is there somekind of cycle/ emotional rollercoaster felt when you go nc?

[wizzywig]

me and my husband have gone nc with his parents and siblings. long story but they are narcissists and are very happy in their emeshed family set up. we broke away from it.
Whenever there are big occasions, eg, christmas, wedding anniversarys, birthdays, we tend to both feel very tense, and it feels like we are back on that horrible rollercoaster where you dissect everything they ever did and we have to go through the "we did the right thing didnt we?" process.

Is this normal? I just want to feel nothing towards them forever more. it
just seems that if we are in a situation, eg, we go away for a break, i get this instant, subconscious thought of "oh no, we havent told them we are going away. they wont know where we are, they wont like that". how long does it take for them to be out of our heads? thanks

Dont reply any furthur you will get drawn back in. Block and dont get involved. It may hurt now but in the long run you will be saving you and your husband and children massive problems. You will feel better about this the more time goes past and the less you think about all the things that happend. It wont get better if you keep communicating with them in any way though.
xxxx

Agree. If you get a response please don't reply. They are drawing you back into phase 1 of the cycle. (You know, the "nice" phase) the other phases of the cycle will, without doubt, follow. Don't go there.

Be strong, you have loads of support here xx

Agree as well. Ask yourself why they are doing it - it is because they ARE nice, or because they want to be able to tell everyone that they have tried so that you look like you are the mardy one.

It is really tough. We feel this sense of obligation to family for very good reasons - a family in which people help each other will thrive, so there is a good evolutionary reason for these strong feelings. I certainly hope my children will feel some obligations towards me after I've finished being necessary to their survival. But if its become damaging for you, you need to detach for the sake of yourself and the people who depend on you.

The message that i received in response to my one saying why are you contacting me Because all I want to do is help my brother and leaving you all alone doesn't seem to have made any difference. I thought you might want to try something different. You don't need to reply.
I dont want to be part of their plans to bring us back into the family. They are still wanting to control us arent they? Her saying 'i thought you might' means she thinks she knows what i want. And that being back in contact is the best thing.

Sorry wizzy. I think Christmas/New year is a time when LC/NC family members think they might have more of a chance of pricking your conscience. Imbroglio is right, we have an evolutionary obligation to stick together and it's quite powerful.

I don't think you should reply at all. If you posted this in Chat, you would get a lot of 'oh, they are really trying, don't knock them back'. Here, where many of us have been victims of narcissistic family -repeatedly- we know the routine and you know what will follow.

When I'm wavering (guilt) I re-read the list of spoken/written accusations against me and am astounded all over again. I even e-mailed a copy to DH when it blew up and reminded him that these are the reasons he will never be able to persuade to see them again. They have since re-written the script and denied ever saying any of those things (saying I am depressed and clearly want to break up the CLOSE family bond, hah!) The vitriolic e-mail accusations still remain though.....

And don't apologise wizzy for my collywobbles. The thread came along at the right time and everyone on here is really helping.

"she sounds so normal and reasonable" Yep, my MIL too. A respectable pillar of the local community and no-one would believe her actions. She doesn't either, having re-written the script and told us it was just misunderstandings. I was in such a bad place I almost doubted myself.

Stay strong!

Cross post, sorry. So slow

Don't reply! As said above, this will be the precurser to the nice concilliatory phase where you start to doubt yourself, think you might be wrong about them and maybe you have imagined it all. Unfortunately this is usually followed by the 'oh no, this is what they are really like, how could I have given them another chance, I feel like a fool' phase (in my experience).

Why is she contacting you and not him by the way? my mother used to do this, try and get to me via DH, but I never fell for it.

A lot of the time they will get back in contact so that they can tell other people that they have done the 'right thing' and tried to show you how much they care, rather than from any actual desire to move forward and fix things. Be very cautious here.

i just forwarded it to my husband. its making me too jittery and unsettled. yes i can imagine it is all done to show how they are trying to help. Until i actually started reading up on narcissism, i couldnt beleive that such oddness could exist. woodlandwanderer yes my inlaws all have very well thought of careers, they put on a good show, lots of "click like if you have a great mum like i do" posts on facebook etc etc.
my sil isnt quite up to the sophisticated level of narcissism that her mum is though. she will still slip up and say her priority is the happiness of her blood family, ie, parents, siblings, and nephews and not me. so i never get wedding anniversary cards, birthday cards. whereas my mil will always send me a cards (incorrectly named as ive kept my maiden name but she insists on putting my name with their surname). writing this all down instead of it being in my head really clarifies things for me.

Don't reply. Don't engage at all.

I have been NC for 18 months now. No going back this time, although there have been periods of NC before.

The cycle is slowly lessening for me. I find that DH and I have a discussion about it around major events, and that clears the system somewhat. But the further I move away from the memories, the more objectively I can see the situation, and see how batshit they really are.

