I can see both sides to this

[NiceAndBreezy]

Mumsnetters I need your wisdom because I can truly see both sides of this.

I've been with my DP for 10 months, we'd known each other as acquaintances for a couple of years before that through a mutual interest. He has been separated 16 months. We are very much a couple, he stays at mine several nights a week, he's involved in my family life (my teenage DS, my parents, my siblings), we've been on holiday a couple of times and have plans for a future together. All round very happy.

His STBXW didn't want their marriage to end and has been very upset. She is quite close to his brother's wife, they live in the same small town (DP moved away) share a social circle etc. STBXW has tried to exert pressure on DP to return to her via DP's family and mutual friends and I know that DP's SIL has found this very difficult. SIL has come under pressure not just from STBXW but also the friendship circle. SIL has also borne the brunt of STBXW's emotional upset.

STBXW does not know that he has a girlfriend.

I've met DP's DD and her husband a couple of times (DD is not STBXW's daughter) and recently DP suggested to his brother and SIL that we meet up. DP's brother was fine and we did meet but SIL didn't feel that she could as STBXW doesn't know about me and SIL would feel awkward seeing STBXW socially having met me (I think she finds it difficult enough knowing I exist when STBXW doesn't).

My difficulty is this. DP doesn't regard it as any of STBXW's business that he is seeing me (especially as they have no children). I totally get and support this.

I can also see SIL's point of view and respect that. Everyone expects that STBXW finding out would cause significant emotional fallout and I can imagine a scenario where SIL is quizzed about how long she's known, whether she's met me, what I'm like etc. etc.

My concern is how long this situation will go on for. DP has no intention of ever telling STBXW and she is unlikely to find out by chance. They will divorce on the grounds of two years separation next summer so though that might be a watershed it's some way off.

It's OK (if disappointing) for SIL to refuse invitations to occasions I'm going to be at, that's her right. But I can't see anything changing very soon and if I am excluded from their family events for the foreseeable future I'm going to find that very difficult.

DP and I talk very openly and honestly about difficult stuff so I have no problem discussing it with him but I'm struggling with what to say. Is it reasonable to suggest that he should tell STBXW? 'Rip off the plaster' style. Get any palaver out of the way and enable everyone to get on with their lives.

I know he will be worried about the fall out and that she might start to be difficult about their divorce given that she needs to agree to it.

Or should I leave it and see how things work out over the next few months? SIL might come round, STBXW might meet someone else etc. etc.

I don't find uncertainty very comfortable (but I know that's my issue).

Hi OP, I probably don’t have the best well rounded advice. It does all sound a bit tricky. And as much as I’d say exw needs to get over it all I can understand why her friends would be protecting her feelings, and if she had known earlier it may have caused disruption in the relationship you have built with DP.

Was it SILS’s choice not to tell exw about you? Or was she asked not to?

I don’t think it is your dp’s place to tell the ex about his new relationship, especially as they don’t have any dc’s. However I think perhaps your dp could speak to his brother, and make a point that you are going to be sticking around for a while, yours and dp’s relationship is serious and this isn’t something that needs to be kept quiet until it ends… as you are serious about each other. I don’t know how sil / friends could approach exw and tell her about you… I think that is entirely up to them and not you.

Assuming the ex is an adult she needs to be told to get a fucking grip.
And everyone is ridiculous for pandering to the madness.

Nice I think your DP is taking the easy way out and all this is unfair on your SIL. She has already betrayed her friend (as she is) by not revealing it. If I was his ex wife I’d be really upset with her. And tbh - this is your DP fault.

Why is is whole family expecting SIL to lie to a grown woman? It’s really not fair.

This is the same of dh side of family - they did and still cover for bil when he cheated on his ex wife and now his girlfriends. I know his new girl friend yet walked in to his house the other week and his ex was cleaning it. I honestly can’t face his new gf now.

You may be having a good time with this bloke but you really need to consider the man and the family you are getting involved in. If they are prepared to lie to and sheild him from women/ex’s then don’t be fooled in to thinking they wouldn’t do the same to you. He is only really looking out for himself here and SIL has and is going to be thrown under the bus. She will now be seen as two faced as the truth always comes out.

