"It's money, I earn it"

[GilbertMarkham]

This is apparently the way things are in my household/marriage.

I feel think I should know about and have input into the overall financial picture in our household.

Hid opinion is the above.

He thinks that he pays for everything, therefore that's enough/fair .. and that I have no right to know in detail or get involved in the overall finances.

He works full-time in a fairly well paid job. Part of the reason for the good pay is that he works on projects in London, which (before lockdown) required fortnightly stays overnight or two nights there while I obviously look after DD alone. He'll return to this when able.

I have been working two or three days a week for a while. My hours are limited by drop off and pick up times for nursery, as my work is an hour away. The money I made doing this (before lockdown) didn't really have an impact. By the time unpaid travel expenses etc. If was mainly to get me back into work after maternity. We have one DD. We moved from where we were living when our DD was about 4 months as we weren't cooing without support from family (and also it was difficult to get in the housing ladder where we were).

He pays for everything, including the low mortgage on a house I own from before we married if it's not rented out.

My view is that since we had a child, his salary is family/household money, not "his" money. I can't work full-time as I look after DD two/three days, do 90% of drop.offs and pickups on the days I was working. Stay off 100% of the time off for illness, do 99% of appointments, and do the overnights mentioned above.

I don't think most people in a marriage would feel happy or invested with his attitude. He thinks it's fine because he pays for everything he should - but it's still very much his money.

He also said he didn't want me/I didn't have s right UK make him give details and justify what he spends on what .. probably because I'm more frugal on average than he is and he knows I might be critical/frustrated.

OP, near enough no woman wants to, unfortunately most of us don't have the choice

I appreciate anyone who can afford to not do so is fortunate, however I disagree that near enough no woman prefers to outsource childcare and work. The simple reason being that I know several women (and have heard others online etc) say they prefer to work part-time or full-time in order to get a break, keep their sanity, because they don't enjoy doing full-time childcare etc.

It is pretty much mpossible not to "drip feed" in s thread ranging over so much stuff. You are forced to cut things down to bare bones or focus on one thing or a few things. Then posters question and you have to fill things out or clarify or say "no not really, because ...".

I imagine you consider yourself intelligent so I don't know why I'd have to explain this.

It happens in nearly every fkg thread

All the pp telling you to work full time? Why this obsession. They are married. They have enough money to enable op to work part time which is just as well as she can't work full time as he is simply not there for nursery pick ups etc. And in any case, she has the reasonable desire to spend time with her dc.

Nobody is telling her to work FT but she is complaining that his money is his and wants more control with finances, even though he gives her money every month so people are saying that if she wants this she has the option to work FT, she can't have it both ways.
It's great that they have enough money to enable her to work PT, I'm sure most women would rather spend time with their child in this position, I did when our DD was born, my partner worked away so made enough for us both, but I was never complaining about how unfair it is was or I wanted more control. I am SE so went back in to work PT when she was 8 months and back to FT when she was 2. It was hard, of course I never wanted to put her in to childcare but me, like many other mothers, wanted a bit of independence again. My partner was amazing and helpful but I still always wanted my own independent work

maybe you should give your DH some credit for that and realise why it's possible for you to do that

And the flip side to that is that I make it possible for him to do that!!

And if you think he'd give up his salary, his career progression, his ambition, his status etc ... If I said "I want to work full-time him, you can go part-time or get a different job, we can move into to my little cheap house, we'll manage" etc. ....you are in cloud fkg cuckoo land. He never ever would.

Not one in a thousand of them would.

I did when our DD was born, my partner worked away so made enough for us both, but I was never complaining about how unfair it is was or I wanted more control.

Did he question how you'd spent your allowance, when you responded (with as much accuracy as you could, how) and said he wasn't frugal himself and pointed out that you didn't even know the overall picture of the the incomings and outgoings; did he respond;

"No, it's my money, I earn it".

???

@GilbertMarkham why would he need to give up his job? You could work FT, childcare would cover the hours both of you are working plus if neither of you were finished for pick up time, a childminder would be. People make it work, myself and many other mothers do.

That's also not the issue, yes you do the childcare while he works FT, but he is not the one complaining about it, you are. It would be a big adjustment if you were to start working FT, but there's no reason it couldn't work

It just sounds quite ungracious...if we aren’t grateful for what we have, it’s hard to ever feel satisfied.

you admit you want to not work FT which is 100% understandable. But you also want your husband to be grateful you are not working FT. I think you should both be grateful for each other’s role in a healthy relationship.

It sounds like there is underlying contempt here...contempt kills relationships.

