Infidelity

[SarahJop22]

I know I'm probably being controversial here and I am not setting out to offend/annoy anyone.

I just wanted to say that I'm a bit taken aback about by the vitriol towards anyone who comes on here looking for advice if they have strayed (sometimes even slightly) from their marriage/partnership.

I am in a very LTR with children and I love my partner but ...(cliche I know) we had started growing apart and our lives became revolved around housework/kids. I was feeling low and unattractive and I behaved out of character; I did not have a full blown affair but I did get very close to a colleague and although very little happened physically (we kissed once on a night out), I know I crossed the line. It's a bit textbook really, we started out as friends and it started to develop into something else. I never met him outside of work or anything other than on work nights out but we had lunch together in work almost daily.

I realised things were escalating after the last night out and I tried to stop it but he was persistent and I ended up developing feelings for him (not love, more like a crush/mild infatuation) to the point where I am now leaving my job.

I know how wrong this has all been and I regret ever setting eyes on the man but it has made me realise how easily these things happen. I love my partner but I obviously missed the intensity and passion of our relationship which I am trying to get back with him. I confessed everything to him and he has been very understanding and we are now working on getting the spark and appreciation back into our relationship. He is spending less time on his computer and more time with me. I know how lucky this makes me. I have been given another chance.

We are all human, we want to be loved and desired, we want to feel like we matter to someone. If 20% of people have full blown affairs and many more have 'emotional' affairs (whatever that means!), they can't all be twats.

People make mistakes. They can't help what they feel. I read resposes of LTB all the time on here because someone has 'crossed the line' and I just think that people are so judgmental sometimes. None of us are infallible, we all just human. Monogamy is a social construct at the end of the day and if people sometimes fail to meet the demands of ideals they are vilified and slated. It is particularly sad when someone comes on here looking for advice because they have made a mistake (which they often feel terrible about) but are faced with horrible responses telling them how shit they are.

What about compassion? They haven't murdered anyone!

I appreciate this may not 'toe the mumsnet line' but I just thought I'd put it out there.

luckystar be gentle on yourself and don't impose upon yourself a deadline on when to stop feeling confused, uncertain about the future, angry and even resentful. These are normal feelings. The foundations of what made you feel secure and confident about the future have been deeply shaken. It is ok to feel like if you are going "blindly" toward the unkown...imho it would be good if you could use this misfortune to strengthen yourself for whatever the future might throw at you: develope yourself professionally (more/new courses /qualifications) -emotionally (more compassion for people who have it tough-more forgiveness to human mistakes- a greater diversity in friends) -physically and spiritually ( pursue some interest/hobby you neglected when you started your rekationship such ancing /drawing / yoga/ music/reasing club etc) ...when you have fone that then you will stop needing to control the future ...as tatty said : she now knows that if her partner will ever cheat again all she will have to do is pack her bag...

Thank you kids you are absolutely right and I can definitely see that I have grown and matured in the relatively short time I have known and I feel stronger (as well as weaker), in all, someone who now knows (sadly) that life is bloody difficult.

I’ve defustatted to do things for me and feel more like myself than I have done in years. I would love to reach that point that Tatty mentions. It sounds like a place of great inner peace and confidence.

Lucky wanting that is already a big step toward it...the other steps are all you do for your personal development...and one day you will reach this stage of inner peace...how much time do you need? It is individual-depends on the length of time you have been together, on his behavior, on you as an individual , on the society around you (if like me you are in this kind of society where a woman is expected to LTB as soon as he strays-then it is a bit more difficult and you need to be strong and not let anyone put you down and send you back into turmoi because you try to rebuild it...) Time heels. Can we speed it up? I think that we can't at the start but after a while we can accelerate by firmly deciding conscientiously to forgive and have compassion for our partner that strayed...of course we can do this only when the betrayer is working hard to atone for his mistake and is willing to give us the time we need to heal....I had the same kind of questions as the ones you are having now and I also felt I was "tatonning" -French word that means trying to find my way in the dark -toward a threatening future...time and compassion and our partner's behavior help...no rush...accept these feelings-accept our human fragility and have faith in yourself and in compassion..Good Luck

Excellent thread OP.
Very refreshing to read, as this is EXACTLY what happens in real life.

