Not speaking

[wild]

I just want an objective opinion. I have been living with dp since just before ds was born. It's his house, mine is let out. We have three floors the first two nice the bottom one was let out and is a bit of a shambles. No garden. DS is now approaching two and I am keen to move so that we have a little bit of outside space. DP is scared of change and very mean with money and I'd put the idea on back burner I have friends with gardens, then there's park etc, it didn't seem too bad. On Saturday he pointed out an absolutely fab house in the paper and said it seemed a good idea, I was gobsmacked and said I'd phone for an appointment, which he agreed to. He then went to pick up his 14 year old son who stays with us at weekends (he's here for a week now as its summer hols). His son called twice on his behalf on the way back, once to ask what we wanted from shop second time to say did we want to go to beach and I said we had this appointmetn at 3.30. To be fair I was a bit off hand cos ds was throwing a tantrum and would not go upstairs and I was weighed down with shopping myself (the boring stuff that he would not thiknt to buy like bleach). When dp got back ds and I wwere having lunch, he went absolutely mad, firstly taht I had shopped and nto told him ad he had bought fruit as well, then he said what was for lunch then and when I said what woudl you like he said dont worry I'll do it and started throwing things around the kitchen. He made lunch for son and him and said by the way cancel the appointment I've decided its not a good idea. I put ds down for rest and when he got up I just took him out to get away I gave dp the number and told him to cancle the appt himslef. I don't think he did though, we just didn't turn up (which I hate). Since then I have been sleeping downstairs and we are not speakign at all, DP is doing everything for his son (for the first time ever) but ds and I are pariahs, totally ignored and I don't know where its all going to end. I dont care about the house, of course I would like to live somewhere thats a family home but the most important thing to me is that everyone in the house is happy and there is equality and respect. Am I wrong to respond like this to his temper tantrum? I am normally a lot more conciliatory but this time I felt it was the last straw. I'm on the verge of giving my tenant ntoice and moving out.

Sounds like your DP has got some real deep-rooted issue about the house, moving and the future with you. It needs to be sorted soon. You're not wrong to be this angry - I would be too. He has to decide if he's with you, and if he is that means moving to a more suitable house and getting on with it. If he doesn't want to do that, I suspect that means it's because he's not entirely sure he wants to commit to you. Sorry, don't want to be negative, but he's not acting like someone with an eye on building for the future.

It sounds as though he's still thinking in terms of "this is mine - that's yours" rather than as a partnership. I would have been angry to and tbh would be wondering if he had engineered the row so that he had a good excuse not to go to the appointment.

In any case ignoring your ds sounds incredibly immature to me. Any disagreement should be between the two of you. He shouldn't be dragging the children into it too.

wild - I'm sympathise, I really do. As the appointment had been made and as it was his idea, I think he's in the wrong. It sounds like a power trip, saying "cancel the appointment, I've decided it's not a good idea". What happened to talking it over? If you were happy to look at the property, then surely he knows that you'd be open to the idea of moving (even if he didn't already, which he did), so, it's a "I'm more powerful than you are" thing, by the sounds of it. But perhaps that's just me talking as that's what it is in my own relationship. At best he was being pig-headed and inconsiderate. I agree about equality and respect. That's something I don't have but that I think is essential in a relationship. I don't think that'll help at all, but I do sympathise.

Thanks you three . You're all right, yes it is a power trip, yes he did engineer a row and no he probably doesn't want to commit, not just to me but to anyone. I just needed to hear it from outside. It can get to the stage where you think its all your fault and there's something tragically wrong with you (maybe I should have been standing there in my apron with a nice lunch all ready for them). Then again, I work full-time, I muddle along but I always do my best. About a month ago I changed my job to a local one and went full time to take strain off him - I did it purely for love of the family. I don't think he understands the concept of selflessness, but then he had an odd upbringing without a lot of love imo and he's never really learned about relationships. I've had enough! DS really loves his dad, don't want to lose that. We'll just have to be more adult about things. In fact I think I will telephone him later and break the ice (or something!) so many many thanks again. Feel like a human being again and not some kind of sad freak.

wild - Good, I'm glad that you're feeling better after our support! Good luck!

Best of luck, Wild.

speaks loudly of control issues here, definitely exerting power the only way he can, that's actually a compliment, you must be a very strong and stable person to make him feel so damn male about everything.
Some men never learn to share, my dad never did and my mum left him.
I hope you manage to talk soon and resolve issues and enjoy your relationship again....
Must be demoralising to have the us and them feeling atm...

