Marriage imploding but I desperately want it to survive

[Deflatedhusband]

First time on MN. A married dad (early 40s, 3DC - 11, 8, 5) who has known DW for 15 years and been married for 13.

The punchline is on Sunday evening she told me she was desperately unhappy in the marriage and wanted out. It came as a complete shock to me in some ways but in hindsight we had been having a very tough time in recent years.

Marriage has become functional, basically all about the kids, no romance. We both love each other dearly (I certainly love her and I think she still loves me) but she says there is an emotional void and she doesn't think the marriage can ever meet it. She said she had been suicidal frequently in recent months. She has suffered from
Depression but she said the suicidial thoughts were more driven by the emptiness and loneliness.

I fee awful. I feel that I have let her down massively and have been blind to her needs. I think (and she has said so) that I am a hard working, reliable husband and loving dad but I have clearly fallen well short on the emotional support for DW and I am devastated that I have let her get to such a state. She has repressed a lot in recent years and now it has spilled out.

One added complication is that it appears now that she has developed an intense online relationship with a man in another country (where she is from originally). We share the same computer and on Monday evening I logged on to check my email and her account was open. I casually looked at it as I was shutting the page and there were loads of email of a very graphic detail from a man I had never heard of before.

I was stunned and quickly scanned some of them to find pretty much pornographic language of what they wanted to do to each other and it sounded like they had been sexting etc.

My wife is a refined Cambridge postgrad and this guy appears to be a very working class tattooed chap. Someone I would have never expected her to go for. But I guess I have let her emotional tank run dry and this guy is filling it.

She also had booked a flight to go see him.

After I pulled myself together late on Monday I asked her if there was anyone else and she completely denied it. I then asked her about this guy (naming him). She was pretty unrepentant and said she had met him online and he was filling a void but she would never actually want to be with him.

Up until this point she and I have known each other's password and pins - that has now all changed. At least she has changed hers. I know they are still in contact and that is killing me, even though I brought this on myself by my failure as a husband.

I asked her if she would do marriage counselling and she said she would so hopefully we can pull back from the each. She has cancelled the flight (I think) which is something.

The thing is I really love her and I am devastated I have let her down. I want us to work and repair, even if it takes a long time. I don't know where she is at. She had always been a little dubous when it comes to the compete truth. I am not sure if the counselling is just a ploy to give her time to sort out leaving.

I really hope it isn't. We are still in the same house, things are surprisingly civil and cordial, and the kids have no idea.

I am not sure why I am here really. I have nowhere to turn I suppose. Does anyone have any advice?

Thanks for listening.

One thing I haven't mentioned is that early in our marriage (just before kids) we did cheat on me once (on what I understand was a one-off) by hooking up with an ex for a night. We were having a tough patch at that time but nothing more than finding our feet in a newish marriage.

That was a shock when I found out (from a mutual friend) but she said she was sorry and we worked through it. And I am pretty sure they never were in touch again after that.

I guess one of my concerns here is that the track record is one of looking for fulfilment outside the marriage when times get tough.

Thanks Jeff. Things were generally better pre kids. She did work and enjoyed it a lot. It didn't pay much so it was costing more for a childminder than she was bringing home. She did it for sanity but once the third child came along it became to hard to pull off.

She has always been a free spirit and I think she feels like she has lost that in the marriage and lost her identity. She still thinks of herself as a care free 20 something but then looks in the mirror and sees an older woman who is trapped in a loveless marriage.

I'm sorry but I can't see any way you're ever getting back from this. You've done everything you can. This must be awful for your kids. Draw a line and tell her to move out. You've forgiven her once in the past and you've been prepared to again and she's neither respected you nor cared for you enough to make the effort. There are better people out there. Move out, heal yourself and give your children emotional support and stability. Then in good time you'll meet someone worthy of your love.

Deflated, she is takin the piss out of you and you are lettting her. Stand up for yourself and take some of the advice on here or else she will continue doing it!!

You're kind of stuck.

As long as she doesn't meet him he remains her perfect fantasy - and you're the bad guy for preventing her meeting her 'love'. I suspect the reality of him would bring her down to earth with a bump.

Either she realises she's been an idiot as soon as she meets him, or they have an affair and she realises she's been an idiot after 6 months.

If she does meet him a line has been crossed that may/will be unfixable.

But if she doesn't meet him, continues to idealise him and to communicate with him the marriage will be unfixable anyway.

A pp said she thought DW sounds a bit immature. I have to agree. You're almost the father figure forbidding her to see her young man. She's not a free-spirited 20something, she's a grown woman messing up her life. It's not your responsibility to hold her in check.