Does your husband minimise what you do at home caring for your daughter & keeping house ? Does he flippantly tell you to go to work if you complain about money ? You have not said he does, so I can’t tell if he is ungracious towards you...maybe he is, maybe he isn’t... but no sex + resentment + money disagreements does not look good...

You haven’t answered if you see your investment property as a marital asset & half his ? How many months has he paid the mortgage on it ? Not “occasions” as you count them but months ? You seem happy to take credit, what credit do you give him for providing you with a financially easy life ?

I agree it is so hard to summarise your life in one post, so drip feeds are inevitable. We can only advise on the internet based on information provided...

Did he question how you'd spent your allowance, when you responded (with as much accuracy as you could, how) and said he wasn't frugal himself and pointed out that you didn't even know the overall picture of the the incomings and outgoings; did he respond;

No, it's my money, I earn it".

You said earlier that he only questions it if you then ask for more, not with the initial amount that he gives you which he must see as plenty. You said yourself you don't think he's left with much spare after bills etc, so he could be wondering why he needs to give you more when he's not left with much himself, I don't think he's unreasonable with that.

No he never responded that because he never had to, I never asked what he spent his money on, he did earn it so it was his money. when I decided I wanted financial independence and control over my own money I went back to work FT

My XH did actually, he walked out on his very highly paid job when I had my first DD (six weeks maternity I had with her) because he wanted to be with the baby, then waltzed off to another highly paid job when she was 9 months old because - surprise, surprise - he couldn't cope with her. This pattern repeated for years. Muggins here just worked full-time, solidly throughout, taking 6 weeks for each subsequent baby as well - set up own business, worked from home, worked late at night, weekends etc.

Basically I felt I had to do this because he showed himself as not a team-player. I was the team, with occasional input from him.

I divorced him when the youngest was 19, I basically gave him a flat we owned and I chose to keep everything else. He knew he had no legs to stand on.

Overall the approach worked financially but it was a lonely old slog. If I had my time again, that inability of his to work as a team, which I noted from the start, would have seen me leaving him before we even got married.

I imagine you consider yourself intelligent so I don't know why I'd have to explain this.

If you don't feel like continuing to contribute, please do feel free to concentrate your wisdom on other threads - please.

Where were you when punctuation was being taught in English - out the back of the bike sheds, sniffing glue?

You must also have missed reading comprehension class because I stated a solicitor said he might get 25% of the property I owned before marriage, not 50%.

OP I've been massively on the same page as you on many threads so this isn't coming from a bad place but you are being so incredibly rude to posters.

You know how MN works, you know people will share strong opinions and challenge your thinking.

Saying stuff like the above just displays a really bad attitude and sounds spiteful.

I understand you're really angry about your situation but this is a public, anonymous forum and people are replying to what you've shared - of course they don't know the full picture.

And I'm sure most people do read the thread through, but there's a lot of information and you seem so defensive and angry if anyone challenges you - you pick up on a small thing they've got wrong / you think they've misconstrued and focus on that.

I think it would benefit you to have some counselling for a while so that you can work through some of this anger and get a plan together for what you want to do when it comes to work and your relationship.

At the moment it feels like you're on the edge of breaking point (I am of course just basing that on the thread as I don't know you) and so snapping at everything and that can't be a nice atmosphere for any of you to live in at home.

So I work long hours and can’t do drop off and pick up is a man line. What happens to single WOMEN who work long hours? How come they manage? What would happen if, god forbid, you died, eih?

HE CHOOSES NOT TO DO PICK UPS AND DROP OFFS.

And if you divorced and he wouldn’t have her, his own daughter, 50:50 then he’s not a good father. Not remotely. No matter how ‘involved’ he pretends to be for the 40 mins a day he’s probably home.

Also, to give you a counter example, that it IS possible to work crazy hours and do childcare and housework- DH managed to do all of the above when he was a junior doctor. (But actually earned less than me but worked much longer hours). And has also given up career opportunities for ME even though I now earn less than he does. (He became a consultant and I had to take a step back as for a while we had a sick child- I am slowly working myself back to where I was).
It’s called equality and the vast majority of men who chose not to see their wives and what they do as being equal to them are misogynistic arseholes. Who don’t deserve a medal for loading the odd dishwasher and looking after their own children on a Saturday morning.

I agree with Backseat.

OP it's entirely up to you what you choose to post and who you reply to, but you do seem to be very focused on arguing with everyone who is criticising and disagreeing with you, which is just leading to a lot of repetition and what sounds like frustration - can I suggest that you focus on the points you find helpful and try to ignore the people who have clearly misread, missed the point or are just plain unhelpful?