Yes it is awful I dread going home. I am very fond of dp's big son too and I feel for him tho I think he's happy to have his dad's undivided attention for once. DP even went out to play football with him for first time since I've known him! so its not all bad. But its hugely awkward for me to creep around the house like a feeble kind of burglar and dp is quite disloyal, in Jan I was pregnant and feeling really ill, I was going to my parents a lot for a bit of tlc even though they live 2 hours away and he told his son I was going away cos I didn't want him around, which I felt SOOO bad about, yes I was struggling coping with a todler and a teenager and cooking fryups all the time making me v nauseous, but I hope I always made him welcome. DS also loves his big brother a lot. (I lost baby in Feb btw - 12 weeks -, while DP was on a rugger weekend with 'the boys', and at the time I was devastated tho now I think it was just as well, poor Gabriella). So far I've been trying so hard to see the positive side of dp, like he took me to Rome, he is getting more considerate, all good things, but I've been ignoring some really monstrous things. I'm not a saint either, I drink too much sometimes and I am quite over-emotional, probably an inappropriate quality for a man like that. Thanks for the comment about your mum and dad. I don't think these men can help the selfishness, its another charactersitic like black hair. I think dp has made some really big steps towards family life but with set-backs like this my patience is waning, and the less I conciliate the worse the rows will be. I'm not brave enough to phone up now after all, I'll get too upset just thinking about it. I think I have to make THAT decision, you know the one.

so what should i do, my tenant has just emailed me to say she wants to sign another 6 month agreement, the last one just ran out and I have done nothing about it. She is also a friend and I was giving her cheap rent in return for a bit of care to the property, she is a struggling artist with not much cash and will find it difficult to get another deal like ths straight away i'd imagine. Tho she has just met a MAN up North and has her eyes on moving in with him one day. Perhaps I'll just leave it as a friendly agreement that she looks around, no pressure. How do I live in the meantime tho? and shoudl I ask DP what he thinks about me leaving or just do it. We've had the converstaion a few times before mainly him tring to throw me out when ds was small and makign a racket. I think I'm answering my own questions here but You Gotta Let Me Know ....

wild - I'm so sorry to hear about your miscarriage. It must have been terrible, and especially so if dp wasn't being supportive at the time.

I'm probably going to sound a bit over assertive here, so apologies in advance.

I'd say to put your needs first over those of your tenant. As she is also your friend, I think you should explain that you're going through a difficult time yourself at the moment and that you might (or do) need the house yourself. You might be a bit stuck legally, possibly, if you don't put things on a legal footing asap as the last agreement has run out and a new one hasn't been agreed and signed.

As for your relationship with dp, perhaps a trial separation of living accommodation or of the relationship won't be such a bad thing. I've had my dh being very disloyal in the past and, tbh, it has ruined our relationship completely. Of course, I've not been perfect, but he frequently ignores my needs and feelings.

It does sound as though he's making life horrible just for you to be the one to either give way continually or else pack up and go.

I'm sorry if that sounds all wrong.

No, that sounds v sensible.
Its what I'm thinking when I use my head. Hearing it from someone who doesn't know us is so helpful. As for trial separation there wd be no going back if I leave. We're in a village and i'm sure he will be pretty vitriolic abt me to 'his' friends. Luckily I have a few of my own here now (he has lived here 20+ years, me only a few). Also he will use £ as a weapon. I know all this and it used to put me off a lot but honestly I think once I am on my feet again I will be OK, possibly even more than OK! thanks again for your support. Are you still with dh, and if so how do you cope?

wild - I'm glad my post was ok. I do worry about posting incase someone says "No, that's completely wrong" as I think my confidence is pretty low generally, now.

Anyway...I've stayed with dh mainly because I'd hate to be without the kids if we separated, even if he only had them for a few days and nights a week. There have been a few other things that link us, but several have gone now, and one more will be going soon. Also, he earns a lot more than me and I don't want to be poor. Also, all my inheritance money has gone into the marriage and it wouldn't be given back to me if we split up. I hope that doesn't sound dreadful. Do I sound shallow? I really, really have tried to make it work, but it just hasn't. Looking back, I wish I'd made the break earlier. But then I know I wouldn't have been able to cope with being without the kids whilst he saw them. They'll be grown up in 10 years, so I have that long left to wait.

wild - Sorry, I forgot to say that if you do go ahead and separate, the people who know you (and know him) will know what "rings true" and what doesn't. It probably wouldn't harm to say to him that you're going to keep things to yourself and you expect he'll do the same. Gossip only lasts if there's news being fed to it. HTH.

hi butterflybaby you sound really confident and sorted to me!
I can understand, its never easy to make the break. It sounds so daunting tho, ten years ... couldn't you and he could come to an arrangement over access etc? we see dp's son most weekends but many fathers seem to do fortnightly weekends. And when they grow up they move away, so what about you? surely you have a right to a life. and the money, i know .. same situation here only he wouldn't marry my cos he's freaked out about alimony - you'd get that tho, wouldn't you? plus he's have to maintain the children. Look at that recent case of Mrs Footballer! But I am not trying to persuade you to go in any way, I just feel so bad for you. Having decided to stay I suppose you just live your own life within the partnership and make it a happy one regardless. I was so naive before this I used to think all couples were happy at least liked each other deep down or else split up but now I know a bit more about life I realise how wrong that is. One lady I know (respectable, outwardly v conventional older lady) says she got married cos preg and told her dh back then that she'd stay with him til ds was 16, so that is what she did!! they had a lot more stamina in those days that I seem to have! children make things difficult tho, I am so worried about my ds losing his dad.

wild - Thanks for your post.