If she's lost herself in marriage and children she needs to find herself again. Herself - not someone else.

Ahh. That does explain a lot. It does sound like she is trying to fill an emotional void with this guy. And I agree that a track record of bringing other people into your marriage when things get tough isn't a good sign at all.

I think everyone goes through the though process at some point or another things where things have changed and we get frustrated and wish our situations were different, she should have spoken to you about it though and asked for support. Her actions are completely selfish. I really feel for you OP.

It's emotional blackmail for her to say you weren't there when she needed you, now this guy is and you still aren't up to the job. You probably weren't the perfect partner to her, but the blame for the EA lays firmly at her door. She chose that.

She needs to have responsibility for her actions and to realise her happiness doesn't solely depend on a man facilitating it, be it you or Mr Internet. A marriage should be a partnership with care and consideration and love for each other. It doesn't sound like there's much of that from her to you, she still seems very consumed by her own needs.

LR, I think she knows well that if she met the guy it wouldn't last - they come from such different worlds. But the fantasy of him is still there and I don't know how it goes away. I am not sure I can trust her on this.

Today has been a tough day. I am supposed to be Christmas shopping on a day off but it's been hard to focus onthat. Typing on this thread has really made me realise how bad things are. I obviously knew things were broken before today but putting words into writing really presses it home.

Op if your wife spent as much time communicating with you and not some sticking plaster she'd met on line you might not be in this mess. She could have told you she needed more affection, intamacy, whatever she felt she needed.

You might well be able to get this back on track for now, but at some point you will have to deal with her ea and you might see things differently when toure not so shocked.

What was she going to do, go and see this man alone of had she booked a flight for the dc? When was she intending to go?

Idont, the planned trip was back in October for half term. She was going to leave the DC at her mum's on that visit and then do another flight to see her new man. She did go to see her mum and cancelled the other flight. I skyped everyday with her and the kids she was at her mum's.

Hmm. This sounds a lot more like "mid life crisis" than "trying to fill an emotional void".

She's bored, basically. If I were you I'd stop tiptoeing around her and start being a bit more forceful (I don't mean nasty, just up front about what you won't put up with).

Agree with a pp that you need somehow not to be the boring father figure telling her to give up her plaything. You need to show her she is currently the bad guy here, not the victim. Ask her how she'd feel if you were doing what she's doing. Ask her how she'd feel if your 11 year old got married and their spouse did this to them.

The good news is that when you point blank told her to cancel the flight - she did. That shows that when push comes to shove she does prioritise you and the family. Now you need to tell her to point blank stop contact with him. (Although if there is no trust... how do you know she has stopped).

I think she needs something else to focus on. Does she have any plans to go back to work? Or is there a project or trip she's always wanted to do?

It sounds to me like she is very very resentful and angry and using this other man as a way of punishing you. She's trying to make you feel as bad as she feels/has felt. It's a really self destructive way of dealing with this situation - it's common for depressed people to engage in self-destructive behaviour.

You have to put your foot down and say that you understand she's angry and hurt but she can't treat you like this. She either needs to stop communicating with this guy or leave. The situation has to be brought to a head.

I can't help but think you and the children would be so much more happy if you two separated.

I would stop the couples counselling, start your own counselling and spend time thinking about the next chapter of your life. Is an au pair or reduced hours something you could consider? If there's only one adult to support you may be able to survive on fewer hours for a few years.

Also, seek legal advice.

Of course this other man seems like an escape, he doesn't interact with any of the pressures of real life. The 'relationship' is a pure fantasy outlet. So long as she relies on it she is not giving herself the chance to create a functioning relationship in real life, or the chance to take responsibility for her own wellbeing.

I highly doubt this man is who he claims to be. People use fake photos, or lie in video chat. He may have countless women online like your wife, not to mention his wife in real life. Of course it could never come to anything with him. You need to give your wife a clear choice. She could leave, divorce you and then decide whether to take a chance on him but at her own risk. She could cut off all contact with him and try to make things work with you, but it doesn't sound like she has much hope in that option and you may not feel able to go with it either.

Currently she is basically saying to you that she does not believe your relationship with her can meet her needs, and she will be continuing to undermine it, while you run around trying to bail out a boat that is taking on water.

Most important thing......Do whatever it takes to make sure that she doesn't take your children out of the country.

Your wife has already checked out mentally and has one foot out the marital door.

