DF put my baby at risk. What now?

[Aeonium]

I’ve had a massive falling out with DF. Over 20 years ago he left me and DM to become a live-in carer for his sister who is severely mentally disabled. Since then we’ve made our peace and I visit with DS. However several months ago when DS was born we argued because he kept whinging that I should give his sister “a turn” with the baby. I did let her hold DS once but I was hovering nearby because she has a history of being unpredictable and violent, and I told her not to kiss him because she has scabs, sores and weeping abscesses all over including on her mouth and face. She ignored me (understandable due to her disability) and when I stopped her trying to kiss DS she lost her temper and tried to throw him on the floor. So I said I didn’t feel comfortable letting her hold DS again. I know it seems mean but I have to put DS’s safety first. DF appeared to accept this and hasn’t mentioned it again.

A couple of days ago I arrived at DF’s house desperate for the loo and handed him DS (which I never do, I always put him on the floor with his toys). As soon as DF was left unsupervised holding DS he immediately handed him to his sister and let her kiss and cuddle him. I freaked out when I saw (I was out of the room for literally 30 seconds and came back to ask DF where the loo roll was). I grabbed DS, yelled at DF and stormed out.

DF refuses to apologise. He doesn’t think he’s done anything wrong. But he’s handed my baby to someone who’s unpredictable and has violent outbursts, who wouldn’t understand about things like not covering a baby’s face or dropping him, against my explicit wishes, while I was out of the room and not supervising. Also she’s being treated by a dermatologist because they don’t know what’s causing some of her skin lesions. Nobody knows if they’re infectious because nobody knows what they are. Other lesions could be herpes or anything, I don’t know.

I feel sympathy for her condition but I don’t think it’s healthy or pleasant for DS to be touching sores and abscesses. DF said “but she’s disabled”, which has been a lifelong excuse for her to be allowed to do whatever she wants. I don’t see why her being disabled means she has to be allowed to touch sores against my baby. And I appreciate that she just wants to cuddle the baby but he’s not a doll, and she might not mean to hurt him but that doesn’t mean she wouldn’t.

DF is now not speaking to me and I don’t know what to do. DM thinks I should forgive and forget because he’s old and could die at any time, I don’t want to deprive DS and his grandad of knowing each other, and I shouldn’t create a regrettable rift. But I’m deeply upset and I don’t trust him with DS any more.

It's not you that's denying your son a relationship with your Dad - it's your Dad that's going that. By imposing the condition that a relationship with him means allowing your aunt to do whatever she likes he's (perhaps unintentionally) emotionally blackmailing you.

I find your visceral dislike of your aunt and your description of her distasteful
I’ve tried to explain in the nicest way I can. I’m sympathetic to her condition but it isn’t very hygienic or pleasant. Which is relevant to my dilemma. And I’ve already admitted there’s a lot of history and resentment because even my own DF has always put her ahead of me. I try to be kind but draw the line at involving my DS.

There is no solution without your father being willing to make changes.

You need to protect your child - that's it, no more and no less. Protecting him has made life complicated, but you can't do anything about that.

This is non-negotiable, just like your DF thinks your aunt wanting other people's possessions is non-negotiable. In the real world, a baby's safety is what's not negotiable, but your dad will never see that.

Re your guilt over the money. It was his guilt presented as a house deposit.

Your DFs wants and needs don’t trump your babies safety.

It couldn’t be clearer.

Totally agree that you can't apply normal familial dynamics here. He's not a kindly old grandad figure. The last thing you want is for your son to have toys taken off him during visits at 4/5 for her to smash up or he gets called a selfish little boy. That's just continuing a cycle.

“If he hadn’t done that, his sister might actually have a life in a residential setting, where her health and care needs would have been addressed by professional staff.”

But is this actually true? From what OP posted earlier, their experience with respite / state care wasn’t good - the aunt was allowed to go wondering off on at least one occasion and was almost raped when a co-tenant developed an obsession with her.

And TBH if that was some time ago, which it sounds like it was, the situation has got a LOT worse since. Budgets have been slashed, providers are dropping out of the market left and right and we’ve all seen instances of abuse by low-paid care staff on vulnerable adults.

I do feel for you OP, but I kind of see his perspective too - at least as far as keeping the care within the family. That doesn’t make his handing over your DC in any way alright, and he should be able to own that poor decision making.

He can't say no to her and so his judgement is fundamentally flawed. You are completely right to keep your DS away.

It sounds like a pretty rubbish situation for all concerned and I have sympathy for you, your dad and your aunt but you're doing the right thing.

This makes me sad. Yanbu to not let your aunt hold the baby. I also feel sadness for your DF. In many families with a disabled child the biggest worry of the parents is what will happen after they die. Your father stepped up and whilst it was not the best decision he did not do it for selfish reasons.

I think it is easy for people to say put her in a home when they haven’t walked in his shoes.

Can your dh go with you when you call to him?

I find your visceral dislike of your aunt and your description of her distasteful

This is nonsense. You need to protect your DS, as your dad clearly won't.

Op - it won’t be that long until your ds starts having a favourite teddy / truck / doll / book.

Which will be very attractive to your aunt presumably.

What happens then?

Is having a grandfather really going to be a positive relationship if all grandad does is try to force him to hand over something precious to him? Seems to me it will just involve yet another generation in the “aunt comes first” belief.

Speaking as someone with toxic grandparents - I wish my parents hadn’t bothered. They so wanted the grandparent relationship for me but it was never going to happen the way they wanted. My parents had strong boundaries so I wasn’t damaged by the situation. My aunt and uncle had less good boundaries and 3 of my 4 cousins on that side have issues of one sort or another. I suspect they are related.

