I genuinely didn't think attitudes like this still existed

[Liverpool23]

Hello everyone,
I hugely need some wise advice
My fiance and I have been together 14 months. We were friends for 5 years before then. He proposed last week which I am over the moon about
My family have met him 2 to 3 times. My family live 250/300 miles away so the only reason for them not seeing him lots is the distance.
I am the youngest of 6 children and we were all raised in a strict Christian household.
My fiance is also from a strict Christian upbringing and from a different country. He did, however have a ONS 9 1/2 years ago (ie before I knew him) and now has a 9 year old son. We see this child once a week and he pays maintenance. I.e - he made the most out of a bad situation, he stepped up and is a Dad to his son

When we announced our engagement my family completely flipped out. One of my siblings has completely been so kind - congratulations etc but it could be because she has just had triplets (so obviously focused on my amazing nephews and niece)
My family wrote my fiance a letter which was (in my eyes uncalled for)
I essence this letter says things like:

Your fiance is only after a British passport (no, he has permanent residency)
Your fiance will not be able to financially support you as a wife (he has a full time job and what is this, the 1950's? I work full time too)
He will just get you pregnant and leave (I understand why they are concerned about this but the second he knew about his son he has done the right thing by him despite the son's mum saying he is nothing but a sperm donor - but thankfully still lets them see each other)
Basically a whole lot of hurtful things. They are all coming from the right place, I know my family love me fiercely however

It makes me feel like my family think I must be stupid. My fiance talk and discuss any issues like a ''normal'' couple. He has been in this country for over 20 years. His family have welcomed me with open arms
It also makes me feel like they don't trust me to choose a good husband for myself
My fiance is beyond hurt by their remarks. He has sobbed the past 3 nights saying that he loves me and just wants to spend the rest of our joint lives together and doesn't understand this (perceived) rejection

It is not rejection from my family - they just love me a whole ton and they have gone into over protective mode
By the way I am 29, not a little kid so although I appreciate they care so much I love this man and can't wait to be his wife.

My fiance and I have also had times where there has been racial abuse thrown at us once or twice (mixed race couple) and it just makes me so sad that in 2018 these attitudes still exist. It is as if my family do not see him as a person but my fiance as a person from xyz country so he must be like this and that iswim?
I hurts me so much that my family have hurt my fiance so much. I can only think, well we will have to prove everyone wrong and just stick together and they will see given time but part of me so SO angry that they are judging him in this way.
All my friends in the city that my fiance and I live in have been nothing but supportive. Sorry for long post, I appreciate any advice. Thank you

Maybe he needs to get to know your family more!
And sorry but sobbing for 3 nights is a bit much.

I think it's really sad and I feel for you. Hope things work out and wish you well. And crying is an understandable reaction.

You say that it is not a rejection from your family - that they are being protective of you. However I am afraid it is a rejection of your fiance though.

I would write back and explain to them that you love him, that he has done the right thing by his son (and presumably Christian thing) and that although you understand they may have concerns you truly don't have any and that you hope that they will be accepting of your fiance into the family and loving towards him because unfortunately if that is not the case then it will make an ongoing relationship with them difficult if not impossible ( that is assuming you are not going to leave him because of your family's outdated view).

Be thankful they are miles away and don't have daily involvement.

The reason I suggest a letter is that you can write it, edit it etc before sending. I would suggest writing it one day and leaving until the next before sending because sometimes the first draft can be too emotional or harsh and after some reflection there may be a way to express yourself in a better less emotive way that makes them understand your point of view and will lead to an apology.

Well, your family are rejecting your fiance, so I'm a bit confused that you say they aren't.

Your family have shown you who they really are. What you choose to do now that you know that is up to you.

Your family need to remember that they were not part of the Selection Committee - they only form the Welcoming Party.

You say they are being protective - I think they are being bloody rude. That said, 3 days of crying from your DP means they have struck a nerve - why is that?

My fiance rarely shows his emotions. He cried out over 3 nights in short bursts so not all night long
My dad did say in the letter he fully understands that I am 29 and can make my own choices but if we got married without his blessing it would cause a long shadow over his relationship with me. I have made him aware by my dad sending this letter it has now cast a long shadow over my fiance!
My dad and my fiance are going to talk over the phone - they both want to do this on Saturday to sort things out
I will marry him regardless of what they think but I do usually have a great relationship with all my family and love them back so don't want to hurt them either!
Being the youngest is so hard as I have my 5 brothers and sisters having an opinion AND my parents, well I am going to do what makes me happy for once - I know my fiance is rock solid. I have a good relationship with his son so we will just have to prove them wrong. Thank you for letting me get my feelings out and not let them out at them!

Sorry OP but I would be absolutely furious if my family did this.

You say its coming from a good place and isn't a rejection but I don't agree.

It's your life, you are a grown woman. Your partner makes you happy and that's all they should be concerned about.

I think it's awful they've purposefully (and it is purposefully) made your fiance feel rejected and I'd be having stern words with the lot of them that if they don't butt out and support me on my decisions then they can get lost.

How awful for your fiance. I'd be so upset if my partners family did this. I wouldn't want to see them again knowing this is how they felt about me!