It was technically my mum who instigated this NC, though I had been going LC for a year before it as I was in counselling. She was picking up on this, on her hold over me lessening, and the 6 weeks of a cold shoulder was a silent threat to make me fall back in line. When I didn't, she then began NC. I didn't blink. By that point I was ready for it and I wanted it too. But when I didn't blink, she attempted to push me into a reaction several times over the next 8 months...too long to go into here.

I didn't understand her behaviour fully at the time, and I started reading around on the subject, which helped me fully recognise what she was doing and why. Which was good, because her last attempt saw her really crossing a boundary that even a month before I wouldn't have been able to ignore. Knowing that she wanted my reaction was enough for me to be able to ignore. There has been silence ever since.

I really think that you and your DH should seek therapy. I have struggled with being NC, and that is after 10 months of private counselling. Doing it without that support, and trying to put mind over matter will be a million times more painful.

Give it more time and forgive: that is the only thing that will heal you and make you stop contemplating.

wizzy I feel it too. DH seems to have shut down his feelings over it (I know it was very painful for him at the time) and doesn't get why it makes me jittery and unsettled. I seem to have a visceral response when I know they're nearby or trying to get in touch. Someone suggested exploring Complex PTSD. Seemed a bit extreme, but actually some of it makes sense. They spent so long chipping away at us (well, me) and the resultant anxiety wasn't helped by my DH minimising their behaviours and making excuses for them. I thought I was going crazy!! . In his defence, it did seem rather unbelievable - coming from such a 'loving, close family'

I too have an enmeshed SIL and have kept my maiden name. Ouch.

Looking forward to the future when I'm further along like toasty. Glad the cycle is slowing down for you. I'm sure you've read up on this, but this link came up on another thread and I thought it very useful. Don't be put off by God's input in it

luke173ministries.org/466817

OP I think it just takes time, as some others have said. We are in the same position as you - we don't see DH's family apart from one sibling & his partner, and contact with them is few and far between now as it always feels awkward.

In the first year or so DH and I spent a lot of time going over the ifs and whys and how badly they had treated us. Christmas and birthdays would inevitably bring the subject up again. But over the years it's become something that we don't really talk about anymore, probably because when you're going over the same old story again and again it runs out of steam eventually and becomes the past, I think.

A couple of years ago I was talking to SIL who still sees DH's family and she tentatively brought up the subject. She started to tell me that she completely understands why we went NC, and that she hoped I didn't imagine it was all happy families getting on fine without us, because it isn't.

I think at that point I realised I had moved on with my life. When it all first happened I was so angry, I would have jumped at the chance to hear about my IL's continuing problems, almost to prove once and for all it wasn't us but was them, if that makes sense. But when my SIL told me that I felt sad for her that she's still stuck in the middle of it, and then that actually I didn't want to know the details because I didn't want to get involved on any level at all - I didn't want to know anything about them, good or bad.

That link is one of the couple of things I read that really "enlightenened" me. But I didn't bookmark and couldn't find it again. Thanks woodland I can bookmark it now and reread now and again.

My main struggle with NC is how to manage it with the DCs. DD2 doesn't remember them at all, which is sad I suppose but is also a blessing because she was the overlooked one and would no doubt have become the scapegoat. DD1 was the favourite, and helping her through it has been particularly hard, compounded by her own personality (and suspected ASD). She has diagnosed anxiety...hard to say if it is a result of the situation or if the situation just exacerbated it. But she really was in an awful state over it, and over time a lot of things began to come out. I can't believe some of the stuff my mum was saying to a (at the time) 4/5/6 year old. I ended up with a 7 year old who would tell me she hated me and wanted to kill herself.

The worst thing is that I had gone through the same as a child and of course my mum handled it terribly and I had some awful symptoms of stress, all ignored. So watching DD1 go through the same was triggering me, at the same time as I was trying to cope with my own feelings, and trying to help DD1 as well. It is a blur now. I am not sure how I got through it. But I got DD1 help, we are still in the process of assessment. I had to face myself head on and look at my parenting and make sure I wasn't repeating the cycle. In the end I figured out that DD1 needs parented differently anyway, so I had to implement a lot of changes in our routine and general life.

