No sex for over 4 years is this normal

[Never2L8]

Never2L8

Is over 4 years without sex normal?
I found this site by accident. Searching through the internet trying to find the answers to life and found a post on here by a woman asking the same thing.
I realise this is an almost exclusively female site but want a woman’s perspective.
We’ve been married 20 years together 25. 3 kids oldest is 17 youngest 13.
Our relationship has been very good in the past. Sex fun intimate but not always easy. Raising 3 kids is hard earning a living and paying taxes.
Sex slowed down over the years. More her than me. Well all her actually, I always find her sexually attractive and beautiful.
She said she just wasn’t as interested in sex.
We still had sex once a month then sometimes less.
I started a new job which required lots of travelling but it we decided it would be better to have the money while we could.
Things were alright for a year or 2 then the sex just stopped.
I didn’t want to push as I knew it was difficult looking after the kids with me away so much.
2 years ago I changed jobs again and now I’m home all the time. Still no interest from her. Also now no intimacy.
She doesn’t want to spend time alone together. Wants to go out on her one with her friends.
I don’t no what to do. Sex is important to me but equally so is intimacy. She and our family are everything for me but it’s tearing me apart. She moved into the spare bedroom last year.
If she doesn’t want to talk or work things out should I give up and suggest a divorce?
The idea of living in a sexless marriage for the rest of my life seems grim.
Any thoughts?

My sympathies OP. My wife is the same.

Despite my MANY attempts on all levels of our relationship to reconnect, my wife has rejected and ceased ALL intimacy and sex. She too moved into the spare room without discussion.

IMHO the only thing that really defines a married partner as opposed to anyone else (unless pre-agreed) is the intimacies, physical contact and sex that you share. Without that, you are nothing more than friends who ‘get along’, or housemates with shared responsibilities for chores, obligations to pay bills and co-parents.

But kids complicate things. I am very unhappy and do not want a life like this. However, I also believe kids need both parents and as me and my wife are perfectly amicable in all other regards, I don’t want to hurt my kids in that way. Like many, money is also a major factor, as there simply isn’t enough of it to split on all but desperation terms.
Therefore, I stay, at least until the kids are past 18 and the mortgage is paid. After that, we’ll see.

I know some see that as a sacrifice too far and believe that it some how sets a bad example to your kids, but in our case, I think they still see us as connected, even if below the surface we are not.

And before anyone here suggests otherwise, I have pulled my weight, helped with childcare, not just been a Disneyland dad, complemented her, been nice, tried every approach from not mentioning sex for months, through to trying to spice things up, and all the while offering clear opportunities to talk to me and explain her needs or tell me if it’s me who’s done / doing something wrong. In other words, she’s had AMPLE opportunity to say she’s not interested in me because I haven’t done the dishes, folded the washing right, coughed at the wrong time or worn the wrong coloured pants…

As another poster has said, I think she like the paycheque and security, but saw intimacy and sex as a build-up to making babies and now doesn’t see the point. She seems content to live like this and ignore my feelings, because a) that’s the way SHE wants it, and b) probably thinks that the other things she does / her share of the chores makes up for it.

In direct answer to your question, it’s not over so long as you’re still there – anything might happen – but I suggest you at least mentally plan for a future without her in your life.

More than anything else though, a refusal to TALK automatically leaves that person 100% in the wrong. Period.

Clearly she has checked out.

You're going to have to try to put yourself in her shoes if you can. I've noticed that many men can't seem to see things from someone's perspective.

There are probably lots of things to fix before the sex comes back. Men tend to mostly be concerned with the sex and if they are happy with that, that's all that matters.

First thing is notice things around the house that need to be done and just do them. Take the load off of your wife.
Make her breakfast in bed or a nice meal a couple times a week.

Get some wine and sit down and just talk about anything and everything. Really try to connect. Card and board games are good for this too.