Can I ask, will you be tempted to reply to this man if you texts you etc? You said he was persistent...

I confessed everything to him and he has been very understanding

You are starting from a good and well-intentioned position. I wish you well.

I haven't done a tally but I would hazard a guess that the vast majority of threads that garner the 'LTB' replies do not start this way. Maybe 90%? I don't know, but a significant majority, I would say.

They usually start with the non-affairing partner being blindsided by an unexpected discovery, or spending weeks/months feeling unsettled and suspicious and anxious. These scenarios are extremely tumultuous and devastating, and can have terminally destructive effects on the relationship. Those of us that have experienced it might be more inclined to say, with personal insight and hindsight, 'get out now' rather than sadly and fearfully attempt to patch things up and spend years worrying about it happening again.

There isn't so much an 'LTB brigade' as a cadre of individuals who have shared experiences. I read a lot of threads for months before I Left The B, and my well of empathy and compassion had run dry, consuming my personal stock of self-worth and confidence, by the time I called the end.

Yes, there’s some rediculous ‘advice’ on this site sometimes. Like when someone was being advised to empty out her (non-married) partners savings account before leaving him.

Op your personal attack on me is unfair. You are attacking me because you yourself feel threatened and you really know that many of the claims I made are true.

I am not perfect. I Never claimed to be. I have many faults. But risk of infidelity is not one of them.

Betrayal and lost the trust comes in so many different ways. some people sleep with someone on a one night stand, other people do other things, emotional affairs, repeatedly.

You had lunch again and again, went to work do's? Thought about him. Made decisions not just once but 30,40,50, 60 times?

Either lying or lying by omission - not telling your husband all the things going on in your brain, what you did/thought at work that day? Possibly?

you had many many opportunities to change the course of events, but you chose not to, again and again.

that's all I'm saying. is that not true?

But, to be fair you only kissed him once, on a night out.
So hardly criminal.

When you marry someone it's 'to the exclusion of all others' so when a partner cheats they've broken the contract. Effectively the marriage is null and void from that moment.

For me, it was the months of lying to my face as much as the cheating itself which made me LTB. Why would I want to spend any more time with someone so deceitful?

SchnitzelVonKrumm

Hmm, I always think the advice given on here is a useful counterpoint to what may be real-life pressure to accept infidelity. Friends and family are usually invested in the status quote, they want couples to stay together because people generally don't like the balance of their lives disturbed. So I think it's quite important to have someone say, actually you don't have to put up with this, you don't have to sweep it under the carpet, it's the betrayer who's at fault and who has to fix things

I think this has it spot on. My h cheated a year ago- everyone told me to ltb. When I posted wavering about it I was criticised as weak and found it really upsetting. Otoh IRL I was actually losing friends who couldn't cope with the breakup of the dynamic and it was part of the reason I decided to reconcile a few months ago. But then two weeks ago it all happened again and it turns out the wise women were right and a leopard doesn't change his spots. However, I haven't posted a newthread or update this week because I imagine I will get incredulous people saying I should never have thought about reconciling in the first place!

Oh @Bedraggledmumoftwo Sorry to hear that, I remember your threads - is it the same woman?

Redrun – You were young and you weren’t personally cheating on anyone. Yes you would have been slated on here but we’ve all done things we’re not proud of especially when we were young. You probably learned a lot from it and are wiser as a result.

Schnitzel – I’m not sure I fully agree. I can’t think of any friends/family members who would try and coerce someone they cared about into staying in a relationship in which they were poorly treated. Maybe the people you mix with are more traditional though. But yes, people should not put up with someone who serially cheats and it is definitely the responsibility of the betrayer to fix the damage they have done.

