How to handle my mother undermining my parenting

[crispysausagerolls]

My mother and I are close, and see each other almost every day. However, she has recently really started to overstep the mark where DS is concerned. He is EBF (6 months) and I found out she keeps formula at her place in case she needs to feed him! Without asking or discussing with me. If I do anything in front of her she always corrects me “God crispy, dab his nose don’t wipe it, poor baby!”, and deliberately ignores and argues with what i ask her eg she insisted DS could have watered down juice when sick, which i agreed to, and then she gave him pure juice! When I explained I wasn’t fine with that she said “you had it and we’re fine” and became extremely stroppy. Everything I read or hear that she doesn’t agree with is “nonsense”’and is ridiculed, like the dangers of babywalkers. I am constantly told I have “made a rod for my own back” whilst rocking DS to sleep, which is extremely unhelpful. Many, many other things like this.

I’ve tried talking to her but she gets extremely defensive and unpleasant and says she isn’t doing anything, but I’m sure I’m not being sensitive as my husband has also been there for some of it and also thinks it’s not on.

It looks like she doesn’t like girls. My mother was the same.

Not to say my brothers weren’t in their own hell with her, but she saved a special lot of viciousness just for me. My sil’s are also hated.

I did see a therapist about it some time ago and it helped me deal with it. Of course what I’m describing was extremely traumatising and I suffered somewhat with low self esteem for a while (my father is a very bad man to be honest and an even worse parent which did not help either) however I am now in a wonderful place emotionally (and have been for a while) with a great husband, baby and life and I feel able to empathise with my mother’s own demons and try to see that she has made a lot of mistakes but done a lot of good too. It’s complicated. Sometimes it is easier to paper over the cracks for day to day living.

Having said all that, she just popped round now out of the blue, said she felt like being summoned to see the headmaster and then we had 20 mins of small talk before she left. I am very embarrassed that I was too cowardly to bring it up but I felt a bit ambushed and wasn’t really sure what to say. And she didn’t bring it up either. I suppose I would just like, at the very least, her to acknowledge somewhat her behaviour around DS but mostly I suppose to at least ask my SIL to get a job so they can pay more rent/get my other brother to stop making plans for holidays etc until he pays back some of what he owes her. I just need some sort of gesture I think to show that I am not a bloody idiot.

aussiebean

I think she just needs validation and approval from my brothers, but not from me. Because they are men as you say.

I’m sorry to hear about your mother x

I just need some sort of gesture I think to show that I am not a bloody idiot.

I hate to say that I think you will be waiting a very long time for such a gesture....

I think the gesture you seek is your middle finger. If not to her face, then mentally. Your life has no need for someone who makes you feel so shit about yourself.
Dm or not.

Oof OP, your last update changes things.

I have a tricky parent and I have found that being absolutely honest at all times and at the time of the poisoned barb really helps. So the wiping nose thing - 'You're making me feel like a child.' The juice thing 'I feel like you're not listening to me'. The rod for own back thing 'It feels like you don't think I'm capable of parenting my own child.' It is honestly very effortful but actually gets the parent to listen and treat you like a person who is separate from them.

However, let's be honest, low contact would probably better (in my case too, but I can't bring myself to do it).

crispy

re your comment:-

"Sometimes it is easier to paper over the cracks for day to day living"

But it really is not. Appeasing and otherwise being meek never works with people like your mother; they see that as weakness. If you do want to give her a gesture other than the middle finger then lowering contact levels with her would be a decisive step in that direction.

The cracks still appear through the gaps because the cracks are never filled in. She does not want to fill those in and she is quite happy as she is. She was not a good parent to you when you were growing up and chose a man too who is like her in that he is abusive too. She must not be given any influence over your DC here.
It is not your fault she is like this and you did not make her that way.

Papering over the cracks as you have done is exhausting in its own right. If you do want a quiet life you are really going to have to lower further all forms of contact with your mother. Any talk you have with her will not go well for you because she will continue to deny and or minimise what has happened to you. She does not do boundaries (I see she has turned up unannounced again) and will not respect any that you care to set her.

Further therapy is something I would seriously consider now. I think you are still mired in fear, obligation and guilt and this needs further tackling with a therapist.

She will never give you the approval that you so still want from her and ultimately you are going to have to let go on any hope of at all having a functional relationship with her. Its never been functional, infact its codependency. She taught you how to become codependent and she has done you a lot of emotional harm, stuff that you are still trying to unpick and work through to this very day.

Its never been functional, infact its codependency

This is very true

Mookatron

That’s a good idea in theory, but when I’ve tried that sort of thing my mother just kicks off, denies that she’s doing anything wrong and accuses me of being sensitive.

I was told often when she was drunk that she did not love me, and the next day she would say she said it to her me to say I loved her back etc. .... Also used to pack my weekend bags and lie and say my father was coming, knowing he wasn’t, so she could say he didn’t want me either.

goodness me. I hope the pps who say that people shout Abusive too easily don't parent their children like this, because this is pretty shit in my book.

Im glad the relationship with your mum has a lot of good in. I do think you need to set boundaries and actually, to woman up and to speak your piece. You're going to need to or she'll try to replicate her parenting on your son ... And if you have a daughter, there's a good chance that she will be the one trailing a long way in the background as you were.

The fact that your brothers take living rent-free -for granted- shows something as well, especially when you have to pay full rent. From all you have said, your mum has some serious issues with girl children andperhaps with females full stop. It clearly doesn't outweigh the good sides, but you do need to stop her repeating history.