Seriously if he doesn’t come clean about you and put her out of her misery and face the music sadly I’d think about leaving. Not because he wants to his you BUT because he and his family are willing to lie to cover his arse. Do you even want to be a part of a family like that??

I don’t tbh but it’s too late for me ..

16 months down the line? She's going to have to face reality sooner or later. He should tell her.

Hide you **

If she thinks he is single, which is a deception, then she still thinks she has a chance to save her marriage

Was it SILS’s choice not to tell exw about you? Or was she asked not to? DP hasn't specifically told SIL not to say anything just that he's not going to as it's nothing to do with her. I don't know SIL personally (obviously) but I get the impression she doesn't want to face the anticipated sh*tstorm by telling STBXW.

Assuming the ex is an adult she needs to be told to get a fucking grip.
And everyone is ridiculous for pandering to the madness. This is how I feel in my less charitable moments! I have said to DP that SIL and STBXW are grown ups and need to navigate their relationship in the new reality.

I think your DP is taking the easy way out and all this is unfair on your SIL And I also sometimes think this - flip side of the coin.

I wouldn't have told my XH I was in a relationship except for the sake of my teenage DS, who needed to know quite early on as he comes and goes pretty much as he pleases between mine and XH's homes. And once DS knew I felt it wasn't fair for him to know something his dad didn't or to have to tell him himself. BUT, he is a child and SIL is an adult. Does DP owe it to her to protect her in the same way?

I think tbh that SIL would rather DP and STBXW hadn't split up as it's made her life difficult. But, they have and she's got to deal with it.

Yes, they are a rather avoidant family. DP has made big strides in changing that behaviour going forward (we relate very differently) but he's still stuck in that pattern with STBXW.

Feel a bit sorry for her really. I understand why your DP doesn’t think it’s any of her business but she is pressuring and involving other people he cares about probably mostly because she has no idea he is seeing you. If she knew he had moved on, it may help her to as well.

I don’t think it will be long before she finds out by the sounds of it. His SIL will eventually crack and tell her I would imagine. I don’t doubt she will be more hurt by the fact everyone kept it from her for a year instead of just being honest. Normal people would have surely turned around to her and said “he isn’t going to get back together with you, he has found someone else.” She needs to heal.

Feel a bit sorry for her really...If she knew he had moved on, it may help her to as well I agree

His SIL will eventually crack and tell her I would imagine Not sure about this. I get the impression she's scared of the reaction that would get.

Normal people would have surely turned around to her and said “he isn’t going to get back together with you, he has found someone else.” Also agree. If I was SIL when DP told me he was seeing someone else I'd've said I couldn't keep it from STBXW but would tell her as kindly as I could. As it was she told him not to tell STBXW (not that he was going to anyway).

Seems they're all a bit scared of STBXW tbh though I understand the message being given is "It's been over a year, he isn't going to get back with you".

I feel sorry for her too. It feels cruel.

But surely if STBXW knew he'd moved on to a (serious) new relationship, it would help her to move on too? Seem a bit cruel that the whole family is keeping this from her.

I think DP needs to man up and tell her. It might be 'none of her business' but it would surely be kinder.

Her relationship with SIL will be damaged when STBXW realises she has been keeping this from her unless she does some severe damage control. It may be this that is preventing her from telling her as it is.

What a mess! Very odd choices and decisions have resulted in a very awkward situation.

Thanks everyone for your input.

Very odd choices and decisions have resulted in a very awkward situation. Yes, the family dynamic is a bit dysfunctional (aren't most in some way or another). STBXW is 10 years younger than DP (DP, brother & SIL are all mid to late 50's), I wonder whether that's part of why she's pandered to - being the 'baby' of the family.

It seems the consensus is that STBXW should know and I'm coming round to that point of view. I know that in an ideal world it'd be none of her business but other people are being impacted. Also in an ideal world grown ups would behave like grown ups.

There's nothing I can do about it though but talk it through with DP - he and SIL are the ones who have to act, or not as the case may be.

He isn’t protecting her he is protecting himself !

He isn’t protecting her he is protecting himself Not sure whether by 'her' you mean SIL or STBXW Whatthe

If you mean STBXW he is indeed protecting himself from an expected backlash but I don't see that as unreasonable - what is it to do with STBXW if he is dating? He's not with her so is free to do as he pleases. He's been very clear and consistent with everyone from the beginning that the marriage was over, despite the pressure. There shouldn't be a backlash to deal with.

