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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Was I unreasonable or is he a dick (and potentially controlling/creepy)

123 replies

usernamefromhell · 28/07/2018 16:50

Wonder what you all make of this scenario: for background I've been separated three years and have dated a bit but a bit out of the game. I'm a single mum and have very little reliable childcare, so getting out to meet people for dates is quite often a pain in the arse and has to be properly planned.

Started messaging someone I met online -- he seemed nice, we seemed to get on. We made a plan for me to go out to where he lives. I live in London and where he lives is fairly rural and a bit out of the way although not miles from London. But remote enough that I couldn't have pulled a sharp exit after a certain time of night if I suddenly wanted to.

On the day I was supposed to go to his I confirmed that I was on my way. He had previously said I could stay over and he would make sure I could have his bed (implication being that he wouldn't be in it unless I wanted him to). But when I left to meet him I messaged to say "just so you know, I think I'm going to go home tonight."

He took great umbrage, said he'd gone out of his way to make sure I felt comfortable with the sleeping arrangements etc and had arranged for him to stay with a friend and let me stay in his place (although he hadn't mentioned this to me before), had cooked a lovely meal, etc etc. I said sorry but I wasn't comfortable with staying over, I would come for dinner but go home. He said fine, don't bother and guilted me about the fact that he'd gone to lots of trouble etc.

I went home but messaged him to say I was happy to come over this weekend but a little earlier, allowing me to spend more time there but still leaving me the option of coming home if I wasn't feeling it/wasn't comfortable staying. He said fine and we left it as a plan to be firmed up in due course. I messaged him twice this week to ask if we were still on and there has been radio silence. I know he's got my messages and hasn't blocked me. It's possible he's had some emergency but it appears much more likely he's either ghosted me or is trying to make a point.

Leaving me to conclude one of the following scenarios:

a) that he had planned to get his leg over all along but had an elaborate subterfuge to make it appear this was not the case and once I'd made it clear he couldn't count on this happening he has lost interest and/or found a better offer. In which case I dodged a bullet.

b) that he's really controlling and is trying to punish me for "letting him down", which is a red flag. In which case I also dodged a bullet.

c) (the generous interpretation) that he's genuinely upset and I have been insensitive or messed him around. In which case I deserve it.

Based on his over-reaction and the way it has unfolded I'm leaning towards a or b but curious to know whether I've just become so hardened and self-protective that I'm being unfair and need to loosen up a bit. I have difficulty trusting people and sometimes think my compass is a bit wonky.

Any thoughts?

OP posts:
usernamefromhell · 28/07/2018 20:18

OK all I have well and truly got the message about not meeting someone on a first date at their house. I agree that that was stupid and I won't do that again. Message received.

Just for the record, to clear a few points up peakpants I didn't "bombard" him with messages -- I sent two messages over the course of a week to clarify what I believed was a standing arrangement, more to make sure I could plan my diary than anything else.

Haffiana I take your point but actually I think my boundaries are OK - bottom line was I realised he had crossed a line.

But I think my boundaries are OK. I know what's right and wrong and I know when I'm being taken advantage of: when it counted I knew something wasn't right.

I obviously made the wrong call, and its shocked me that so many of you think I'm unhinged or have no self esteem at all. I do have self-esteem. I just am very trapped and find it very hard to get out. But obviously I need to have a bit of a word with myself.

Thanks,

OP posts:
Djnoun · 28/07/2018 20:22

Actually, I think quite a lot of online dates end up with either a stranger in your house or yourself in a stranger's house. And even knowing someone well enough in real life isn't any protection. So I find this rape talk leaves a sour taste in my mouth. I've been on a first date to someone's house. It's almost like people are suggesting I'd have some responsibility if the person had turned out to be a rapist or murderer. Sure, it's possible. But you can't live your life like that, worried that every random person is going to hurt you.

SheWoreBlueVelvet · 28/07/2018 20:35

Aside from the rape/ murder issue, going to his place is all wrong anyway.