I think you need to be backing your fiance's corner a bit more here to be honest. What they have done is wrong.

They keep asking questions like: does he even want any more children if he already has one (they know how much I want children)

Do they not think we discuss this sort of thing as a couple!! Rarr, I'm so frustrated.

And your father talking about his blessing... What year is this?!

It's of course a nice tradition to ask father of the bride etc... But come on. Casting a long shadow over your relationship with your dad if you don't get his blessing is dramatic.

Why do they feel they are entitled to so much involvement in your life?

@TiredAndaBitBored - thank you. They make me feel so unreasonable for being upset by what they say.
I have said regularly to my fiance that I back him 150% and have done practical things aswell to show that that is not just words

I don't think crying is an over reaction of your fiancès family reject you. And if he has been subjected to racial abuse (probably on and off all his life to some extent) then the insinuations that he's with you for residency etc is upsetting and insulting. The good thing for him is that you live far away from your family so at least he isn't going to have to see them every month. Hopefully as times goes on they will learn to "trust" the relationship is honest but their attitude stinks. I'm glad you have a sister who is supportive.

I'm assuming it may be a long engagement as it's a new relationship so hopefully they will come around by the time of the wedding and your fiancè can find it within himself to forgive them for their bigotry.

When you say you're a mixed race couple what race are you both?

Feels like racism may be at the bottom of this.

They are all coming from the right place

Haven't worked out exactly which angle they're coming from yet, but whichever it is, it's the wrong place.

Your family I’m afraid are showing all the worst elements of being “Christian” - they’re patriarchal and judgemental and not in any way kind. It gives Christianity a bad name when people say they are Christian and behave like this. Whatever happened to actual Christian kindness?

You're not being the least bit unreasonable being upset by your family's reaction to your engagement. They sound horribly bigoted and old-fashioned. You are going to have to pick sides in this battle, and it has to be the man you are intending to spend the rest of your life with. Don't let your family bully you into submission.

Two things seem clear to me. The first is that your DPs are racists. The second is that they don't see you as properly adult. They don't trust you to run your own life. These are both big issues.

This thread is so helpful to let my emotions out, thank you so much.
I am white British and he is Nigerian but has been resident in the UK for 20 years. His mum and sister live here also and I have a wonderful relationship with them. Sadly, yes I do think there is a touch of racism in their concerns.
We live in an area which is very multicultural but my family live in a very traditionally white area. I don't see this as an excuse though! Why are they like this, it's as if I am just realizing how controlling all of this is!

@musemum - Exactly! My fiance and I go to a church where we live and have strong Christian values and I utterly agree with you. It's as if they are saying we love you if....and then are giving me all sorts of conditions on that love

@Prawnofthepatriarchy Yes this is true. I moved away from ''home'' very young - at the age of 17 for a training programme and then earned my own money and have lived independently ever since. They have not once had to bail me out of any stupid decisions I may have made so I'm really not sure why they feel like I am not a real adult. I even said to my mum if you feel like you have raised me right, you should be able to trust me to make my own decisions and she was just blank, didn't say anything back to me!

Yeah your family sound like a bunch of racists, it's no wonder why your OH was so upset about it, it probably isn't his first time having to deal with that sort of thing

Hi OP, I really feel for the two of you, and think your fiance's reaction is very understandable considering he has most likely had 20 years of racist behaviour directed towards him since he's been her and now it's his fiancee's family that are doing it to him! I can't imagine how crushing that is for the two of you.

Please don't go out of your way to placate your family because that will send signs to your fiance that to an extent you're choosing them and their prejudices over him. Don't get dragged into over explaining to them, either, for instance about the children. Make them aware that you have chosen this man and that you are very firmly in his camp not theirs.

Why are your dad and your fiancé going to talk things through - he’s your dad, he should talk to you. It sounds like your dad thinks you can’t make your own decisions. He sounds very old fashioned. I think you should talk with your family again and tell them how very hurtful their attitudes are.

OP I think you have a very sensible attitude. You know and love your fiancé so you get to choose. Of course you are both upset by their reaction but I think that you both know that they are being unreasonable.
Concentrate on the congratulations message from your sibling and foster that relationship. Your parents reaction may be racist, or it may be reflective of their over protection of you as he has a child already. The reason does not matter. You know that they are wrong and that's good enough. Many congratulations on your engagement

They are not protecting you, they are protecting themselves as they dont want a black person in the family and heaven forbid mixed race children.

Its a good job they live so far away otherwise you’d probably have to go NC to make it work. There are often no greater bigots on this planet and the devoutly religious

Should say ‘than the’
Ffs mumsnet its 2018 why the hell cant we have an edit function??

My dad can be like this - writing letters rather than speaking to me like I'm a grown woman and an equal. The letter writing is a way of talking down to you (in my opinion) and ensuring he gets 'heard' without having to say it to your face. There no love, care and warmth in writing a letter which just details his opinions. There's no consideration of what it might be like to be on the receiving end of such a letter either.

You are obviously used to seeing your family as looking out for you and acting in your best interests - which they probably do as long as your stick the Family Rules.

I wouldn't panda to your parents over this. Especially not if you want to ensure this doesn't happen again in future.