My view now is that he needs to tell her, face the backlash (however unreasonable that is) and get it out of the way for SIL's sake as much as anyone's. SIL isn't strong enough to do the right thing, be an adult about it and tell STBXW (her friend) that DP is seeing someone.

Then we can all get on with our lives. STBXW included.

I agree with much of your earlier post about his family. It is dysfunctional. DP has had therapy since the end of his marriage to understand and try to deal with all that. As I said earlier, he has changed and he and I relate very differently to each other. But, his family and STBXW remain in the old patterns.

Nobody has asked/told SIL not to tell STBXW, SIL has chosen not to as she is as afraid of the reaction STBXW will have.

Tbh I think STBXW maybe won't have as bad a reaction as people are expecting. Surely she wouldn't be surprised after over a year apart that he has moved on?

iT PROBABLY will upset her, as it usually feels shit to find out someone has moved on. However, that is not a reason to not tell her.

They may be trying to protect her from upset, but she is still clinging on by the sounds of it and the truth will hurt, but ultimately allow her to move on with her own life.

I think protecting her is a secondary consideration. I think DP and SIL are protecting themselves from anticipated fallout.

FWIW his therapist has said he doesn't need to tell STBXW anything about his new relationship, that he 'doesn't need to answer to her any more' and that STBXW was emotionally controlling. That now he needs to do what he wants to do, not what others want him to and not to be a people pleaser.

This may be true but in a way I feel it lets him off the hook.

Your DP needs to tell his ExW so everyone can move on. As for her making the divorce awkward, he can always petition her for unreasonable behaviour if she threatens not to agree to two years' separation. The fact they have no DC together makes the process much more simple, it's not like he's worried she'll alienate his DC. After 16 months he has no excuse to keep you a secret and personally I wouldn't be putting up with it.

I wouldn't tolerate being a secret from DP's family and friends but I'm not.

I don't have a problem with being 'a secret' from the ex per se - I'm an irrelevance to her. I wasn't an OW, there's no being 'behind her back' or anything like that, exes don't have a right to be updated on each other's sex/love lives.

It's only relevant because of the connection between the ex and the SIL.

As things stand he wouldn't petition for unreasonable behaviour. He doesn't regard her as having 'done anything wrong'. We both know the reasons don't have to amount to much but it's certainly not something he'd consider now, if ever.

I see it from his POV too, but he can tell her he’s in a new relationship without telling her the details (which is what she’ll be immediately after and for which, I have no doubt, your SiL will be targeted).

Both your DP and SiL just need to be polite but firm in saying “that’s none of your business” when she pushes for details. Repeat that enough and she’ll get the message eventually, and at least she won’t be harbouring any delusions about the marriage.

Yes 3456 you're right that's what they need to do. I wish they were both able to be sensible and grown up about it and do just that. I'm worried that they won't be. DP knows how important this is to me, we've talked about it in detail.

I need him to do the right thing or I know my feelings about him will change.

Of course it's totally your partners choice whether he personally tells his ex about you or not but I feel like he shouldn't be expecting the SIL not to. She must be in such an awkward position

He's not expecting SIL not to tell. She's decided not to and has in fact previously told him not to tell STBXW either out of fear of the reaction.

DP is torn between doing what SIL wants (Not telling STBXW about me and perpetuating the family pattern of avoiding anything emotionally difficult) and what I want (everyone to behave like grown ups and be honest).

Unfortunately it suits DP to not tell either as it's 'easiest' for him. I feel like this is a crunch point - I want to be in a relationship with a grown up.

ah right weird. The SIL is making things worse for herself then imo. I'd be annoyed tbh that the ex has them all walking around on egg shells and in a way is intruding on your relationship with your partner and his family. I don't know what the solution is though tbh, you could "accidentally" tag your partner in a coupley photo on FB, problem solved :p

Lol Trinity. If only. We are off the radar on social media because of the ex.

Yes, re. egg shells I'm annoyed at exactly that and have been for a while. Now it has started to intrude on our relationship it's becoming more of a problem to me.