Could he be gay ?

[Underpressure13]

Earlier on, my OH was being a bit suspicious around his phone after having a nap. I showed an interest in what he was looking at- but when I got closer to his phone he leaped to grab it . Feeling very suspicious , I felt he was hiding something so leapt to see and kept hold of it. I told him to let me see what was there, saying that if he had nothing to hide he wouldn’t mind or be reacting that way . It turned into a full on wrestle - he was laughing the whole time but using all his strength to get it off me. He said’ wow you’re quite strong’ ( I wasn’t giving in) .
When I said ‘what’s on there that you can’t show me ?!’ He said something along the lines of ‘ I would rather you didn’t see anything and just keep doubting’ so I got even more suspicious then.
Anyway I managed to check a few pages as I got away from him - it was all a bit silly really . Nothing major came of that ( there was one person on Signal he claims not to know , no picture and only one message) , nothing I could really pin to anything . He has so many apps and pages it was hard to look. Afterwards, his male group chat popped up on WhatsApp ( a group of around 10 men he talks to about computers etc ) - he was saying ‘ it’s just guys , nothing going on, old friends’ I saw a few messages on it ( have in the past too) and suddenly I realised that I’ve never - in around 2 years- seen any photos of any women on there, not one. Which I find a bit strange for a group of young men. But within the conversation this last week , there are quite a few pictures of - wait for it - sausage dinners and sausages laid out on plates to look like men’s parts 🤔?! One guy had said ‘ count me in for the dic pics’ . When I said ‘ hang on a minute ...’ he said ‘ oh that’s nothing , just guys joking , it’s banter , just being stupid etc etc . I told him that I didn’t think guys usually had that content on private chat. Then I remembered that he speaks to one of them privately too and in the past has sent the 😘emoji, which I thought was odd at the time. He said that emoji is used ironically Between guys in his country ( he’s not from UK) . I just feel a bit baffled?! Am I really overthinking this ? Has lockdown turned me totally loopy? Do I have reason to think anything ? He denies it all and says I’m being super paranoid and that I should just be glad the guys don’t talk about women . If all that were true , I’d be happy that they’re just ordinary, nerdy guys talking computers and , er, sausages . Somehow though, Something doesn’t feel right .
I’m ashamed that I didn’t trust him , but his reaction was quite extreme- he was absolutely desperate to get the phone. Otherwise I wouldn’t have tried so hard.
Sorry this is long 😬

I don't think it was appropriate to wrestle his phone off him, even if he laughed about it. I think you sound quite controlling, and his sexuality is irrelevant to me, because what you've done is horrible in my opinion.

About men, and not to tar them with the same brush - their group WhatsApps are quite often foul, gross and disgusting. I work in a very male dominated industry. I was accidentally added to the group chat, and initially muted it, until weird stuff started to save in my Gallery. I then deleted myself because it was causing me to have a poor opinion of the men, young and old, family men and single, that I work with. They thought nothing of posting soft porn, graphic stuff, pictures of medical conditions, vegetables that looked like something else, and it was a clear case of oneupmanship to shock the others.

While I was shocked by that, I think physically wrestling your partners phone off him and breaching his privacy, then asking if he's gay, is more shocking and upsetting, because it's physically controlling and violent.

If my dh wrestled my phone from me I'd be considering leaving him. I have nothing on my phone that he'd be interested in I'm sure but I do have confidential work related stuff on it that he shouldn't see. Whether your dh is gay or not is another question

First of all your actions to get the phone off him are completely OTT and I hope you're having a long hard think about your actions.

Secondly - men can't bloody win can they? How many threads have there been on here of women angry because men are speaking with their mates about women. You have a group of friends joking about penises and suddenly you think your partner is gay? Really?

Can't really tell. Maybe ask him outright are you gay?!

When you’re wrestling the phone off someone, it doesn’t really matter why, your relationship is over.

This.

OP if you posted saying your husband had physically wrestled your phone off you to read your chats they'd be saying he was at best a dick and at worst abusive. And they'd be right.

You've behaved appallingly.

You've behaved appallingly.

Laying it on a bit thick there.

Wax the count me in for the dick pics comment about the sausage pics or something else?

You seem to have an instinct about him (?)

Instincts are rarely wrong. I'd keep looking wherever possible.

The no snoop brigade will weigh in - many a person has been proven correct and saved themselves by snooping.

What you've described just sounds like silliness to me. Wee boys drawing knob pictures. Some sort of secret gay whatsapp group where they send each other pictures of sausages sounds unlikely to me.

I don't think he's gay - I think probably just very immature and was embarrassed for you to see their weird banter. I'd keep an eye on things if you are suspicious though

Laying it on a bit thick there.

I think peering at someone's phone and grabbing it, wrestling to get a look at it is appalling yes. It's an unhealthy and aggressive thing to do and means the relationship is so in trouble that it should be over anyway.