You made it way to easy for him and hence you get spoilt behaviour when it doesn't pan out.
Meeting him at home means he get to be more relaxed and you have to do all the travel and stressing.
He has to be invested in the date, meet you halfway, chose somewhere to go, put on decent clothes etc etc.
For the next one obviously. This ones a goner.

category12 · 28/07/2018 20:50

But why does meeting online mean you'd have a first date in someone's house? What's wrong with an actual date with a restaurant or a pub or a walk in the park or something? It's not a 'random person' either, it's someone you're meeting with a view to a relationship/sex.

MaybeDoctor · 28/07/2018 21:50

I agree with SheWoreBlueVelvet - he was a lazy fecker in the first place for thinking that you would be willing to travel out to him, rather than him coming into town to make the journey easier for you. Not a good sign!

Coffee shops at mainline stations are a good option for a first date, I think. Busy, always an excuse to leave (Got to go, my train is leaving!) and close to other amenities like taxis.

usernamefromhell · 29/07/2018 02:25

This thread has made me feel pretty fucking depressed. Clearly I fecked up and shouldn't have considered going to meet him. That much is clear and I can see, looking back, that that should have been a red line. Thanks for giving me a wake up call.

I have to say I think its easier from the security of a settled marriage to tut and remark on the stupidity of going to meet someone at their house as if I were a complete idiot. It was the wrong thing to do but it doesn't make me stupid or desperate and one or two of you are coming across as implying that.

One of the problems with OD is that its easy to fall into a cycle where repeat episodes of dickish behaviour make you more and more cynical until eventually you stop bothering. You meet someone who behaves like a dick and retreat into your shell again for months. Then you drag yourself out again thinking its time to give it another chance and you get the same or worse behaviour. It's sometimes quite hard to strike a balance between not veering into naivety through wanting to be positive and total cynicism on the other.

Having said that it has shocked me that I was even prepared to consider it and you've all done me a favour by bringing that home to me.

OP posts:
fizzthecat1 · 29/07/2018 02:33

OP it's extremely unsafe to stay in a strangers house, or even just GO to their house before you've even met them in real life. You did the right thing by not staying there the night but you shouldn't go round to someones house as a first date. You need to be careful.

Also the fact he is so angry you weren't going to stay the night is a big red flag you wouldn't have been safe. Him going to his friends was bullshit.

Sally2791 · 29/07/2018 06:12

OP I hope you have better luck next time and definitely meet in a very public place in daytime if possible. I would also add tell a couple of friends where you are going and brief details of who you are meeting. Unfortunately there are many strange people out there,

Nanny67 · 29/07/2018 06:22

A genuine guy would not be inviting you to his place for a first date!! He should make the effort and what's wrong with just a coffee shop? I always think that's the best way for a preliminary screening Wink

Ryder63 · 29/07/2018 07:20

OP has got the message I think! I would like to add that agreeing to travel to a dates house for a first date does come across as desparate or 'up for it'. Leaving stranger danger aside - as a pp said, it involves no effort on the guy's part. A brief, chatty first date to form impressions, a longer second date, then a third, and as many as it takes to be sure!

If you feel you want to spend a night with someone who lives remotely, a city/town hotel is a good first option - in a place midway between you both.

PerverseConverse · 29/07/2018 07:57

Not posting from the security of a settler marriages here! I did OLD myself but have given up as too many weirdos out there. A quick google of first date tips when I first started brought up safety advice straight away. You might not be desperate but a lot of men wound read willingness to travel to their house and stay over as just looking for shag and/or desperate. A nice guy would never expect you to meet at their house.

MaybeDoctor · 29/07/2018 08:34

In fairness I don’t think it’s a case of ‘smug marrieds’ berating a single woman. We all have to weigh up similar decisions around personal safety.

Only this week I took a stupid short cut through a small car park in a less-salubrious part of London. It was daylight but I was part way across when I realised that it was entirely packed with high-sided vans, so if anyone had been lurking there they would have been completely invisible from the street. I gave myself a bit of a mental kick for that one.