Helena – Yes that is an important factor. If the facts are hidden repeatedly and there is a lot of deception then that’s much harder to deal with. I think it’s a different situation entirely if the betrayer is truly remorseful and makes amends/learns from the experience and doesn’t do it again. People make mistakes but repeatedly lying and betraying trust is a different ball game. Every situation is unique. I am sorry you went through that and I hope things are better for you now.

Fuckme – Yep. I know some people have gone through genuine heartache over a period of years and want to give their own advice by telling others not to let it happen to them. Interesting about the genetic makeup…I’ll look into that. I hope I haven’t got the cheating gene! Although I did manage to be loyal for twenty years before this fiasco! I am lucky and I will use what has happened to be a better and more considerate partner. Sorry to hear about your friend. That’s horrible. He must have been in so much pain, tragic.

Kids – You clearly went through a lot but you have come through it and are insightful and understanding. You give good advice to others and I suspect you are a good friend to people in RL.

Luckystar – Life is bloody difficult. I hope you reach that place of inner peace. You sound like a strong woman,

Anabelle – Thank you. I have got a new phone and deleted all social media so he cannot contact me. He was persistent and my head was a mess but I knew what I had to do. Sadly it is real life. Nothing is black and white (if only it were that simple!)

Twenty – I think you’re right, it is the constant deception that erodes the trust and if someone has repeatedly set out to deceive just to get their end away with as many people as possible then it would be a monumental leap to forgive and move on and a huge emotional risk. It sounds like you did the right thing by leaving in the end. There is only so much you can take.

User – It all comes down to money in the end ha ha!!

Oblomov – I’m sorry for the attack. You probably hit a raw nerve. What you said is true, I suppose I do feel threatened…and ashamed and guilty. I’ll be honest, when we were having lunch (often with other people), I never thought I was doing anything wrong. It was all so gradual and I got caught up in it. He is popular, intelligent and very charming and I suppose I was flattered at first. He got into my head. I am not trying to sound like a victim but he was so persistent and I lost myself in it all. I tried to halt things many times when I realized it was wrong but if I tried to take things back a notch he would actively ignore me in work and it created a horrible atmosphere so I just let it carry on (the constant flattery, the gifts, letters etc). It was all or nothing for him and that’s why I have to leave my job. I was a fool.

Purpleglass – I understand why you feel like that. For me though, there is no contract. It’s two people who love each other who can and often do slip up. If you know someone is being honest and is truly sorry then it’s all about whether you can re-invest and move on. I would have said I would never do anything like this…..until it happened. I’m not sure about your situation but it sounds more complicated and only you know your own boundaries.

Bedreaggled – You did what you thought was best at the time which is all we can do. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. At least you know now though.

What tends to happen as an initial reaction when you have been unfaithful is minimising. I sense some of this in your post but understand your need for anonymity.

I agree that there is never an excuse or reason to be unfaithful, however, it doesn’t always mean that your relationship is doomed either.

I do feel for your partner as he will be going through countless feelings and emotions right now and for a very long time, regardless of how he is presenting himself to you. Don’t underestimate what your actions and choices have done to another person. If working through it is good for the both of you, and you have been completely honest with your partner then that can only be a good thing. Just bare in mind that should you have minimised things or not been 100% honest, the truth has a way of coming back to haunt you. It can sometimes take many years too which is the hardest part.

With regard to advice to other? You can never truly walk in another person shoes and know what they are going through, even if you think that you have been through the same thing. You are still you, with your thoughts, feelings and experiences wearing the other persons shoes.

The reaction of other people IRL was on of the reasons I limited the people I told to those who would have my back not people who would be disturbed by the change in status quo. It is hard enough to deal with infidelity without everyone yelling at you to do X or Y and getting angry with you when you don't. MN was quite hard to cope with at times but I could always switch off the laptop.

There's a lot of minimising and self justification in your posts, OP. You're basically saying lots of people are unfaithful so it's not a big deal. It's true that lots of people stray (though lots more don't), but unless you and your partner have agreed in advance that monogamy is a social construct you reject, it's still a big deal.

