ExH wants more access than I want to give

[SuiteHarmony]

I name-changed a few weeks back ....

I am having a 'family conference' with exH soon to discuss the children, and I am anxious and concerned about how it will go.

I was a SAHM since my eldest was born in 2006. Four kids. I asked H to leave when I found out about his affair in 2014.

At that time, we arranged access 3/14 days, being every second Fri-Mon.

Since early this year, I got a job, and an au pair.

Access is now 4/14, every second Fri-Tues. As H has long holidays (think university terms) he also has approx 5x7 days additional exclusive access.

He wants more. As my children are all 10 and under (youngest is 3), I don't feel that increased overnights are appropriate. I admit that this is tied up with the fact that I feel I have relinquished a huge amount of time with my children due to his selfishness and stupidity.

The job I have enables me to do school drop-offs every morning, and be home by 3.30/4 most days. His doesn't (self-employed).

By choice, I spend my kid nights with the kids. By choice, he would still go out 2/4 of his contact nights.

I have no idea how to communicate in a reasonable way that I have lost enough, and don't want to give more. And that I genuinely feel the kids would have a better outcome from the stability and time I provide. Plus I reared them pretty much single-handedly in the early, demanding years and feel I know them better and they need me more.

I don't know what to do.

Actually, it does feel like he's doing it to piss you off. Or he'd respect your negative answer, he'd have given more advanced warning and he'd have respected your time alone with them.
Stick to your guns. You have a right to your own space. He can take them to his. Sadly, it comes with being separated.

The truth of the matter is that as long as he doesn't have the arrangement that he wants: 50/50 he will always feel it is his right to encroach on your time with them.

I think that you need to be clear about separate times = separate times and maybe consider 50/50. It does work and it puts you on an equal footing when it comes to this because I'm guessing he wouldn't countenance you turning up at his house.

Good luck OP I know how terribly hard this is but at the end of the day one has to strive for fairness.

Oh, don't engage in discussions.
You said no to breakfast, let him rant. You don't have to explain yourself further.
He'll soon realise that he's not getting to you and stop.
Speaking from bitter experience.

I think you need to stop having your Ex in your home. He has the DC 100% in his time and you 100% in your time.

When don't you go back to the drawing board and do alternate weekends plus he has them every Wed from 3pm overnight term time and share school hold 50/50?

He is being unreasonable expecting to dip into family life when it suits him. The current set up doesn't work for you so it needs to change.

throwingpebbles
In the words of a (highly esteemed) family judge I know, any judge who orders 50/50 is intellectually deficient and has forgotten about the needs of the children and is instead going for the easy option of "fairness" for the parents.

I would hope that any judge with such a clear prejudice is removed from the system.

RandomMess
I think you need to stop having your Ex in your home. He has the DC 100% in his time and you 100% in your time.

Isn't this what he is asking for?

Erm no he wants to spend time with the DC in the ops home as well but not include it as "his" time.

I just think the boundaries are very blurred. Op needs to accept that her ex wants more contact and let it happen but also stop letting her ex have extra contact in her home because it's not working from her point of view.

RandomMess

I see lots of "ad hoc" contact because the OP does/didn't want to give him more.

Also, maybe the contact has had a non committal element because he doesn't want to be in his ex's house.

Wow that's controlling. He got more time yet a few hours later he's insisting on having more adhoc time to inconvenience you? Sod that.

I don't see it as controlling. I see it as a dad who wants to be in his children's lives more than once a fortnight. Annoying yes, but he's having to take crumbs where he can get them.

Thing is, I am not seeing anywhere that OP has put restrictions on holiday contact - she said that dad sees them a lot in the holidays and she feels short-changed. So the answer is to negotiate a fixed agreement because the boundaries are blurred. How can they not be if he is taking DC out every day from their mum's house and inviting himself to breakfast? That sounds to me like a man who is not really accepting his marriage is over and that he cannot just come and go as he pleases. Plus OP suggests her ex is quite happy to play happy families, boney and she finds it awkward. Three missed calls, texts and phone calls in response to 'no' is harassment, whichever way you want to explain it.

I read somewhere that 50:50 is not good for children, which seems intuitively true to me. Children need one main home. I don't understand why parents fight for 50:50 when it is not in the interests of their children. Children are not a cake to be divided in half. Perhaps you could speak to your ex about this on this issue. I think ferrying around 4 young children around constantly is not really good for them; perhaps your ex would agree if he understood this? (Some won't and just demand 50:50 on 'bitter principle'). You could even put this to the family conference? Parents who see their children even once a fortnight can have an enormous impact on them for the positive - I wish non-residential parents understood this .

^ P.S. Sorry, didn't comment on the bigger picture e.g. your ex not wanting marriage to be over (?) but I did just want to make a point re. 50:50.

For clarity, ex remains in the affair relationship. They do not live together. She has not met the children. He did make attempts to reconcile, all of which I did not contemplate, in the first year, but after a monumental blowout last year, accepts that the marriage is over. It is the management of the coparenting that is the issue. I felt like the bad guy last night, and I felt harassed. The three choices I felt I had were:

• have him here for breakfast with my teeth gritted again
• let him in then go to the supermarket or out for a walk or run on my own - not what I'd like to be doing on my rare Friday off
• say no and have to explain why, defend, justify.

Thank you again for all comments.

I hope you can find a contact pattern that works for both of you and then stop all this ad hoc popping in as that is clearly not good for you!