As a SAHM, she has much to lose in a divorce so I'm not surprised she's wanting to stay with you whilst keeping in touch with this man. If you divorce, even with a settlement and CM, the chances are she'd have to return to work at some point and that she'd be much less well off financially. That her 'standard of living' might suffer. Right now she's having her cake and eating it too, isn't she?

TBH, I think you should schedule an appointment on your own with the counselor and speak to him/her on your own about her continuing relationship and why you feel you need to put up with it.

I think if OP was a woman then so many here would have said leave by now. Both people need to work to keep a marriage together and you both drifted apart and thats not just one persons fault. However, she is still messaging the other man and its time to realise that doing so, and knowing you know, is basically cuckolding you regardless of what is happening in counselling.

She is not really changing so its time to leave.

Very good point about the kids being taken out of the country. I think that it would be a good idea to see a solictor to make sure that the legal things are in place so that she cannot just spirit them away.

Then deliver the ultimatum. you really have to do that.

Hi, I remember this thread, I'm sorry for what you're going through.

I think you need to step back from being the person who is asking her to stop talking to him/seeing him. It will only add to her resentment.

She is the one who needs to make that choice. So she needs an ultimatum: you or him. And if she chooses to keep in contact the marriage is over.

It's only when she's faced with losing everything that her life will come into focus. At the moment she's in lalaland thinking she can have everything.

Stop allowing her to manipulating you with all this talk of how you haven't emotionally supported her. You've seen the messages, they are pornographic in nature. It's not about emotional support, it's standard run of the mill dirty cheaters talk.

Thank you for all the clear and helpful advice. I think I will get Christmas behind us before presenting the ultimatum. I have been running away from it because I feared pushing her away but I am now seeing that without it I am in many ways being taken for a fool and being walked all over. It's also too emotionally painful to live in this limbo for much longer.

Try reading these and see if anything flags up for you about her behaviour. The sad fact is that all cheaters basically act the same. Denial, justification, gaslighting, history rewriting and victimization. They may not follow in the same order but they all do and say the same things, whilst all thinking that they are being so unique and different.....

www.infidelityhelpgroup.com/2014/01/31/rewriting-history/

www.emotionalaffair.org/the-cheating-spouse-follows-a-script/

And lastly, the second post in this MN thread.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/1634754-Men-affairs-what-is-the-script

Thanks. These are frighteningly close to home unfortunately. Ugh.

I had a feeling they would be. Sorry.

But at least now you know what you are dealing with, and that puts you in a better position. Hearing what she says and seeing past the words to what she is really saying/doing will help you see how she is trying to manipulate you. Knowledge is power and all that.

This is a good article about why your wife wants to keep you and him going at the same time.

www.chumplady.com/2012/04/the-unified-theory-of-cake/

Yes I think you should get through Christmas first.

You also need to get yourself emotionally to the place where you can give the ultimatum and mean it. Paradoxically, being prepared to walk away is the only way to save the marriage.

Of course it might not work. But if it doesn't at least you know where you stand and you can protect yourself.

I coming back on to the thread post-Christmas/new year but more because I am just numb and have nowhere to turn.

We got through Christmas just about ok. Had a nice time for the kids and saw some relatives but generally low key. We were pleasant and affirming to each other - lots of "I love you" and hugs.

Interspersed in that were some very emotional conversations where I said I felt like I was of less consequence to her than the guy with whom she has been having an online affair for four months.

As suggested by a number of poster here I finally had the "ultimatum" conversation in the middle of last week - where I told her the marriage had no chance of being rebuilt if this other guy was a constant presence and that she had to stop communicating with him or we couldn't repair.

She said she would stop communicating as it was hurting me and also because she needed to clear her head. That was Tuesday but on Wednesday she had revisited that line to saying she wouldn't communicate with him for four weeks as it was too painful to do a final goodbye! Honestly.

However not even this four week affair-free timetable has lasted more than a day or two. She is pretty hopeless about logging out properly of messaging etc and accidentally left an account open in our shared PC. On Friday night she sent him a message saying that she really missed him and so wanted to make love to him.

So there you have it. I haven't had the strength to have a proper conversation with her about it and we have had a lot of things on. Hoping to do it tomorrow evening but I am just so sad and broken that I can't really even think about doing it.

How bloody awful for you and how fucking shitty is she?
You know what you need to know.
Heartbreaking as it is.
She needs to understand the loss of you and the sooner the better.
I'd be packing myself a bag right now and leaving.
I'm so sorry you are going through.
She is a c*nt of the highest order and you can and will do so much better than this disrespectful shit of a person.

Take that control and get gone.
Sort out contact arrangements once you have left.
Starting point is 50:50.
Take it from there.