Am I mad to end my marriage because he won't put the bins out?

[toastandjamplease]

Hi all,

Namechanged to protect the innocent! Apologies that I think this will be a long one but don’t want to dripfeed! I have been married just over 20 years. We have 3 DCs, all high-school age. We both work FT, although my husband works much longer hours than me with lots of travel. My OH does most of the taxi-ing on weekends, taking kids to football on Saturday mornings etc. He also cooks on the weekend and takes care of everything IT-related. We have a cleaner who keeps the house just about under control.

However, everything else is done by me. That is, all the school runs, after school activities, laundry, shopping, most of the cooking, DIY, day-to-day tidying etc. I have always done more than him but things have fallen even more on me as his job has involved more and more travel. He is supposed to do the laundry when he is here but does maybe 1 load in 10 and only when I ask him to put the wash on.

We recently moved house, which has brought things to a head. It is not massive but has a large garden and it quite remote. It was very much my choice and I cannot tell you how much I love where we live now. But it is too much for me to do all the above single-handed. I have told my husband (repeatedly) that I cannot do this any more. I work 40 hours a week on top of doing pretty much everything around the house and garden and I am exhausted. More than anything, it is not just the practical side of this but the emotional. That is, I feel like though I am constantly looking out for everyone yet there is never anyone there to look out for me. If I forget to do something, it just won't get done.

At Christmas, I told him that I couldn't do this anymore and unless he started showing a bit more support then I would be asking for a divorce. I gave him a couple of very clear examples of what I mean. First, he has never changed the beds in 20 years of marriage. I told him that makes me feel like he takes it for granted it’s my job and is demeaning. Second, in the 3 years we have lived here, he has never put the rubbish out – it seems like even the laziest husbands talked about on here “do the bins” and he won’t even do that. Last week, I forgot to put the bins out so (of course) the rubbish didn't get collected. I am so sick of being in charge of practically bloody everything. At Christmas, I told him that these things are like little snapshots of how everything is left to me. In effect I was giving him a couple of very simple things he could do to show that he was listening to me. But, since then, he hasn’t taken the rubbish out once or changed a sheet.

My husband works very hard, he earns a lot more than I do, and he is a very generous person. We bought this house because it was what I wanted, it is not his thing at all but he wanted me to be happy. He is brilliant in a crisis. We agree almost entirely on priorities re. the children and I would say that he is a great father, but I know that part of being a great parent is setting a good example to your children and I think we are both setting a poor example – him by being lazy around the house and me by being a martyr about all things domestic!

Given how I have laid out my stall, I feel like he is giving me no choice but to tell him this is over. But it feels like such a drastic step. In particular, it will mean selling the house and probably moving much closer to the kids’ school. The kids will be fine with the move (I think) as they will be nearer friends etc. but will be heartbroken about us splitting up. In practice, he spends half the year away anyway so I’m hoping in practical terms I can keep things on an even keel for them. I feel so awful about the whole thing but it’s like he’s given me no choice - I have told him how I feel and he has demonstrated time and again that he will not value what I do around the place or help in any of the ways I have asked him to. Since we moved house, the argument has almost moved beyond what is fair to what is possible – I just cannot do it anymore.

So, I guess I am looking for reassurance on a few things. I am terrified we’ll all end up worse off in every way and it will all be my fault as I’ve allowed this situation to develop but am suddenly saying no more! The questions I keep turning over in my head are these:

• Am I being reasonable to divorce my husband because he won’t put the bins out (and take on other things around the house)?
• Will the kids understand why these things are such a big deal or will they blame me?
• Will I get over selling this lovely house to move somewhere cheaper and more practical? I can hardly bear to think about it but it will have to be done.

Any thoughts would be welcome. I haven’t spoken to a soul about this is RL and am terrified of what I think I’m about to do... Thank you!

Had been thinking the same as Lweji. OP should definitely not feel she needs to cut her hours just to keep the show on the road, in fact, if I was her I might want to start to get my career back on track. One reason for moving again, this time to a more manageable house, might be a more manageable mortgage, so that her DH can work a more manageable amount of hours and contribute more of his share - and maybe OP could be working at upskilling/getting back into a more satisfying work role. Especially now the kids are getting older.

Op you are lucky you have a husband who is willing to hire in help for you. I don't know anyone personally that is lucky enough to have a cleaner, let alone have their husband suggest a gardener as well.
My mother worked full time 60 hours a week, took care of 4 children and did everything on her own, whilst my father worked away 6 months at a time.
So for everyone saying there should be 50/50 split of chores, think of the women who's husbands are in the army for example. Not all of us are blessed with having a husband who is there to share the housework, let alone have a cleaner.