I know you have agreed something different from Feb I think it was but perhaps you can email him and said after his behaviour that you think there needs to be a different way forward.

It would be good for you to have the same week night "off" every week so you can do something with it and it also means that there isn't a huge break in them seeing their Dad.

Thank you for all your kind and thoughtful replies, RandomMess

You do have a fourth choice.

• no, that will not work for me. (And no further replies or explanations)

I agree that it might work better for you all if he has the kids one night every week (for now, perhaps more later) and has them EOW.
Thats the arrangement I have with my ex husband.
It means they seem him every week and you can use that time to do sth regular, like an evening class etc.
I think the arrangement you agreed sounds like a long time for you to go without seeing the DCs when they are used to having you around a lot.
My ex is also very good at negotiating and pushing boundaries so I really sympathise....Stick to your guns, I think better not to have him around in your home if he is that way inclined tbh.

I agree that his contact with the children needs to take place without your involvement, for e.g. If he wanted to see them at breakfast and that was acceptable to you then he could take them out for breakfast. Equally you shouldn't have to leave your home for him to see the children.

If I have read correctly you have come to some agreement for future visits, I know it's hard but you will get used to the routine and hopefully enjoy having more 'you' time.

I'm in a similar situation and have recently been taking advice from a solicitor.

ExH currently has 2 nights a week and one additional school pick-up and drops DD (5) back off after tea. We've had the same arrangement since she was 2 but he now wants 50:50.

We're similar to OP in the fact that my work is mostly home-based so I am available for all school pick ups and drop offs but his work doesn't.

The advice I've received is not that the courts use 50:50 as a starting point, but that all children have a right to a relationship with both parents and arrangements have to be in the BEST interests of the children.

Wrap around care, childcare, babysitters when parents go out at night or have to work are absolutely fine where they are needed but why SHOULD OP's kids have to do this more just so their dad gets 50:50 when they have a mum at home who wants to provide that care? Their dad's arrangements are fine and all well and good but their mum's are better - so this is in their best interests surely.

The best thing for kids is time with their parents - either parent! OP is the one who has been able to provide this more consistently all their lives so far.

Just because he is an equal parent and is their father, it doesn't mean their time should be divided equally between two homes when the care they receive at one place is more consistent.

FWIW although my DD does spend the lion's share of the week with me, she has a great relationship with her dad and refers to both places as her home and loves us both equally. She also likes her home comforts and as I have always been her primary carer, she wants to come home to me if she is poorly and knows that she 'lives' with me.

She doesn't need to be shipped to her dad's house for that extra 1. however many days to ensure she has an equal relationship with both of us.

If OP's kids are happy and they have a good relationship with their dad and get to spend quality time both parents, any changes to this are surely just for his benefit.

Unless any of the children are actually saying they want to spend more time with dad and are asking for this?

The only thing I can see wrong with this arrangement is possibly the length of time between contact - it might be worth changing it 2 nights every week or 1 night one week and 3 the next to it feels more regular for him and them.

Although necessary, over night stays midweek with school clubs, uniforms, homework etc can be hard work logistically, no matter how close together you live - and with 4 kids it must be a nightmare. Not every family can afford to have all of these things at both houses.

Also OP, I agree with you, he made the choice, he had the affair and exited family life. Yes, the kids should absolutely still spend time with him but why should everybody deal with all the upheaval just so he gets a fair quota.

Stick to your guns OP.

I work part time, five days a week. I do all school drop offs but do not finish in time to do pickups. I have a live in au pair. So I'm not at home all the time. During school holidays I encourage extra involvement from exdh as his holidays are usually concurrent, and I agree it is better generally that they are with A/either parent if the alternative is childcare.

Just wanted to correct in case I had given the impression I was now at home full time (which I was until ten months ago).

SuiteHarmony

But your au pair is child care, how would that be different to his parents, childminder or afterschool club?

Sorry OP, I didn't read the last page for some reason. I also had an issue with 'adhoc' additional time and feeling unable to say no to requests for extra visits.

I was encouraged by my solicitor to set my boundaries and give set times in writing if necessary. I was told that if ExH didn't like it, he could then challenge it legally but if I could show I was being reasonable and offering a timetable I thought was in the best interests of DD not myself, and I was also taking into account half holiday times and alternate Christmases it would stand me in good stead and would be unlikely to be changed.

Just because you made an agreement for things to change in February, you don't have to stick to that. You can state your terms and if he wants to he can challenge it formally.

But your au pair is child care, how would that be different to his parents, childminder or afterschool club?

Not sure I understand this point? The au pair suits both our needs as working parents. She goes to his apartment on his contact days. But if he or I are off (he has about 13 weeks off a year, I have 8% of hours worked), I believe it is best that either parent steps in. Now, he is of course entitled to spend his free time as he wishes, and the arrangement I described in my original post fits in with his preferences.

^^ that reply was to Boney. I wasn't sure if I had suggested my au pair was not childcare: she is and I view her as such, as she is not Mum or dad. I just didn't want you to pick me up wrong.

would he be able to arrange to do pickups? then he can make a start on their homework etc and then drop them off once you're home (unless it's his overnight)?

it's crazy to say out loud but in these situations, even 'ad hoc' has to have some consistency

SuiteHarmony

So if you both use the au pair, the issue is with the ad hoc visits, which you both didn't like and he wants to solve by getting more contact.

and solving the issue put forward by broodybrooder and others about him being in the house.

I am at a stage where I am not sure what the problem with him actually is.