I wouldn’t visit with the baby again, ever.

It is sad that your dad internalised the “she is your responsibility” message from his own parents to this degrees but ultimately- your child’s safety is not worth less than your aunts wants or your father’s, for that matter.

Having read your thread, I really don't think your aunt is capable of understanding the care that a baby needs. For that reason alone, in your shoes I would feel compelled to make the decision that I would not visit with my baby. I've deliberately written how I would feel in your position - you have to make your own judgement call here.
I do feel that your father is emotionally blackmailing you because he feels compelled to put his sister's wishes before your baby's needs. Again, you can only do what you feel is right.
I can understand that it's very difficult for you, as you have now rebuilt your relationship with your father and feel that this could put it in jeopardy.
Could you visit without your baby? I think that is the way to go if it's possible. It will remove the pressure on you to let your aunt hold ds, and avoids conflict with your father at the same time.

Absolutely YANBU, this is super quick as I'm rushing out but if you Do want to continue to visit your father might a doll be a solution?

As in you come with your baby and a doll but treating them both as babies, your dad has the doll baby which he can then give to his sister to hold (a bit like the therapies they do with patients with dementia). Your own baby stays safely with you but your aunt has a 'turn' of a (fake) baby too.

As I say this is just a quick thought and may be entirely inappropriate as I don't have much experience of your situation.

respite / state care wasn’t good - the aunt was allowed to go wondering off on at least one occasion and was almost raped when a co-tenant developed an obsession with her

That's the bit I don't get. Op says this happened 30 or 40 years ago, but aunt is 50 (is dfather has had the same message for the last fifty years). Surely you'd remember if this was a child (10) or an adult (20) that this happened to? Not 30 or 40 years ago?

Or is dad younger than aunt and it's dad that is fifty?

I don't think you were being unreasonable in your fear for your child.

The way you talk about your aunt horrifies me though m. As a mother of disabled, non verbal child with a mental impairment it terrifies me her being a burden to her brother in years to come. And the thoughts of his possible future family speaking about her in this way breaks my heart.

Apologies just reread and aunt is 60, it's dd who is 50.

It sounds like your Dad & Aunt both have very low quality of life as chosen by your DD.

I would not visit again with your DC

@LegoPiecesEverywhere - did you miss the bit where the OP said her aunt has already tried to fling her baby onto the floor when she was allowed to hold him? Not to mention the open sores and weeping abscesses, some of which are on her face, and could well be in contact with the baby’s skin when she kisses him.

Would you really give a baby to someone who has a track record of breaking things she is given, who lacks the comprehension to know that a baby is not simply another ‘thing’, and who has already tried to act violently towards that baby?

I think the OP is doing absolutely the right thing, and she has no need to let her aunt have a ‘go’ with the baby. In fact, letting a person with her health issues and her behavioural problems hold a baby would be nigh-on neglectful.

Op says this happened 30 or 40 years ago, but aunt is 50
I was told about it. Not sure exactly when it was, it was either before I was born or when I was very little because I don’t remember it. So she would have been a teenager I suppose. Gran used to trot it out as an excuse for why respite care simply wasn’t an option because she wasn’t safe outside of the home.

As a mother of disabled, non verbal child with a mental impairment it terrifies me her being a burden to her brother in years to come
I do think it was wrong of Gran to expect DF to give up everything to look after his sister. She should have made other arrangements before she died instead of guilting him into taking over her role of being virtually housebound as a full time carer. I’m sure you won’t press that upon your DS and there will be a sensible solution involving professional care and support.

SDTG I never said anywhere in my post that she should give the baby to her aunt. I said YANBU to not allow your aunt to hold the baby.

Aeonium I posted again to say I'd got it wrong

I said df gave up his right to be a gf when he left, not because he left, but he had no intention of staying.

I have nothing to do with the care system but surely with the right placement it can’t be worse than what the aunt is suffering now.

It does look like your df cannot give your aunt basic hygiene or any stimulus and refuses any help.

Your df would rather she vegetates in front of a tv screen and is not keeping her clean yet won’t let anyone in.

In some ways whilst your aunt is allowed to do anything, have anything without consequence your df is similar. If he wants something he takes it. Even this control he has over his sister.

You and your dm were the equivalent of a toy he wanted to play with then threw away when something else came up.

“You and your dm were the equivalent of a toy he wanted to play with then threw away when something else came up.”

Oh come on... really? You think he saw them as “toys?” And that caring full time for a profoundly disabled adult sibling was also a “toy” that he preferred instead? Have you any idea how much of his own life he must have given up?

Cut the guy some slack here. He was brought up with a constantly drilled-in mantra that his sister was to be cared for at all costs. That sort of conditioning is extremely difficult to break. If anyone is at fault here it’s his Mum for grinding that message home until it stuck to the point where even his daughter couldn’t compete.

But if he knew he was going to leave why start a relationship and have a child with someone who didn’t want to look after his sister.

If looking after his sister was his top priority then why marry someone you know wanted nothing to do with his sister.

Why did he lie?

Why did he hit op if she didn’t pander to the aunts demands?

I don’t believe he is as saintly as some people believe

It really is a difficult situation. I have a sister with traumatic brain injury from severe epilepsy and can identify with much of what you have posted. But you are right to feel angry, let down and protective. Please try not to feel guilty.
Imagine having this discussion with a professional like your health visitor, GP or a social worker. They would tell you, in very clear terms, to put your baby first. You could even do that, if you think it could help offer you some back-up.