Look deeply into her eyes and tell her how much she means to you and hug her. No, don't suddenly expect sex. Just appreciate and warmly hug and leave it at that for now.
Women hate to be pestered for sex. Sometimes we just want to cuddle and watch a movie and eat popcorn with you.

IOW be her knight in shining armour. Whoo your lady.

Things have been bad for a long time and you have to be in this for the long haul as you can't jus do it a couple times and say where's my sex and go back to how things were.

So give it a try and see how it goes. You don't have anything to lose at this point.

She’s being extremely mean in emotionally abusing you, not talking about it and make it appear to be all your fault.

She sounds like a freeloader

Sounds as though she has already checked out of the relationship.

Can I ask how her behaviour is towards you?

Many men in your position just wait till the kids go to college/uni, then they're off.

At this stage, you don't have a bitter Ex messing you about with seeing the kids as they're now old enough to have their own relationship with you and have direct contact.

Its not something everyone is prepared to do, because age is a consideration and the desire to develop a meaningful relationship with a woman who actually is interested in you.

Your current situation can lead affect your mental health and wellbeing, because it is something of a knock.

I also agree with a couple of pp which spoke about sex with a man who is only interested in his own satisfaction. It's painful and soul destroying...like you aren't worth satisfy. Yet such men seem confused when you aren't interested in sex with them. Why would you be.

Sounds like she's checked out already. Sounds like she harbours resentment, for whatever reason, and is finding it hard to have sex with someone who is not her friend.

Thanks everyone for your responses.
Many great points for me to consider, many which I already have.
I try to be a good husband, friend, lover, provider and I’m sure I’m far from perfect. I’ve always helped in the kitchen either cleaning up or cooking. I always have made her a cup of tea in the morning, but I must admit not alway lately last couple of months when things have gotten worse. Mostly I still do.
I don’t buy presents and flowers much at the moment as they are often ignored.
I was the main bread winner while the kids were young but more resentful it’s equal. This is after things have gotten worse and a long time after the sex stopped.
In her defence she is not a free loader. Has always worked hard like I have. Although I think she liked the security of my salary when I had the job with lots of traveling. I did earn more than the 2 of us earn now.
But the money was all spent.
We have a nice house with a nice extension. We also had a cleaner to help.
Now I split much of the chores and kids. I take them to school most days and make their lunches.
I have tried to just cuddle, talk, watch TV together etc. But felt rebuffed. She would always chose a seat that wasn’t next to me or didn’t have the opportunity for me to sit next to her.
I always used to cuddle or hug or touch and in a non sexual way. This was done out of love not because I wanted sex.
She stopped wearing her wedding ring a couple of years ago. Said she was going to clean it. But never wore it again.
I have thought she might have had an affair. More likely a one night stand or short affair maybe more than one.
But no proof just little unnecessary lies and things that don’t add up.
Guarding her fone, lock on her gone when she never did before. I’ve had one as often left it around at work but she new it.
More text messages. Using Whatsapp when she didn’t before, then hiding her status and notifications.
But I’ve got to trust her and what am I going to do hire a private investigator?
I guess part of the problem for both of us is that it’s gone on for so long.
I’ve run out of patience.
I know she would like to give up work. She won’t admit it openly to me but I can tell.
But what can I do. We could downsize and live quite well and I could work locally. She doesn’t want to down size. I could try to find another higher paying job but in my field that requires a lot of travel and I no longer want to.
I have digressed and gotten a bit long winded. Sorry
The thing is the sex and intimacy problem started before all of this. It’s just gone on so long we’ve developed new problems which have probably masked the old issues.
I do understand it’s something we both need to work on. I could turn around as has been said and just become the perfect loving husband and give her everything. But is it to late and would I just be taken advantage of now.
Our marriage counsellor said we have to both decide if we wanted to be married. She felt that my W was not interested in talking.
But at the end of the day I really hate idea of ending our marriage. 25years is so hard to let go. Would I doing it just for sex? No I don’t think so.