Op you are lucky you have a husband who is willing to hire in help for you.

FFS

Seconding that FFS. Bloody hell.

So ops husband is the one who's paying for everything. Ops 40 hour a week wages pay for fuck all yeah?

Op you are lucky you have a husband who is willing to hire in help for you

For her? The help is for her? Is it just her house then? Or is it that the housework is automatically her responsibility?

I can't believe the responses saying "hire a cleaner more hours!" "go part-time" "move house!".
It's bizarre watching people tie themselves in knots thinking of ways OP can solve the issue without having to inconvenience Mr Big Stuff one tiny iota.
Why should a grown woman cut back her work hours so she can do more housework, rather than the other adult stepping up, marshaling the kids and pulling his damn weight??
Maybe she has career ambitions? Maybe she gets respect and status at work?
And so the fuck what if someone else, somewhere once worked more hours, and had more kids, and a more useless husband. Life is always harder for someone. Marriage (so I'm told) is about teamwork, not one party slogging away while the other one chooses to abdicate responsibility.
If it wasn't for Lweji and motherinferior, and a few others I would think I had slipped into some space time continuum to somewhere in 1959...

Still agog at curtain opening being included under the list of kids "chores". With this in mind I doubt very much that OP has unreasonably high demands from anyone let alone her DH!

What I meant was op is lucky she has a husband who agrees that they need a cleaner.
Not many women have a cleaner or a gardener.
I know couples where they both work their butts off, yet they can't afford a cleaner let alone a Gardner and the last bloody thing they would be worrying about would be who changes the beds or takes the bins out.

Either there are a loads of entitled little fusspots on MN or you've all had it too easy.

Like I said my mother had 4 kids and a full time job and my dad wasn't around for months due to work, she didn't have a cleaner yet she managed.

Just stop making the beds and taking the bins out, let the rats get involved, but don't get divorced over it for Christ sake, it's hardly the end of the world!.

When I was still married to ExH, I did all the bins, the lightbulb changes that required the stepladder, carrying in fuel for the fire, taking down the Christmas tree, etc, and it made me seethe and fume as I was a sahm with four little ones.

Now that he is gone, I still have to do all these things - true. The jobs don't disappear. It's still just me doing them. But I am reminded every time that, even if he was here, he wouldn't be any bloody help anyway. The resentment of a non-participating partner is so draining and disillusioning because they elect not to help run the household. Take him/her out of the equation and that anger seeps away. It is the feeling that in a partnership the shit jobs are left to one person that is so dispiriting.

Just 3rd-ing the FFS.

If it's like my relationship OP not only found and trained the cleaner how to take care of the house, but also schedules her and finds the cash to pay her (or the company) because her DH isn't even aware of what day the cleaner comes.

Hire a cleaner for her. Hahahahahahaah.

Op said her dh works 'much longer hours with lots of travel' so of course he will be doing a lot less in the house, if he's not actually physically there.

He does all of the cooking and child-related taxiing on the weekend, including Saturday morning football and so on.

Household income pays for a cleaner and gardener, and their recent house move was op's choice.

None of this sounds unfair to me.

I don't think the details of who does exactly what matter. OP feels used and under-appreciated. She is entirely entitled to feel like that, even if other people wouldn't in the same circumstances. In her shoes I would have downed tools long ago, does that make me an entitled princess? Or does it just mean I fucking hate housework as well and I don't see the state of the house as entirely my problem?

I have a job that entails travel and also a long commute. I have a large amount of dead time available as a result. I use it to do things like arrange DD's activities and appointments by email and other household chores I can do online like buying groceries, buying the next size up clothes etc. Not all housework involves being physically in the house, but all housework involves being mentally engaged and seeing the house as your problem to deal with.

OP you sound just like me a few years ago, I seriously considered ending a 20 year relationship because I didn't think my dp cared about me in exactly the way you described, I resented him hugely, he thought I was always nagging him.

I reevaluated our relationship and what attracted me to him in the beginning which was not his willingness to wash up! The good things were all still there just buried under day to day drudgery. I took control of doing everything and tbh most chores don't take too long if you are organised and get a routine going.

I became happier as I wasn't seething that he hadn't done the chores I expected him to do, I took control of all our finances too and was able to make lots of savings so did reduce my working hours so although I do most of the housework I have organised it so I now also have more free time for myself. As I control the finances I also make the decisions about big spends such as holidays and new cars etc. this is my 'compensation' for dealing with all the other stuff.

