though she is to some extent) or is she particularly nervous right now because of Covid? In any case, if she really suffers from such severe anxiety that an ordinary visit from her own family members makes her feel unwell, then THAT is a fairly serious medical problem in itself; and one for which you cannot be blamed. And if she won't accept medical treatment for it, there's not much that can be done.

What does she mean by 'expecting her to do anything?' Usually this would probably mean cooking, but since you bring your own food anyway, this cannot be the case. The only other thing that I can think of, is that she regards any visit as requiring her to make the house pristine before the visitors come. Some anxious people do have that attitude to visitors, but to extend it to your own children and grandchildren is extreme.

In any case, best wishes to you all, and no, YOU haven't upset her!

I think you need to call her bluff a bit. When my mother claimed to be having a heart attack after we fell out, I offered to call her an ambulance. She got rapidly better.

I think you know that these bleeds are very unlikely to exist outside of your mother's imagination, but what would happen if you said that you were so concerned for her that you were going to call for medical help?

For today, I think I'd go with "That sounds really serious, the best thing for you to do is to go back to bed and rest. We will try again another time" and probably also offer to call a doctor. If you reward her manipulation by going to fussing over her/waiting on her hand and foot, then you will guarantee that this will continue. Offering to help her get proper medical help, but not giving her the attention she really wants might make a difference to her behaviour.

^Narcissistic personality disorder is an enduring, maladaptive pattern of thoughts and behaviors that occurs in two or more of the following areas:
Thinking Emotion Interactions with others Impulse control
This pattern of behavior and thoughts is inflexible and significantly impacts the person’s life in ways that cause the person distress. It’s not enough for the behaviors to cause problems in other people’s lives. It has to cause the person who has the disorder some distress and upset as well.^

NPD is rarely diagnosed especially in women, simply because they don’t think there’s anything wrong with them, and others are just likely to consider them eccentric, demanding or difficult. NPD is extremely difficult to treat, especially as the person gets older, so a diagnosis isn’t really much use anyway.

Most of us do have narcissistic traits, they can be quite a healthy response, they encourage us towards high self-regard.

The OP’s mother is quite clearly dysfunctional, you can see that from the behaviour of every other family member who has adapted/modified their behaviour around her. The OP is minimising her own wants and needs and magnifying those of her mother. It’s not healthy.
People who live in families with normal levels of empathy fund this very puzzling.

People who live in families with normal levels of empathy fund this very puzzling. Yes, people with "normal" families don't get it, whatever you call it, narcissistic traits, NPD, selfishness. Which is hard when it's affecting you as a family member.

Orange yes, and I think most people who do live in dysfunctional families believe that if they modify their own behaviour enough it will make everything better, they really try, just like the OP is.
Her mother is a recent widow with what sounds like really challenging health needs, it’s a very difficult situation.

Well yes, and people like the OP's mother (if she's anything like mine and she sounds it) will have brought the OP up to do exactly that. To modify behaviour to always ensure the mother is "happy" (people like this are rarely happy themselves, just massively insecure). The mother and her needs always come first. You tie yourself in knots trying to make things perfect, but it's never enough. Even if it is "enough" often then the mother will turn that into anxiety or depression, "I'm such a burden". It's exhausting.

OP, from what you've written, your mum sounds like someone who has learnt that she can control people by "being ill".

I sympathise because this is just like my mother, and she has been like this for as long as I can remember. As a small child I remember "behaving" because I thought she was going to die imminently. I went through my teenage years anxious she was going to have a mental breakdown and we would be put into foster care if we caused her any problems. Her partner died of cancer a few weeks ago and somehow she has managed to make his death about the illness that has been caused to her by him being ill (iyswim). She's 86 now and is in better health than myself or my sister.

I think that whether you go and visit your mum or not, you will be stressed and anxious; feeling guilty if you go and feeling guilty if you don't. It's a horrible position to be and you lose whatever you decide to do. Your mum on the other hand wins either way because even if you don't go she will "bank" your guilt to use in the future.

I don't really have any answers or solutions for you. Once you realise what's going on, and how you are being made to dance to another's tune it makes it a bit easier to deal with. Although I can now see more objectively how I'm being manipulated, I personally haven't been able to get rid of the OG bits of FOG. It's good to know about those things but I've never read any good advice about how to stop feeling them so sadly can't pass them on to you.

My Mum phoned today. Apparently I didn't answer the phone with a cheery enough "hello" so I had to spend the first few minutes of our ritual, weekly, hour long phone call, reassuring her that I was indeed very happy to hear from her even though we have 75% the same conversation every week and have done for countless years.

Needy parents are very wearing. I think Narc Mum is bandied about way too often on Mumsnet. But parents who need an extraordinary amount of attention and looking after and reassurance and all of that ... it's so common.

It is my pledge to my children to not burden them with my issues and to be able to function happily and independently without them. It's quite awful how many adult children are expected to to act as their parents therapists.

Thank you everyone - your comments have been very helpful. I’m completely exhausted. DM was desperate to cook for us (I repeatedly said we’d bring our own food) - so roast dinner being prepared as we arrived. As dinner being served up, she kept leaving the room to breath (as she didn’t want to breath over the dinner). Then - we went for a walk. Huge, huge issue over a potential discount for the car park. Then we’d parked 5 metres further away from her car then she would have liked...it was EVERYTHING. Even the smallest action needed a huge amount of thought, negotiation and to be done the ‘right way’.

Even disposing of a piece of rubbish is a minefield. It has to be put in a specific place, in a specific bag. I just didn’t bother asking - and out all rubbish in a bag to take home and put in our bins.

And we had to be back for a zoom meeting. She didn’t want to let us leave - and kept showing us various items in her house, and talking about their history. So we were late. And I fucking forgot to text that we arrived back safely. So now multitudes of texts/worry about if we are alright. I’m completely done.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3902065-But-we-took-you-to-Stately-Homes-May-2020-onwards-thread

When you’re ready. 💐

You could look up books about Codependency (local libraries may have some). Codependency is not just about enabling addicts, we can easily end up enabling bullies of all kinds. Until you begin to recognise what is going on in yourself, you won't be able to stop falling into the guilt and traps.