Oh reading that she stopped wearing her wedding ring a couple of years ago made me very sad. I'm afraid it sounds like your marriage ended a long time ago. I'm really sorry. You can give it one last push if you wish so that you can say you've really tried. But it's not sounding good at all.

Sorry Op. I really feel for you. I'm gonna say what I feel... I think she is cheating on you, if not physically, mentally. You love her but I doubt she feels the same. I'm sure u look sad, unhappy and she isn't even talking in therapy?? Maybe she is just waiting until the kids are older. Op, life is too short... I think you need to put Ur cards on the table and get to the bottom of what's going on with her. Either u Sort things out or each of u do their own thing....

She wants to stop working, eh?
Do please explain to me how in the supposedly equality days we aspire to living to nowadays that is even something worth considering.

I too would like to give up work and ponce off someone else who’s emotionally compelled to let me but I won’t because I’m not an arsehole.

She is a leech. Pour on the vinegar.

Unless she has serious health issues I wouldn't be looking for another job with lots of travel that you don't want to do so she can quit work.

If she's not willing to even talk I think you're options are put up with it and build the life you want. Hobby, friends, invest in time with DC. Or split up. There's not really many options if she won't even talk.
Maybe some individual counselling would help you deal with your hurt and work out where you want to go from here and if there's anything left untried to do if you want to save the relationship. But based on what you've written I don't think she'll respond to any amount of kindness. If my dp stepped up and started doing anything close to what you're doing it would take a little whike for me to be sure it wasn't a trick, but it would go a long way to fixing things.

I’ve been surfing and scrolling around in mumsnet and saw a post by a woman about her husband titled “ I love you but I’m not in love with you “
I remembered during one of my discussions with my W she used the same words...
Not Long before she moved into the spare bedroom.
She didn’t say a lot more than that. When we talked more recently her answers are are usually I don’t know what I want.
And then another month or 2 pass of cohabitation.

It was already sounding bad, but your update on the wedding ring and changes in phone use put the seal on it.

I agree that she’s almost certainly had an affair or several ONS and has checked out of the marriage. She’s now just waiting for you to be the “bad guy” (by making things so shit that you instigate the divorce) because she’s either too chickenshit to do it herself or because she’s content to sustain her lifestyle in the extended house with a dual income.

You will be a lot happier in the long run by divorcing her. Whether you want to make the effort to uncover her cheating is up to you, but either way I think you need to end this for your longer term mental well-being (and that of your DC)

I agree with PaterPower - she checked out years ago, but is comfortable living like brother and sister, since you don't make waves and her lifestyle suits her at the moment. If you want to keep things like this for the sake of the children, go ahead, but I'd bet on her suddenly deciding to leave if she gets an offer which suits her.

To be honest, she has a great life now - she is having her cake and eating it. Her suggestion that she'd like to give up work, would make things perfect .

The best thing for you is to lawyer up and get a divorce planned. Otherwise you'll end up being totally taken for granted and she'll leave you anyway. Good luck OP.

She moved into the spare bedroom last year.

and

I don’t buy presents and flowers much at the moment as they are often ignored.

and

She stopped wearing her wedding ring a couple of years ago. Said she was going to clean it. But never wore it again.

Sorry @Never2L8 but, whilst you are still under the same roof, she has checked out of your marriage.

She may not be communicating verbally but her actions speak loud and clear.

I get that you have invested 25 years in this relationship but do you think you can go on longer in this situation as it currently stands?

I don't think staying because of the children is the answer. They will already know (as it's very clear from her actions, and then atmosphere must often be tense) that your marriage is not working, and be worried about it.

I think, hard is it will be, you need to make the decision to physically separate with as little animosity as possible. Look for another suitable property for you where your children can also stay when they want. Get your ducks in a row/finances sorted/check out maintenance for the children.