Funnily enough as I have relaxed and taken the pressure off my dp he is also happier and now does much more than he used to, he has done more diy in the last 2 years than the previous 10, he has started putting the bins out most weeks, he shows he appreciates what I do in other ways, gifts, flowers, coffee in bed in the morning.

I know for many women this won't work but equality doesn't have to mean splitting everything 50/50, it's about mutual respect, compassion and care and we lost that for a while arguing over who did the most housework.

He is lazy and entitled imv.
Think calmly and make a plan. Won't eldest be driving soon and do the ferrying.
Get cleaner who can deal with laundry and get gardener . He pays.
Perhaps meal out once or twice a week. Make some me time when you are out and he is in charge so. You lose resentment.

The only thing that puzzles me about this thread is why there is so much work to be done. I live in a four bedroom house with a large garden and teenagers. dh is currently working away during the week, and I work full time (but with a short commute).

My teens do their own washing, cook a meal once a week and help with cleaning for an hour or so (we can pretty much clean the house between the three of us in an hour if we work hard). I do pretty much all the gardening unless I can bribe a child to help. During the week I don't expect to spend more than an hour and a half or so a night on chores, less at the weekend, so I have plenty of spare time.

It seems that a lot of the extra work is about ferrying teenagers about, gardening and doing DIY on the house. These to me seem to be the consequences of the remote house. That doesn't mean that I think the OP's dh should be let off the hook for domestic laziness, he does sound like a lazy bugger, but I think the OP needs to be honest about where the extra work is coming from, and think about addressing the issues (are so many activities necessary, is car pooling possible, is the remote house really a good option for teenager etc).

Wow. Do everything and consider yourself lucky for him doing a bit of work here and there and giving you tea in bed.

Funnily enough, willingness to do the wash-up is a very attractive characteristic for me.

I'm surprised so many people think it's unfair.

If I regularly walked through the door at 8-9pm, after two nights working away, to find a list of chores from my dp - who got home at 5-6pm daily - I wouldn't be impressed.

I'd also resent doing stuff that my idle teenage children could've done for themselves.

I'd also be irritated to be told how much extra work was a result of a house move I hadn't wanted in the first place.

Do you really feel that he has a lot more free time than you op, or is it more about lack of appreciation?

I agree with previous suggestions to help cut workload and resentment for everyone.

Do you really feel that he has a lot more free time than you op

See the OP's replies to previous similar questions.

Ha, Lweji, I know some people will think it's bad but it's just washing up, a five minute job, for me it is not worth making a battle over it, as I said, I willingly do this stuff now and get my fulfilment over having control in other areas, we have far better holidays now I am in charge and just decide where and when we are going rather than when it was a joint discussion 😁

Already done that.

Op gets home at 5 and taxis teenagers most nights until 7 before doing any chores.

Op's dh is out until 9, but is also away a lot.

On weekends he does Saturday morning taxiing before relaxing, while op does chores in the afternoon.

I see the race to the bottom is still on…

He does Saturday morning taxiing unless he wants a lie- in or might have to talk to other parents.

He does also sometimes cook pasta.

He does nothing else.

I thought my husband was a bit if a lazy arse because he doesn't do any laundry, but does manage to do a share of other domestic chores. Clearly I am #soblessed and will start warming his slippers so that he doesn't have to strain himself.

He does a fair bit. As a single parent you would do it all and have to see your children going off to his place for visits. Do you have the emotional resources to cope with him finding someone else and perhaps pretty soon? Then your children could be visiting him and a live-in girlfriend. It is what men tend to do. Could you face moving from the house you love? Is there no possibility of buying in some more hours of help or cutting your work hours? I know you want him to notice and do it off his own bat but, again, some men tend to need very specific instructions - a written-down, daily or weekly timetable perhaps. Infuriating and demoralising for you. Been there and I got out. What came after was traumatic - beware of knowing what you want...

I have similar issues with my DH so I know that for you it is as much that you feel your needs are not listned to as much as the job not being done. Becoming a nag is a relationship killer for both of you, but if you have talked about it lots and still no change it feels like they just dont give a shit.

My dd is just high school age and she hoovers downstairs, makes her and siblings lunch, feeds animals, does dishwasher and mucks out a pony every day. She also folds washing and other odd jobs if I need and cooks dinner at least once a week. Our ds will be expected to do the same as he gets older (big gap between them) A family is a team, sounds like it might be the kids you need to work on.

No advice but this article might be worth a read: www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/apr/15/why-mothers-should-expect-less-of-themselves-and-more-of-their-partner