My point is that going NC is life changing. It is major upheaval for the whole family, and it can affect things in ways you might not even realise until further down the line. So be kind to yourself. Seek out support. Don't underestimate it, or feel like you should be able to cope...your feelings are real and valid and you may need help to come to terms with them.

yes the children. my eldest two went to see them at christmas, it was their choice. i didnt take them, husband did.
that link is so true to life its scary. we did assume that they would try and change if they could see they were causing us hurt, but they just couldnt becuase they know best. they are the best family ever, how dare we break away. its like some kind of gang/ cult. you only leave when you are told you can leave.
Husband has been in counselling for a year and a half and still cant bring himself to make the final cut due to fear and anxiety. ptsd has been mentioned. is that where you have flashbacks? if i can give you examples, can you tell me if this is what it is. Eg, we go away for a weekend and my instant gut subconscious tells me "we havent told them we are going away. we have to tell them. they wont like it". we get another car "we have to tell them we are thinking of getting a new car. we must run through all the options with them and involve them/ let them decide otherwise they will get annoyed". same with cvhanging carpets, painting the walls, etc etc. i get that instant "we have to tell them beforehand so they are fully involved" and then this teenage feeling of "hee hee, we are going behind their backs. they dont know what we are up to. arent we sneaky". is that ptsd?

Hi all, I've been lurking but thought I'd better show myself! This thread really resonates, I've just asked my parents for some space until they are capable of a rational discussion. We didn't go to theirs for Boxing Day as usual due to only having DD (5) at home on that day so we wanted a quiet Christmas at home. They then took this out on DSis who, as a direct result of their unreasonable behaviour, decided not to visit them on Boxing Day. Since then we have been sent a telling off, which they shared with extended family. Apparently they are heart broken, never been so hurt in their lives, DM will never recover. We'd never even exchanged a cross word prior to receiving these messages, all I did 'wrong' was put my own family first. DF sent an essay full of guilt trips, it was just awful and I can't take it from them any more. It's not even a choice that I've made, it feels absolutely necessary to create distance.

wizzywig I can totally relate to what you've just said! I am so used to involving my parents in all of my decisions and if I do something without discussing it first they are clearly hurt! I constantly catch myself feeling guilty for doing things without first running it by them!?

luke173ministries.org/templates/System/details.asp?id=39548&PID=466829
oh crap. this is so true. when my kids went to stay with them, my inlaws had a set plan that they wanted to do stuff with the kids that they wanted to do. they have never liked how we bring up the kids and believe they know best. they also used to ask what they wanted for birthdays and christmas and then ignore what i would tell them and get what they thought was suitable. its all part of the control isnt it?

Feels like we live in a mafia family.

Oh my god, THIS!!!!!!!!!

We lived in a mafia family, and my mother was the Don.

I have a billion things I could write on this. All my family are toxic.

The first stage was relief, when I found out about narcissism. So much made sense. I didn't feel crazy anymore. I knew it wasn't me!

However, how it came about, was just sheer luck. I didn't want to see any of them again, but how do you do that? You can't cut your own mother out, can you?

Basically, they did something awful (yet again) and I finally stood up for myself. This led to a horrific argument - cue - not seeing them again! An excellent reason to go NC (even though to them it was only one argument).

For me it was the icing on a big fat cake of crap, over 30 years.

Anyways. Me being me, I thought I could help them/change them offer them a reason why I wanted NC. Maybe they would say sorry, tell me they didn't know how much hurt they'd caused, tell me they would change, because they loved me. Naah. That didn't happen. They went mental.

How dare I treat them like this! How dare I say they had done anything wrong, after all they had done for me! Clothed me, fed me, brought me up!

The nastiness that poured out of them after was horrible. I now know this to be the case down to they were losing control. They spread nasty lies about me and DH. So I said, that's that. Bye Bye.

THEN comes the did I do the right thing/did I really just cut out my whole family/they were nasty weren't they? Self doubt. Guilt. What actually helped was talking to DH over and over again about what they said, what they did. Going over the shit made me realise they were absolute bastards who know they are.

Also, the reason we feel so guilty is we have something they lack: empathy.

I still get contact from them emails/letters. I still bump into them in town. I HATE it. But, we manage. I do not engage in any contact whatsoever. She still has the ability to press the exact button that hurts me. Bitch.

DH reads my mail and emails and lets me know if anything important, other wise he deals with it for me. Or I end up with nightmares/shit stirred up again.

You're not the bitch wizzy, trust me. The whole situation is horrid, and I'm sorry you're going through it. But please see it through. Life is too short for the toxic evil people to be in it.

Best thing we ever did was leave the mafia family.

Good luck x

I am starting to feel stronger

Hooray for us survivors who have survived the storm. I'm washed out! Anyone else exhausted by it all?

this is such an interesting read , so many experiences of families not being what you imagine they should be .
im the scapegoat, my sister is golden child , my so called mother (scm) uses narc behaviour, my father is an enabler.
Im nearly 50 , happily married ,parent of two children under 10 , and have a good career in mental health. But my scm would have anybody believe i was a dangerous person who has fooled everyone into believing Im not iyswim.
I now recognize that i was abused by my scm which resulted in extreme anxiety and depression as a teenager which meant i used anger ..... this was perfect for them as the could poke , prod , provoke until i reacted and they could sit smugly and say ..... see what we mean , shes crazy.