Onwards and upwards! Flowers

NynaeveSedai · 29/07/2018 08:37

I'm currently in a 11 month dry spell because of the depressing nature of OLD so I'm with you on that.

Cupoteap · 29/07/2018 09:45

have to say I think its easier from the security of a settled marriage to tut and remark on the stupidity of going to meet someone at their house as if I were a complete idiot.

Come on you know that's a stupid defensive remark.

There an Online dating thread in relationships I think why don't you drop by there.

DancingHipposOnAcid · 29/07/2018 09:46

You haven't even met this guy yet, you know nothing about him. I wouldn't even consider stepping inside his house at this stage never mind staying over. Very dangerous.

Surely first date should be somewhere public and neutral where you can easily make a quick exit if necessary. I would insist on meeting up in London initially.

His fury at you not agreeing to be pushed into his plans is very suspicious and indicates he meant to push you into something you didn't want to do.

You dodged a bullet and possibly rape.

NEFink · 29/07/2018 09:48

Nothing defensive here either. I have been single for 6 years and not dated one person. Not one.

No thanks.

Hammondisback · 29/07/2018 09:54

Lucky escape. Please don’t meet someone at his home - unless you are really confident that you know him and his motives. Certainly never for a first date - make sure you meet in a public place, drive or arrange transport home and make sure friends or family know exactly where you are. I agree with thousandpapercranes - trust your instinct.

DancingHipposOnAcid · 29/07/2018 09:55

User, no matter how confident you are you are not "big and ugly enough " to defend yourself against a probably physically stronger person who has you trapped alone in their home.

Please give more thought to your personal safety if you are going to continue with online dating. You are meeting people you know nothing about and have never set eyes on before. Everyone knows the rule is first dates are in neutral, public places with plenty of other people around and easily exited if you are not comfortable. Anyone who gives you a hard time about sticking to this is suspect and should be dropped like a hot stone.

SandyY2K · 29/07/2018 10:04

You really should not be agreeing to go stay in a remote location the first time you meet someone.
100% this

It was foolish to do so in this day and age.

The OLD rules are always to meet on neutral ground in a public place.

Read up on the rules before you continue with OLD.

He said fine, don't bother and guilted me about the fact that he'd gone to lots of trouble etc

I'm not sure why you messaged him when he told you not to bother. His message was loud and clear.

usernamefromhell · 29/07/2018 10:21

OK I've got the point loud and clear about not agreeing to meet at someone's house and have acknowledged that I made a mistake multiple times.

cupoftea please don't call me stupid, I'm far from stupid, you're not helping and I get the impression you are slightly kicking me when I'm on the floor.

Thanks for giving me some clarity here and I acknowledge it was wrong but if its all the same I could do without more people piling on to tell me how stupid and desperate I was not to meet in a public place. That message is clear and I could do without being made to feel any more shit about this.

OP posts:
category12 · 29/07/2018 10:30

Sorry you're feeling under attack, op. These things can turn into a bit of a dogpile.

(I think cupoftea meant your comment rather than you personally and did suggest you join the dating thread, which I think was intended nicely.)

Do you know why him getting shitty with you over the arrangements didn't make you drop him straightaway? Are you a people pleaser or have you been in abusive relationships?

creddo · 29/07/2018 10:30

Great respect to you OP for your replies. You've been more than gracious, hopefully posters will stop piling in with the same old stuff now.

category12 · 29/07/2018 10:32

Or he just catch you off-guard, making the unreasonable seem reasonable with his angry bluster?

giveitfive · 29/07/2018 10:39

It's tough out there OP.

Just remember to always be kind to yourself in your planning.

Some of these responses are a bit fierce but ultimately they just want you to be safe.

Good luck x I hope you find the right person to have a little fun with.

Hammondisback · 29/07/2018 10:41

You’re not stupid - we are all vulnerable to trusting people wrongly. I’ve trusted people on the past because I really WANTED to believe the best in them, despite my gut telling me otherwise xx

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