OP let her kick off,, she is nasty and needs pulling up on her behaviour. Lower your contact with her too. You have a lovely family of your own, don’t look back in the future and regret her interference.

I've only just seen your last update and it completely changes my view of your situation.

As a child she told you she didn't love you? Packed your weekend bag even when she knew your father wasn't coming? Heartbreaking really. She should be on her knees with gratitude that you allow her into your life at all. I think you need to be more assertive, at the moment she is undermining you or overstepping a boundary, until you can move and put some physical distance between you.

@SeaEagleFeather I hope the pps who say that people shout Abusive too easily don't parent their children like this, because this is pretty shit in my book.

No, that was a pretty big drip feed. Of course telling a child you don't love them is abusive.

Giving your daughter parenting tips is meddling at worst, helpful at best. This is what earlier pps were referring to as abusive.

Why do you pay rent knowing your brothers don't? You need to exercise tough love where she is concerned. Tell her you want all siblings treated equally. I'd also try and see a bit less of her.

Sorry, I wasn’t trying to drip feed I just wasn’t sure how relevant it was and naturally it’s an extremely private bit of information that only about 2 people
In RL know about so wasn’t keen to share!

Why do you pay rent knowing your brothers don't?

The situation just came around that way - we wanted somewhere to rent and she had a lovely property so we thought it was a good idea. I did know my brothers weren’t paying rent but it didn’t annoy me in the same way until SIL quit her job and spent the last year doing sweet FA whereas at least my eldest brother is working hard. Because now I feel like they are just taking the piss. If that makes sense.

Be careful Crispy. There's a narrative for a lot of these posters about abuse/narcissim/toxicity which may not apply to you or you may not wish to see your life through that lens.

I think some of the advice you've had in changing the dynamic with your DM is v confrontational and will only pour fuel on a fire.

Have you tried simply and kindly telling your mum about your worry about the formula? She's probably anxious about being left with a bf baby and having no way to pacify him if he's hungry.

Also talk about your brothers. I bet your DM is secretly worried or even a bit ashamed of them that they are not standing on their own two feet.

I think if you are close to your mum it's realistic to think you could talk about how you feel and work on some changes. If you value your relationship then think the best of her and work on changing to a more adult way of relating to each other.

HedgePlastic fair enough. It's just that when you've had abusive parents, small comments can tip you off that the underlying picture is fairly unpleasant, or at the very least mixed. I think that's what some people were detecting. The combination of crispy's comments led to a potentially unpleasant situation.

There is always the danger of course that having survived abusive parents, one sees abuse whereever you look ... and often the picture is more nuanced and people are more just plain human mixed up.

Also in past generations people were less emotionally aware and personally I think that the power imbalance of the genders led indirectly some women to act pretty awfully to other women, through frustration/anger/buying into the system. I think the OP's mum is like this. So cruel to a small child waiting for their father though :( that really was a deliberate cruelty and somehow has the whiff of taking some sort of mental revenge, somewhere.

crispy, I too think that moving away is by far the best solution. Your mum clearly loves you but it's a flawed love, your husband very clearly sees she oversteps the boundaries and since she refuses to listen to you then it's unlikely to get better.

Are you a little bit afraid of her?

I used to be afraid of her, but I am not now. I more just feel huge amounts of guilt if we don’t speak, and I am somewhat nervous about keeping the peace and avoiding confrontation with her.

and I am somewhat nervous about keeping the peace and avoiding confrontation with her

what will happen if you 'confront' her? (I imagine by that you mean talking to her about your wishes where they don't coincide with hers?)

when I’ve tried that sort of thing my mother just kicks off, denies that she’s doing anything wrong and accuses me of being sensitive. Yes, that's why it's effortful. You have to push through that response and keep doing it anyway. But of course you can only do what feels right for you. I have found it slightly easier as my dad has got older and I can see the cracks in his manipulation techniques more. Before they were utterly seamless which made it feel like it was always me who was the unreasonable one.

If anything in your case I'd rather be the one paying full rent so as to be less beholden. I would imagine your bros are paying in other less tangible ways.

SeaEagleFeather I hope the pps who say that people shout Abusive too easily don't parent their children like this, because this is pretty shit in my book.

^*No, that was a pretty big drip feed. Of course telling a child you don't love them is abusive.

Giving your daughter parenting tips is meddling at worst, helpful at best. This is what earlier pps were referring to as abusive.*^

I agree with PPs that it can take a very small thing to tip you over the edge. That's how it was for me with my DM. I do believe she means well when she interferes with my parenting. She just has very poor boundaries.

But the reason it drives me up the wall is because she failed to protect us from our abusive F growing up. That's why I'm low contact with her, not because she jumps in to take over when I'm parenting my DDs.

So it isn't a deliberate 'drip feed', the OP wouldn't have had her childhood on her mind at all when starting the thread, so wouldn't have thought about mentioning it.

Her surprise visit was an ambush. When faced with a conversation they won't be able to control, people like your mum try another tactic. They are one step ahead, having been this way for many years before you even realise what they're doing is deliberate. So she comes unexpectedly, puts you on the spot by being there and making you out to be like a headmaster - so that you would deny this or feel guilty - and, I assume, be there when your partner isn't.

I'm glad it stayed at small talk. Have support when you have the talk. And be aware that even if the talk goes well, there will be a price to pay later, when she reasserts herself.

She wants to come round tomorrow, unclear if to talk or just to see me/DS.

Trying to think of a few kind of “stock phrases” to use with her.