If necessary get legal advice before you have the next big conversation with your wife about living completely separate lives in different locations with the possibility of divorce. This stagnant situation is no good for any of you.

Best wishes OP.

Oh wow...your wife's description was basically me. I took off my ring...went out with friends to escape, separate rooms, definitely no sex.
Taking off the ring is a certain check out of the relationship. You are separated but living in the same house doing family things. It's difficult to cut from the comfortable life and routine you are used to with the kids. Change is scary. I'm sorry op....but I'm sure she still loves and cares for you but not in the same way as she used to. People change unfortunately....and they can't voice it to partners as either they don't want to hurt them, or they want to have the best of both worlds! I don't think she's the latter, but you do need to talk and say you can't go on in a non existent marriage.

Whyowhy- she moved into the spare room after I found out she had lied to me. Told me she was going one plaice but was actually meeting up with a male friend for a coffee. Not someone I knew. This happened not long after I changed jobs and didn’t travel any more. She told me she had been at a female friends house when actually she had met someone else (male) for coffee. I only found out by chance. A friend mentioned they had seen my W.
I asked her where she was she told me a story I then said I knew that wasn’t true. Then admitted it was just the parent of a friend of one of our ds. Said they had only met once by accident.
My friend works near the coffee shop and had said he had seen her there a couple of times he thought with the same guy.
She admitted to having met twice but had forgotten. Only for a coffee.

Strange how now after all this time I start writing this down how obvious it all seems. I’ve isolated everything in my head. And looked at everything separately, not connected the dots. Or maybe haven’t wanted to out loud.
It’s been over for years I’ve just kept my blinkers on and trudged along.
No one to blame but myself.

It's often difficult to see how a situation truly is when you are still actually in it, invested, caring, trying to recover something you both had, still caring for the person, trying to do the best you can.

Good luck with your next steps OP. 🌹

Harsh truth, it's your fault she's not attracted to you anymore . Maybe it'll come back if you sort yourself out.

Work on yourself, not her. Get in shape, get the wardrobe updated, stop placating her/being nice and be more fun. No whining, no butt hurt, no being over sensitive, take control of you and your life. Your wife might not respond, but everyone else around you will, which will amplify how good you feel about yourself. Sure, you need to be nice, but be awesome first.

Worst case scenario is it ends and you've already got yourself in order to be happy and meet other people.

I know this, because it happened to me. It was too late for my marriage, but life is great once again, and I'm only dependent on how I feel about myself, which makes me way more attractive and fun to be around.

Sorry sounds awfully like an affair.

Now you have your suspicions make sure you carefully collect the evidence and while you are doing it then practice the 180 (search for 'relationship 180'). You may also secretly want to get some initial consultations with some lawyers so you know where you stand.

Once you know enough you can the decide what is your best course of action.

I was shocked at many of the responses. Most of which I didn't agree with.

But your latest update of no wedding ring, WhatsApp etc, changes everything and sounds like an affair.

LTB. For your own sanity.

It's very sad op but she doesn't want to be with any more. Perhaps she is hoping you will leave if she freezes you out enough. I think separation is the only solution here, sorry. In some ways I am like your wife. We haven't had sex for a couple of years and if we had a spare room I would move into it. In my case my dh has let me down so many times in so many different ways (not infidelity) that I just cannot bear to be close to him any more. We can't afford to run two households (he has made some terrible financial decisions over the years). We just co-parent and get along quite well. I live in hope of him meeting someone else and moving out. I don't hate him, i probably still love him in a way, but the connection we had that made us a couple is gone. I think you need to lay your cards on the table, let your wife know what you want, if she doesn't want the same thing you need to move on with your life, sad though that is.

I see a couple of posts here suggesting "do more chores and help out with the kids, that will make her want sex again" and "cuddle her without expectation of sex, that will make her want sex again". No. These can't hurt and are good things in themselves, but they won't make her want sex again. That ship has sailed.