Are men and women growing apart generally?

[Lifeisntbad]

Just had a chat with a friend about this. My male and female acquaintances sometimes (with some exceptions) seem so different in outlook that I wonder about this. Obviously they are different from each other as well.
In my immediate circle of 40 /50 somethings the women are generally resourceful independent sociable and open. Many (not all) of the men are depressed, with no enthusiasm, slightly isolated and in some cases a little bitter.
While in one way gender differences seem to be blurring which can only be a good thing, in other ways men and women seem increasingly on different paths, coming together perhaps for having children and then diverging again.

Were these lazy men less lazy before you married them or were the signs there and you chose to ignore them?

So those three things out of the list...

Buried under a mountain of shitwork? When you said you just don’t notice shitwork that needs doing? I call bullshit...

There is a very particular aspect of being a woman that men virtually never feel which is constantantly being told all you are good for is drudgery and that if you find something other than that that you are good at it must not detract from your drudgery burden...

It’s so grindingly unfulfilling to be thought of that way...

Yes, less lazy before we married...

He became ‘incapable’ of things like cleaning, washing, paying bills etc after marriage despite being single and living alone for 15 years before I met him.

If I had never been a single parent before I would have found it much harder to leave him TBH. I already knew I could do it and felt I had little to lose as I already did everything...

It's about the battle for control. I think, ultimately, one partner wears the trousers. Its all well people saying that they agree everything as a couple but it's impossible to agree on everything, even after a lengthy discussion, so someone has to break ties.

Historically, men had authority and I think to a large extent they still do.

It's not really about outcomes. Getting men to begrudgingly do half of the house work won't solve the problem because the power is still in their hands. They will do the childcare if it suits them but they can stop at any time knowing their partner will pick up the slack. Women don't have that luxury.

But as women get older, the power balance shifts. They are confident and financially independent. They don't worry about the kids who have left home and no longer have the social pressure to stay married. All the while men remain as emotionally dependent on their wives as ever. Women can then have the relationship on their terms and men hate it.

I think the drift is because there is only room for one dominant partner in a relationship. We all wish our partners would do what we want them to. As women gain more power over their domestic lives, there are inevitably power struggles in relationships, discontent and separations.

Were these lazy men less lazy before you married them

Before there were children, there was less to do.

It's easy to fail to notice laziness when you can get by both doing not much.

Why do you think women care about shitwork?

Do you understand the burden of having to care about shitwork because men, by and large, don’t take any responsibility for it?

And how despondent it makes women feel when men shrug and say ‘why does anyone need to care about it?’ Because it totally erases the contribution that many women make at great cost to themselves and for no benefit....

I don’t really know why we bother trying to tell men this tbh. What are the magic words that will make men believe women, on almost any topic?

‘As a bloke [insert what a million women just said]’

😩

All the drudgery yes, all by yourself with no/limited support from a partner. Where the shitwork is firmly your responsibility and not just the shitwork related to your child but related to your partner and their and your elderly relatives... oh and that society expects you to do it every time you are in a relationship because of your gender...

So no, not just the standard cleaning/cooking/looking after your child but the mental load and the burden of responsibility with no ‘if I don’t do it someone else will’ back up plan...

Oh and with social sanctions if you don’t do it...

But why would men care less. Because they have their priorities right, is that it?

Just to throw a spanner into this - has genetics got anything to do with it and the difference between male and female brains - maybe we are trying to reach an ideal that will never be obtained.

If housework and child rearing was given the respect it deserves by society and by both men and women perhaps more women would choose to stay at home.

But when you have made this decision jointly with the father of your kids who then 20 years later decides to trade you in and society says tough luck dear better get back to work now - what woman in her right mind is going to choose to do this. She wants children but knows that she has to keep her career going in case she is on the scrap heap further down the line.

The father has no incentive because despite doing bugger all childrearing when he decides he's had enough of the wife he can still get to see his kids, with the RP still doing the majority even if it is shared and if he's really lucky society will let him get away with paying as little as possible to maintain this putting even more pressure on the mother.

This is the problem there are double standards all over the place the left hand contradicting the right. Until men WANT to contribute equally without having to be asked, or told society will split further apart.

I can assure you that most women will think I CBA with the relentless drudgery of it all, cooking meals day in day out that end up in the bin, clearing up endless times after kids and men but if they don't do it who will - there is no fairy doing it all!

No, what i’m responding to is you saying ‘men care less we are just different’.

What I am saying is that attitude is not ok. Why should men get the privilege of caring less just for being male? What about the women who don’t care about shitwork? On what basis do you think women care about shitwork (for any reason other than they have to because men by and large don’t)?

I think you’re on dodgy ground with “male and female brains”.

There is no such thing as the male and female brain...

And no, the problem is not relationships, it’s male privilege!

Whether a woman is in a relationship or not in a relationship, has kids or doesn’t, the shitwork falls to them... it’s the daughters who care for sick relatives, the mothers who care for the children and the wives who care for the children and all of this enables men to ‘not care’...