"Cab told me 415.93 for two nights. Not sure where the difference is coming from there."

I actually work for Citizens Advice I don't usually mention it as anyone can say anything on here can't they. But I did share the link to the child maintenance calculator on gov.uk, that's what I used to work it out. Try it yourself.
I can't explain why you were told a different amount before - they can only go on the information you give them so perhaps it was different then (different salary and/or number of overnights) or perhaps they just got it wrong, it happens sometimes. I did make an assumption that neither you nor your husband have any other children and that would affect it too.

Anyway, there has been a lot of discussion of various details on this thread, but that's not really the point. The fact is that there are quite a few issues in your relationship, there's a backstory including a few incidents that have caused a loss of love, respect and trust, and I don't think the two of you are loving equals atm, or anywhere near. You seem to have a lot of anger about it which is understandable - some seems to be directed towards posters who are criticising you, but the person you are probably angry with is him. I've said that I think he's abusive but you've completely ignored that so perhaps you disagree or don't want to discuss it. I actually think you should probably just LTB but something seems to be holding you back (finances?) and you don't seem to want to discuss that either. The only other thing I can suggest is counselling for yourself. I guess if you don't think he is abusive then you might consider couple's counselling, it would need to be a very good counsellor though and there's no chance of success unlike you both engage (I suspect you would but he might not). Otherwise if I'm right and he is abusive then couple's counselling would not be recommended even if he did agree to it.

*Where were you when punctuation was being taught in English - out the back of the bike sheds, sniffing glue?

You must also have missed reading comprehension class because I stated a solicitor said he might get 25% of the property I owned before marriage, not 50%.*

Ah yes this was to the poster who posted one long unhinged sounding rant with hahahahahahahaha!!!!! In the middle of it, lsayjng she found my stupidity amusing - that my DH would take 50% of anything, and that child support wouldn't cover my nursery feed.

If you want to give it out; be prepared to take it back.

*fees

@BackseatCookers thank you for compiling the comments. It paints the OP as being quite judgemental.

The investment property sat empty for 6 months because the OP is judgemental towards people in their 20s & assumed they would make big party & ruin her property. This is not being frugal - she was fine with husband covering the mortgage on this & other “occasions” as she phrases it. (I would argue an occasion is each month personally). She is criticising the husband for not being as financially responsible as herself - however the action of leaving the home empty & then renting it below market value (albeit to a relative) does not speak to her frugality. She has minimised the husband paying the “small mortgage” on this investment - without him, the house would have had to be sold, or rented to the 20-something undesirables she wanted to avoid.

What’s mine is mine, what’s yours is mine. This attitude will kill the relationship. She has not answered the question as to whether she had access to bank statements or not - if yes, then she does in fact have an idea of ingoings vs outgoings.

I feel the op sounds quite controlling IMO & wants to control the husband’s view of money. She wants to work PT and also be thanked for it. This way of thinking is warped and will never lead to being content in life.

Maybe the OP has anxiety & this is why she is stressed about not knowing where every cent goes ? She has already said she does not think he is spending it on bad things (like brothels or gambling etc)

You know how MN works, you know people will share strong opinions and challenge your thinking.

That's not what the above us, not the other posts I responded to "robustly".

I get the feeling it's more important for you to be right than to be happy, it's such a shame because you are just lashing out all the time which makes it impossible for people to help really.

If you want to give it out; be prepared to take it back.

Indeed.

Good luck, I honestly think counselling is so important because your anger levels are simmering all the time and it cant be good for you. It's a horrible feeling when you're anxious and resentful at home, I understand that, so you need to work on ways of tackling that.

unless you both engage

Go back to work full time. He can pay for half the childcare.

I'm so sorry you've discovered your husband is a total wanker . For perspective, I earn 30% more than my husband. I make him pay 80% of his net salary into the joint account each month, and I do the same. We both have access and use that for day to day spending. The balance on our personal accounts is for gifts for each other or personal treats. I am quitting work later this year to spend time looking after our three kids, and the only change is that he will commit more than 80% and I will commit all my savings. I manage all finances and bills for us and always have.

you are just lashing out all the time

No I'm not, I've had perfectly civil interactions with people who've been civil and moderate.

If I left those who are not unanswered, I'd be accused of ignoring what I don't want to hear. If I respond in kind, I'm lashing out and wasting my time arguing.

*I forgot to add, sometimes the students are actually worse, occasionally they're ok.