If my boyfriend grabbed my phone and wrestled me to keep me from getting it back so he could look through my messages then I would be very comfortable thinking the relationship was too far gone to save. Would you be happy for a partner to do that?!

I think that this relationship sounds toxic and unhealthy if this has happened, regardless of whether her partner is up to no good or not.

Thanks to all of you who gave your advice - I’ve taken it all in and appreciate all of it .
Firstly I just want to assure you that when I said ‘ wrestle’ , it was just a description . I get that it was silly and inappropriate and yes, childish, to try to get phone - but it was his reaction which really set me off . There was absolutely no violence involved (we’re both pretty placid people normally ) . He actually admitted later on that he over- egged the ‘hiding something’ acting as he wanted to see me stew ( which I thought a bit unkind , sometimes he can get enjoyment out of silly sadistic jokes like that- possibly his humour ( not from Uk ) .
I apologised for the phone lark and told him I didn’t want to be a psycho bunny-boiling, phone grabbing partner . We have spent most of the weekend talking it over ( and other events which led to it )
For the record - now I’ve calmed down, I don’t actually think he’s gay and the chat with one of the guys is probably just that. He says that the guy is divorced with 5 children and they talk relationships . He hadn’t wanted me to see that particular chat as he had spoken about me to that guy last year when he had ( wrongly) accused me of having had an affair with a male friend . He has never met the guy , nor any of the others in the group. They are all European and share a love of computer games. That’s all I know ( oh and random photos of sausages )
The reason I was so suspicious of him was ( and sorry for the retrospective drip feed ) that a few weeks back I’d discovered that he had a female best friend he’d omitted to tell me about . I know of his other friends ( male) but not her. He mentioned her recently and I enquired a bit and slowly realised that they’re actually very close but he’d kept that quiet. I have no idea why. She lives in his country of origin ( I should add he moved to UK to live near me 1.5 years ago and is my first relationship following long marriage that ended emotionally abusively. We had known each other as friends for the 20 years prior to the move)
Anyway , I became more suspicious about her- wondered why he never rang her when I was in range but did with all the others. So I checked his chat thread to her and ,although found nothing to really alarm me, did see that they were in almost daily contact , including phone calls , very often.
I’ve spoken of this a lot with him since and he claims they’ve been friends for 20 years, old pal, get on great , share sex life stories etc ( hopefully not ours ) and he sees her as one of the guys etc. He also admitted that he speaks to her about all of his stresses , my children’s behaviour when they are around him and generally asks her advice for everything.
I’ve been feeling really sidelined , second best, weary, confused and am doubting everything . Since that episode where I checked ( and confronted him) he changed his passcode so that I can’t snoop any longer. All of this has just left me with huge question marks over our relationship , his friendship with her and his priorities. His boundaries seem extremely blurred and it’s all driven me to the episode you initially read about. I just want answers . My trust is pretty much blown out the water. Even if they really are just friends , surely that’s emotional affair territory? I’m finding it hard not to jump to conclusions on many levels . My instincts are saying somethings up somewhere .
Sorry this is so long 😬. Would appreciate anyone’s advice who can see this from an outsiders perspective . I can assure you that I’ve learnt my lesson with the phone checking - but I wonder how I can properly trust going forward .

He wrongly accused you of having an affair with a male friend??

As to the woman; what country is he from?

I've generally found that it's their wife in situations like this (guy working away from home country, regular contact with women back home).

*woman

(I'm.nor saying he'd really tell her about your kids in that case,just that he'd make something up about their contact (she's a friend and I'm getting support/venting to her).

I 100% feel that she is just a friend . I’ve known him for so long and even lived in his country myself when I was teaching in my early 20’s ( when we initially met) . He forged all of his friendship groups soon after when at Uni ( by then I was back in UK but we stayed in touch ever since ) They are in a friendship group with two other guys and all shared a house at uni .
She has a bf atm. I think he sees her as a mother figure or sister or similar - which is totally fine . I’m not interested in stopping him have / maintain his friendships ( although he hasn’t really made any new ones here in 1.5 years ) it’s just that I feel their friendship transcends what I would expect to be a normal level of contact . He seems to rely on her an awful lot and divulges / imparts wayyy too much personal information about me and my family than I feel appropriate. He just described himself as ‘open minded’ and thinks that we brits are too private about everything. Boundaries are so important to me and he seems to not mind overstepping them . I’ve made it very clear to him today that I’m really not happy with the amount and regularity that he relies On another woman . He moved countries to start a life with me , yet I feel he’s clinging on to his old single life with no responsibilities.
I’m his first proper relationship. He says he’s had many ‘ experiences’ in the last 18 years since we first met , but had never been actually with anyone long term . He’d been single ( without experiences as far as I can gather) for around 8 years before we met. He’s late 30’s. Other than the weird secretive scenarios around his phone , he is easy going , loving and very helpful , but does struggle with empathy and intimacy .