Things improved for me when i left home , never any police , drugs , criminal record but i did start counselling aged 20 to try and understand my experiences . i was still in contact until 2 years ago ...... trying to fix things , proving i was ok ...... got an honours degree, solid friendships, approved as a foster carer and then had 1 bi child and adopted second child, sucessful relationship etc but still any events were ruined by snide comments , passive aggressive behaviour and just no maternal warmth to me . and that really hurt .

i went into counselling again 2 years ago and stopped contact . they escalated their behaviour and have spent 2 years spreading (very obvious) lies and rumours about me , my immediate family, to wider family members who have contacted me to ask what is going on ....... this has been a revelation as wheras before only i was aware as everything was directed quietly to me. when i stopped reacting they have exposed themselves to others ( who have been really shocked ).

its been classic escalation of behaviour when i refused to react , and they have tried everything , including calling social services to say they are concerned about children not being allowed to see them and this must mean i am mentally ill and they are at risk .........our adoption social worker was fully in the picture so nothing happened...... but it could have resulted in us losing our second lovely baby.

It has been a hell of a two years , I started the process of nc by sending an email declining a family event as i did not choose to spend my time with people who did not like me ( they had said this) or put my children in a position to see their parent being spoken to in a way that isn't acceptable. They , its mostly my sister and scm, deny any wrong doing despite evidence saying otherwise.

to be honest it has been at times hell , and without counselling , support from good friends, partner , and the great love of my children i have now reached a place where i dont care if i don't see or hear from them again ..... i dont hate them , i feel regret that i don't belong in a different family who i can enjoy being with , but i know i tried very very hard and nothing changed things until i started ignoring them and their attempts

i can now say i am happy and have had one of the best xmas because i wasnt in any tense situations. It has been a roller coaster with many lows but now , at the moment , i wouldnt change what i have done. i am happy.

twoblueskies you sound very strong. Glad you are in a place of happiness

With the letting them know thing, reminded me I had to pick something up for parents long time ago. The shop in question closed at midday. We were going away and ended up leaving late. I realised we wouldn't make it to collect the items. I literally had a panic attack, DH was like

I kept saying 'he won't understand, he'll say he knew he shouldn't have relied on me, I've fucked up again, I'm always fucking up, always running late' DH calmed me down, but it was ingrained in me to panic at their reaction when they found out. When you think about it, someone retired, off every day - yet asks me to collect something on the day of our holiday, knowing we would be running around like idiots. Setting me up for a fail - so I'd feel like a failure - and they'd swoop in a save the day.

Running everything by them, getting a car, new kitchen, a 2nd child...the list goes on. That level of control is abuse.

It will get better, it will get easier. Eventually you'll be able to do anything without a trigger.

We were lucky though, as DS1 witnessed the argument and decided they were mentally unstable and didn't want to see them again, which makes life easier. The other 2 were too young. I wouldn't cope if kids still wanted to see them.

coming from such a 'loving, close family' - haha, yes, that's what we were told!

I find that DH and I have a discussion about it around major events, and that clears the system somewhat. But the further I move away from the memories, the more objectively I can see the situation, and see how batshit they really are.

So true toasty, this is what we do too x

honestly the link that woodlandwander sent is brilliant. there are loads of other links in it aswell. one that hit a chord with me was the 'conversations' my fil would have with me about obscure stuff or topics that only he would know about. whatever i would respond with would be ignored and he would carry on with his view being the correct one. i thought it was odd, but thats it. there was also never any recognition or verbal support given to me when i was studying. and i just thought, were they actually jealous that i have reached a higher level of education than them? they have always thought of themselves as a cut above everyone else and so much more smarter and cultured than anyone else. were these digs at me and the attempts to make me look stupid a way to put me in my place?

i also hadnt realised that along with that he would make remarks such as "oh are you pregnant again?" when i put on weight and enjoying pointing out my bad skin. again where these done to belittle me? if anyone said anything to him, he would be "what? im only joking, you lot need to get a sense of humour"

One more thing, I don't agree with the forgiveness thing. They haven't said sorry.

I'm not bitter or twisted, nothing is eating me up, I don't need to forgive someone who isn't sorry.

They left me in hell at one point, without wishing to give too much detail, and I suffered for longer than I should have at the hands of someone just like them but worse. No one deserves forgiveness for that.

I left home at 15, and gave up my education for a job to pay rent. No one deserves forgiveness for that.

My children will never ever go through what I went through, and if I ever fuck up, I'll be begging my children for forgiveness and a chance to make it right.

God wizzy, it sounds so similar! Yes to education. Can't be better than them, can't do better than them.

Biggest shock was realising they were at their happiest when I was doing really badly. Any improvements, and the nastiness cranked up.

Yes to weight and skin belittling. It's awful. Then when you say anything back, it was only a joke! So you look like the sensitive one without any humour.