Yes, it's a long time to wait and I need to make my life happy while those years pass. I haven't achieved it yet, but I'm working on it. I do need to talk to him, though, incase he thinks I'm happy even if I'm clearly not. I think he ignores anything that isn't what he wants to see or hear. And yes, although I'm not in the same league as Mrs Footballer, the improvements in the divorce laws are good for me.

Anyway......in exactly what way are you afraid of ds losing his dad? Can I reassure you at all?

just the day to day things, waking up and coming into our bed in the mornings, having dad on hand, bath, taking out on bike etc. DS is just under two and a really happy loving little boy. Access arrangements are never going to be the same - I have example of dp's bigger son whose life is not what i'd wish it to be for ds. I can make things tolerable at home (if I tow the line and much of the time its OK (tho not more than OK) - there's really no time to worry about it, you just get on with it with children don't you? I wonder if I'm justified in depriving ds of the everyday love and stability he has now and I wonder if what I can provide as single parent is better. Only this row is so bad I dont think there is any choice left.

wild - Yes, I understand. The day to day things are important. But then your dp does have to respect, like and love you, and openly too, for your relationship to thrive. If you want to try again, I think he needs to know exactly what you need and want. A deadline for improvements might be necessary, too. Can you write down what you want in bullet point form and see what it entails? If they aren't major changes, then perhaps he can change.

A good idea. Writing it down may make things clearer, for me. I always have deadlines in my head, 'maybe things will get better when X or Y'. I guess that's how time passes, so maybe this time I'll have one for if things don't get better. A week, possibly It would be a bad thing to try to talk to him about this until things have settled as I'm 100% in the wrong in his eyes and he is quite scary when he's cross, not physical just a kind of psychic menance. Respect, like and love don't seem to crop up a lot, I really wonder why he is with me as he rarely has a good word to say for me. Thanks, you seem a very sensible kind person and I am sorry your dh doesn't realise this.

wild - I understand. I wonder why dh is with me when he doesn't seem interested in me at all. Good luck with whatever you decide. I'll try to keep an eye on this thread to see how you are. I'd better go and have some lunch, it's late! (I'm hopeless at making food if it's just for me!)

wild - is there anyway you and the tenant could share your place, or is there just not enough space for you to do that?

wild - just been catching up on the thread. it does sound like your partner has issues that he needs to resolve, and sounds very difficult and insecure. tbh unless your partner tries to resolve his insecurities and accepts how he is behavingly controlling to you, i suspect that it may not be a healthy environment for your son to grow up - you say that things are OK if you "tow the line", but only mostly OK. Do you want your son to grow up having to "tow the line" or believing it is OK to treat you disrespectfully/controllingly?

wild - I'm not sure if I understood your post correctly. Have you given her another 6 month lease? Sorry to be pedantic, but is this an official document? I used to work in an office with this type of paperwork and I know how important it is that it's drawn up correctly and signed, dated, etc etc. I would strongly urge you to get it on a legal footing if it isn't already.

As for your dp, he is behaving incredibly badly. I agree with mts. Your dp's behaviour to you is bad for everyone, including your ds. Your dp is being an awful role model. Have you told him that you're thinking of moving out? His reaction to that would tell you whether he felt you had a future together and would be willing to sort things out, or not. If you do decide to leave, you'll need to find out what you're entitled to. I know you're not married, but still. Have you got a local Citizens Advice Bureau? They'd be able to help and point you in the right direction ie solicitors and stuff.

I'm sorry that your ds is having a difficult time in the nursery atm. I hope it improves very soon.

Take care.

wild - sorry to hear that dp is being even more difficult. unless his behaviour significantly improves, I would be very wary of being financially dependent on him. tbh if he feels that you cannot afford to leave him, he will have no incentive to improve his behaviour, and tho in the short term he may feel more secure, in the long term he will feel less secure, if he thinks you are only staying with him for financial reasons, and this is likely to make his behaviour worse. i do understand what you mean - it is so easy for us to say "leave him, leave him" - but so hard in real life - for one thing, in real life people do tend to have some redeeming characteristics, no matter how shitty their behaviour - after all, very very few, if any people are 100% bad.