I don't think I am miniminsing but maybe I'm wrong. I was never hard line about the issue beforehand but I didn't ever think I would be in this position.

When friends in the past have had issues around this kind of thing I was never black and white about it and I know lots of people who have been affected by infidelity.

If I am minimising at all it is because I know I am doing the right thing now. I have stopped all contact, I'm leaving my job and I am thoroughly ashamed of myself but I will not beat myself with a shitty stick for the rest of my life because I made a mistake. Nor will I allow other people to make me feel any worse about myself or my relationship with my partner. I know what I did and I won't do it again.

Yes, I possibly am comparing myself to others who have done a lot worse (and their partners have no idea). This is possibly a way of stopping myself from thinking I'm a complete twat who can never be trusted when I know that's not true.

My partner is dealing with it well and we have spoken at length about it. I already feel like we know each other a bit more and understand where our relationship was going wrong. We both want to put things right. Had he been the 'betrayer' I would do the same.

We are not robots and we have emotions and feelings sometimes beyond our control. Sometimes we do stupid things. It doesn't mean that mumsnetters (and society in general) should pounce on the opportunity to throw puritan and sanctimonious judgement that makes people feel even shittier.

Let he without sin and all that.......

And I am certainly not saying it is no big deal. It really is. But it doesn't define me or my relationship. I won't let it. I will do everything I can to put things right. If I can't then we both have to move on but I doubt that will happen because we love each other and care about each other. That's the bottom line.

The biggest mistake is allowing your relationship to suffer. The affair is not a mistake, it’s a choice. There are lots of things that you can put in place to ensure that this doesn’t happen again. You can say it won’t, however, the fact is, you had issues in your relationship, as we all do and you built a wall between you and your partner and created something with someone else. The grass is only greener where you water it.

Until you accept that you did choose to do this and there are no circumstances that warrant it - you could do it again.

saraj it’s very easy for you to talk as you are because you’re not the one who’s been betrayed. I’d love to hear your dh side of things.
I agree that it sounds as if you are justifying and minimising. You chose to be deceitful and to hurt your husband.its very hard to forgive when you’ve been betrayed.

Can I ask what the biggest motivator for leaving your job is too? It’s a massive decision as whilst I agree it is the right decision in most situations like this ( at least for one of you to leave) are you sure that there won’t be any resentment attached. Are you doing it for the right reasons?

As could you, none of us are immune.

To be fair, it was largely my partner who built a wall. He was working long hours and then coming home and spending all of his time on his computer. I went to bed alone most nights. We never went out, on holiday or had any quality time together at all. I told him how unhappy I was repeatedly but he didn't listen.

I am not making excuses. I was lonely and felt like I was living as a single parent half the time. I did everything with the kids on my own.

It was this 'wall' that left us vulnerable. We were not communicating and I had on many occasions thought about leaving. I'm glad I didn't.

Although I regret what I did I am hoping that some good is coming from it. He has promised to put me first and me him. I will never be glad it happened but it may too have served a purpose in being a wake up call for both of us.

I am leaving my job because the man will not back off. I want a fresh start.

Where was the deception by the way?

Won’t back off in what way? As I was advised in here - have you tried HR? If he harrassing you? If you blocked him or removed social media, is he doing it in person at work? That’s out of order and probably harassment if unwelcome.

Oh and I can assure you that I am immune. I can guarantee that I have never and would never have an affair. If I was unhappy and couldn’t solve it, I would leave. I have In the past, left with nothing but the clothes on my back. Life is too short and I don’t agree with breaking trust. I trust very few and it’s a gift to have someone trust.

He's not a bad person. He just won't let go. I think he knew that I wasn't happy at home (we have mutual friends) and he kept using that to try and get me to leave my partner. I may sound like I'm following 'the script' here but I was genuinely in a bad place.

He kept on and on about it when I asked him not to. When I told him I couldn't speak to him anymore, he would make a big deal of it and turn his back on me in the staff room or in meetings. Then I would try and make things okay again by chatting and it would start all over. This is why I have to leave.