@GilbertMarkham yes , sorry, 6 months into him having moved here, he got very paranoid about me having a male friend . I was very open about what I did with said friend, but he assumed it was affair territory very quickly, went on to tell me that he doesn’t trust anyone and broke up with me the next day. I took him back after a few weeks when he came to his senses and apologised . We had invested in so much moving him to be with me ,so I wanted to give it another go .I am still friends with that guy , but he says he’s over that now . But it stung that he didn’t trust me so soon into the relationship after me putting a huge amount of trust in him to be my first relationship post bad marriage end. My own trust in him lessened a little after that . That was nearly a year ago .

There’s a fetish related to cannibalism.

Maybe he wants to arrange his sausage in a bun and have you take photos? Hold the mayo!

Frankly, it sounds like you're both best without one another. You've both obviously got trust issues and it led to things getting physical. The extra info you gave just screams bad idea.

What country?

You say he is not from the UK, could it be a cultural difference? For example, men in some countries walk round together holding hands. In the UK that would probably be perceived as them being a couple.

@MashedSpud the imagery ?!
Re that chat group , He said that some of their content and chats ( it’s mostly naff memes) are a bit odd and if that I see the thread I’ll get the wrong impression . He’s a silent member these days apparently - just likes the memes ( he even tries to create memes?! )

Yesterday whilst out shopping he decided to ‘prove’ he wasn’t gay by checking out a young woman in the carpark . He said ‘sorry, that was a bit mean but I wanted to make a point’- so any thoughts of him being gay are out of the window. I think the dic-pic comment and sausage pics threw me at the time. He has a pretty low sex drive for his age and even wonders that he may be Asexual, so those issues also made me wonder - upon seeing those pics on that thread- if I Maybe wasn’t ‘doing it for him’ . Think it’s just that he has low testosterone or something ( something we need to look at ) yes - another thing ?!

Germany . The men on the chat are all European , most have never met . He speaks almost fluent English. For those who have missed it up thread , I don’t think he’s gay anymore - got the wrong impression on that one I feel. Though it came about due to a lack of trust around his phone use and other relationship with a female friend I’ve never met ( from that country ) . That sparked off my suspicions. The gay idea feels very silly now .
He did say that he’s been out with friends at gay bars in the past in the City and he didn’t like unwanted attention from guys who’d thought he was gay .If anything I don’t think he’s as accepting as he likes to think he is - ie if there are guys kissing on a screen he turns over . I used to love watching that programme ‘ naked attraction ‘ just for a bit of a laugh , but he couldn’t bare it and got really quite cross until I turned it over . Never really understood why .

Yesterday whilst out shopping he decided to ‘prove’ he wasn’t gay by checking out a young woman in the carpark . He said ‘sorry, that was a bit mean but I wanted to make a point’- so any thoughts of him being gay are out of the window.

He might not be gay but he sure is a wanker.

I'm worried that because your last relationship was abusive your bar is set low.

He might not be abusive but he struggles with intimacy, empathy, has a history of lying and minimising, accused you of an affair when you had a close friend but we're open about it while he was doing the same and keeping it secret.

This is not a healthy relationship.

Normal people don't do stuff like this (the checking out a woman to make a point) because it's weird and nasty.

Just because you've been with a 10/10 wanker before doesn't mean you should accept being with a 7/10 wanker now.

@backseatcookers thankyou - wow your post really hit a chord and I can’t really disagree with you on any of that .
So why oh why am I going round and round with it in my head, trying to persuade myself that it’s not that bad.
I suppose if I was really honest the thought of being alone and losing that physical contact and help/ support around the home makes me worry. I’ve never been on my own ( not for the last 20 years) and am one of those people who doesn’t end things until the next person is waiting in the sidelines - not something I’m proud of - it’s been subconscious really and I’d like to believe I’m old enough to go it alone until someone comes along who truly deserves me .
You’re 100% right about not settling for a 70% wanker. I know that and I’m a good catch ( if I say so myself ) so why is my bar so low and why do I continue to make excuses for others .
I wonder if I am hugely co-dependent - probably .
Last night he showed me the male chat group again and there were some really weird things on there that he didn’t particularly want me to see- the content led me to believe that the guys are either gay and racist or homophobic and racist . I’m baffled and concerned that he wants to even be involved in that , silent or not . He says he has a warped sense of humour and just enjoys the memes as they’re politically incorrect. All of these things make me wonder more and more what we have in common as my morals and values are the opposite as far as I can gather. Why am I holding on . 20 years of history and I thought it was the fairytale I suppose

He says he has a warped sense of humour

what a bellend

He doesn't sound gay at all IMO. His behaviour is wrong though - wonder what he is hiding though? Maybe they make degrading jokes and he doesn't want you to see. They just sound like stupid jokes - I know men who send photos of their shits to eachother for 'banter'